Goodbye remjet, hello AHU?!

[Joerg Polzfusz]

Hi!

Is Kodak really going to replace the remjet with an AHU on all Vision3 films?

https://kosmofoto.com/2025/06/eastman-kodak-replacing-remjet-layer-from-vision3-cinema-films/

[Tyler Purcell]

Not replace, remove. 

Yes there have been multiple other threads about this. They are still making remjet film for now, but it will probably cease production at some point. 

[Karim D. Ghantous]

This is a great idea. People will be able to buy movie film for bulk loaders, for use in SLR cameras, and not worry about where to process it. It could mean that colour photography will be noticeably cheaper. 

[David Mullen ASC]

It will mean though that all the people who shoot Cinestill film for that red halation around lights (because of the removal of remjet so no anti-halation backing) will be unable to get that effect anymore.

[Gautam Valluri]

Any other issues to be expected from the removal of the remjet layer?

For example, there have been many discussions here about how some chrome-plated pressure plates in some Aatons and Arriflex cameras have presented issues with B&W Double-X film. Will this be an issue with this proposed non-remjet colour stocks?

[Uli Meyer]

Kodak told me that there are currently three feature films in production, using the new stock. One of those films is directed by Spielberg. There have been no reports of any problems. The development process remains the same, except less water to wash off the remjet layer. 

[Dirk DeJonghe]

We used three 1000ft rolls of this new remjet-less emulsion about 6 months ago and had no problems in an Arri 535B. If any, it looked very clean, it was still experimental and the curves were not yet perfect.

[Aapo Lettinen]

4 hours ago, Gautam Valluri said:

Any other issues to be expected from the removal of the remjet layer?

For example, there have been many discussions here about how some chrome-plated pressure plates in some Aatons and Arriflex cameras have presented issues with B&W Double-X film. Will this be an issue with this proposed non-remjet colour stocks?

Time will tell but if there is issues with the chrome plating I would just get the cameras modified. on 16mm this should be easy because most cameras don't have the film supported on the middle on the pressure plate and thus one could just blacken the surface without friction issues. Some cameras could probably be blackened with a black permanent marker even as a temporary solution when waiting for a durable coating method to be applied?

making new pressure plates would be possible on most camera models. needs lots of experiments but most cameras don't have super complex pressure plates and quite many have separate plate behind the actual gate opening which would only need to be modified or changed instead of changing the whole large plate. Custom cnc making that small fingernail sized plate would not be the end of the world if only needing to do it one time in the history of mankind 🙂 

not sure how much the Aaton LTR/XTR pressure plate would cost to redesign and remake as a black version as never disassembled the mags but that should be doable too.

35mm cameras often have small-ish separate square pressure plate in the gate which actually pushes the film against the gate so likely there is not that large part which needs to be redesigned though in 35mm it is more common for the film supported some way in the middle of the frame so it is just not "empty cavity" like on some 16mm cameras but actually has a "support dot" or support rails in the middle of the frame, normally chromed but now needed to be black

[Lucas Xavier Simes]

8 hours ago, David Mullen ASC said:

It will mean though that all the people who shoot Cinestill film for that red halation around lights (because of the removal of remjet so no anti-halation backing) will be unable to get that effect anymore.

I would be shocked if Cinestill does not have a solution for this. That's the entire reason people shoot Cinestill, there is no other reason to buy a roll of film 2-3x the price of bulk loaded Vision3. Surely they are one of Kodak's larger clients, and are in talks with them?

[Aapo Lettinen]

3 hours ago, Lucas Xavier Simes said:

I would be shocked if Cinestill does not have a solution for this. That's the entire reason people shoot Cinestill, there is no other reason to buy a roll of film 2-3x the price of bulk loaded Vision3. Surely they are one of Kodak's larger clients, and are in talks with them?

one would get something like almost 200 of 36shot stills film rolls out of a single 1000ft 35mm movie film roll. Probably one would not be selling millions of those rolls at a time so would still be pretty small client for Kodak... selling something like from 18 000 to 35 000 of 36 shot rolls would be comparable to shooting one average smaller budget feature film on 35mm film (100 000 to 200 000ft of film). One charges for the cartridge and work of course when loading film for stills use and if purchasing cartridges loaded by Kodak they would of course get revenue from the packaging more than of the film stock itself

Edited June 3 by Aapo Lettinen

[Tyler Purcell]

6 hours ago, Uli Meyer said:

There have been no reports of any problems.

One of the films that shot with it, was really upset. I have heard several reports saying the expected results were outside of where they tested/expected. I also think those 3 big films, probably used black and white pressure plates, which are not chromed. 

We will be getting film shortly, but I'm waiting to do a test until we have a solution to the pressure plate situation. We have ideas, but it's going to be a chemical fix which we don't know will work yet. 

[Tyler Purcell]

5 hours ago, Aapo Lettinen said:

not sure how much the Aaton LTR/XTR pressure plate would cost to redesign and remake as a black version as never disassembled the mags but that should be doable too.

There is a chemical process that can strip the chrome off, but after that, creating a black and smooth surface is the hard part. We have done some testing with paint on bad plates, but haven't been able to polish enough to prevent scratching long-term. They really need that chrome surface. We're working on it, but please feel free to reach out if you have any ideas as well. We just want to come up with a generic and easy solution to modify the OG plates because machining new ones, where it may sound simple, the tolerances are challenging and costly due to the materials used. Removing the chrome and painting/polishing seems to be the best option thus far, but it's not working yet. 

[Jon O'Brien]

Arri SRs have a chrome pressure plate on the mags. Hopefully won't need to get that blackened and I have no idea how it could be done.

If Kodak really goes ahead with this with all their Vision 3 stocks I hope they maintain some remjet film manufacture for special order because I would definitely miss the halation around lights.

7 hours ago, Dirk DeJonghe said:

We used three 1000ft rolls of this new remjet-less emulsion about 6 months ago and had no problems in an Arri 535B. If any, it looked very clean, it was still experimental and the curves were not yet perfect.

Does the 535B have a chromed pressure plate?

Edited June 3 by Jon O'Brien

[Lucas Xavier Simes]

3 hours ago, Aapo Lettinen said:

one would get something like almost 200 of 36shot stills film rolls out of a single 1000ft 35mm movie film roll. Probably one would not be selling millions of those rolls at a time so would still be pretty small client for Kodak... selling something like from 18 000 to 35 000 of 36 shot rolls would be comparable to shooting one average smaller budget feature film on 35mm film (100 000 to 200 000ft of film). One charges for the cartridge and work of course when loading film for stills use and if purchasing cartridges loaded by Kodak they would of course get revenue from the packaging more than of the film stock itself

I don't know. You can find sizable amounts of Cinestill stocked in photo stores all over the world, it's one of the most popular brands of still film. Keep in mind they also produce similarly sized amounts of 120 film. I am not sure what their output is, but I would imagine it would be well above that amount. Cinestill has an office in Rochester due to how closely they work with Kodak.

[Tyler Purcell]

1 hour ago, Jon O'Brien said:

Arri SRs have a chrome pressure plate on the mags. Hopefully won't need to get that blackened and I have no idea how it could be done.

Yes, the SR's will have a major problem because the center is chrome and the outside is black, so you will see a literal square of reflective material that doesn't exist around the outside. The high speed cameras are 100% chrome. 

1 hour ago, Jon O'Brien said:

If Kodak really goes ahead with this with all their Vision 3 stocks I hope they maintain some remjet film manufacture for special order because I would definitely miss the halation around lights.

They will EVENTUALLY dump the remjet film, but for the time being they're still making it because they haven't released the new film as a finished product. IDK why because they do have lots of stock. Maybe they're wanting to continue testing? What I know is that halation will be worse IF you're pointing a light directly at the lens. In those rare situations, it can be problematic. I don't think it's a deal killer for MOST production, but it's something to think about. 

1 hour ago, Jon O'Brien said:

Does the 535B have a chromed pressure plate?

Yes, from my understanding the 235, 435, 535, Arricam's, moviecams, Panavision, Aaton's and likewise, pretty much every more modern 35mm camera, has a chromed pressure plate. Same goes for all the IMAX and 65mm cameras. So the problem is pretty vast. Arri did make special pressure plates for some of the cameras to deal with black and white film, but seeing as everyone is freaking out about this issue and so far the testing is pretty conclusive that black pressure plates DO solve the potential halation issues, the only real solution would be to coat the pressure plates black of pretty much every camera made. 

I have a feeling the reason Kodak hasn't just cut off production of the now older remjet film is simply because they're waiting to see how things go and if the industry can get things fixed fast enough. 

[Jon O'Brien]

Goodby Remjet, hello AHU,

There's no more halation, and ain't that true,

Seems so right, it can't be wrong,

Lovin' the film look ... all year long!

[Jon O'Brien]

3 hours ago, Tyler Purcell said:

Yes, the SR's will have a major problem because the center is chrome and the outside is black, so you will see a literal square of reflective material that doesn't exist around the outside.

Tyler you're a great one for instilling a sense of gloom about the Arriflex SR. Haha. And there's others here who do that too. Sigh.

Just imagine ... all might be fine with the Arri SR, and the little chrome rectangle on the pressure plates. If not, I will have to get someone to fix the problem. At least only the mag, maybe one at a time, can be sent off, and not the whole camera.

But I might contact Kodak, and point out that, hey, SRs have a little chrome rectangle on the pressure plate, narrower than the film frame, and see what they say.

[Karim D. Ghantous]

19 hours ago, David Mullen ASC said:

It will mean though that all the people who shoot Cinestill film for that red halation around lights (because of the removal of remjet so no anti-halation backing) will be unable to get that effect anymore.

CineStill is a scam. If it was cheap enough, perhaps it would be ok. But whenever I see people use it, I shake my head. It's anything but the 'Hollywood' look.

16 hours ago, Gautam Valluri said:

Any other issues to be expected from the removal of the remjet layer?

For example, there have been many discussions here about how some chrome-plated pressure plates in some Aatons and Arriflex cameras have presented issues with B&W Double-X film. Will this be an issue with this proposed non-remjet colour stocks?

Maybe a layer of graphite or something like that? Teflon maybe? Ceramic? I'm just thinking aloud. Maybe the surface could be pitted, like a golf ball. 

Just FYI:

https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/contax-rts-with-ceramic-film-pressure-plate-really.171245/

[Jon O'Brien]

Hmm, hadn't thought of ceramic. It's tough, and is applied with the help of some gadget dentists use, not sure what. Ceramic teeth can last decades and teeth are chomping away daily. Can you get a black ceramic? An Arri pressure plate, at least, being such fine tolerances, might need to be first polished back a bit to maintain the same height/pressure.

Edited June 4 by Jon O'Brien

[Tyler Purcell]

18 minutes ago, Jon O'Brien said:

Tyler you're a great one for instilling a sense of gloom about the Arriflex SR

Well, the issue is actually probably not as bad with the SR as other cameras. The Aaton's would have vertical lines off to one side. At least the square box in the middle, may not be that noticeable, but again only if you direct light straight at the camera would you sever see it. 

I like working on the SR's, they are well made and easy to work on cameras. I just don't like the fact every single sample I work on, has issues related to poor storage and wear and tear. I see a lot of Aaton's, they just don't fatigue as much, I rarely see a pechan prism go bad, but on SR's it's two or three a year. I've replaced 2 in the 4 years I've been doing service on Aaton's and probably a dozen on SR's. Heck, I've been lucky and been able to sometimes pull the pechan apart and clean it up, but you can't undo the glue on the critical section. It's really a nightmare to deal with.

Other than that, I do like them. I just prefer a more modern, lightweight and quieter camera system, but that's a preference and one that some people can't afford, so I get it. 

[Gautam Valluri]

I got hold a copy of this document from Kodak for anyone interested.

AHU_FilmMaker Talking points_05-20-25_Final[41][92][65].pdf

[Gautam Valluri]

Looks like bleach bypass on the new negatives will be tricky nigh pointless. Interesting that Spielberg & Kaminski are testing these stocks on their new film. Kaminski always does bleach bypass on the negs right? 

[Aapo Lettinen]

Just took photos of what exactly is the issue with the chrome plating and what would need to be changed.

Arri SR2 and Aaton LTR pressure plates. The Aaton stripes are rounded on both ends so it is not perfectly flat all the way. replicating would require replicating that special shape too. probably could be remade black colored if using enough money on it. The Arri has the center rectangle chrome part being the issue, otherwise should be fine as other film frame area is already painted black. the height of the rectangle compared to the side support bars is critical as Tyler noted earlier. if getting that rectangle black somehow without affecting its height compared to the rails it would be solved completely. I would probably try to just find out the exact thickness of the chrome plating if has originally, then stripping that away and applying the same thickness of some other dark grey or black stuff, would be the easiest way to maintain the tolerances.

I am not enough expert on metallurgy and coatings to say what kind of coating would work the best on these but they are metal and replicable after all, it just costs if needs to be good.

 

Edited June 4 by Aapo Lettinen

[Gautam Valluri]

@Aapo Lettinen do you happen to have any example stills of what the "ghost reflections" look like on these chrome pressure-plates when shot without the remjet layer?

[Tyler Purcell]

5 hours ago, Gautam Valluri said:

Looks like bleach bypass on the new negatives will be tricky nigh pointless

The emulsion is the same, so why would bleach bypass be different?