RED - A hoax?

Jaan Shenberger · April 25, 2006

really, i still don't understand why they're making their own lenses if it's PL mount.

that was actually the thing that made me think it was a hoax when i saw the first version of their website. it just seemed silly to start up a company and make such a engineering-intensive camera, and then on top of it, start making lenses good enough for 4k.

are there any advantages to using their own glass? or was that oakley dude already planning on making cine lenses or something? someone please ask if you are at the booth.

Mark Allen · April 25, 2006

really, i still don't understand why they're making their own lenses if it's PL mount.

Oakley - the company that made Jim Jannard all his money is an optics company - goggles, sunglasses, etc. So they have some opinions on optics.

He probably made a 300mm lense first 'cause that's what he felt was most missing from what he was happy with in the market.

Speculating.

April 25, 2006

Well, camera number 89 is mine.

Yes, I put down a deposit on this camera, tried to do it first thing in the morning (wanted a low number), but I couldn't get through and didn't get the call back until the afternoon.

What on Earth am I thinking?

Well... if I don't like what I see down the line or the competition is better, it's fully refundable. If I do - I want one and I probably won't want to wait. That simple. My basic logic was... if it's too good to be true - so good that people don't believe it's possible it could be made. I'd probably want one.

Side note: apparently that 300mm is a fixed lense... Odd. But sounds like they will be making other lense options. There are also lots of PL mount lenses out there.

congrats mark.

if the red is delivered in the next 12 months, we will certainly also add one to our inventory.

the design is.. hm... interesting. very futuristic. i would prefer a non-reflective body btw ;)

we had lots of discussions here yesterday in the studio. we switched from 35mm to HDCAM beginning 2001, almost completly done in 2003, and, even if we don´t think that 4k really makes sense for distribution (at least not in the next 5 years for 0.x-10 mio budgets) we would like a lot to have 4k sources.

OTOH, that was clear in the discussion yestersay, everyone here prefers taps at this moment in time over film & disks. ok, we are shooting QUITE a it on location in distant countries.

Rod Otaviano · April 25, 2006

I don't know if that was discussed here before but I gotta ask. Ok, RED announced this 4K camera yesterday, there's also the SI-1920HDVR from Silicon Imaging, True Color Space is also announcing their "revolutionary" digital camera (http://www.truecolorspace.com/) and as far as I read, there's also another company called "Vision Research" introducing their version at NAB.

We've also been flooded with inexpensive HDV cameras that costs less than 10 grand and of course there's a bunch of student and young filmmakers buying those things.

Ok, but now ... what about Super 16mm cameras ? I'm wondering if we could also expect in the future some kind of "revolutionary" version for this market in particular (young filmmaker). Or, let me put it this way: what makes a Super 16mm camera so expensive ? Optical viewfinder ? Some internal mechanism ?

It's not a rant, I'm just curious. Would it be realistic a, let's say, 10 grand brand-new sound-sync S16 camera ? (I know you can buy an old Eclair or Aaton or even the A-Cam for that price but I'm talking about a new product that at least takes external magazine with reflex-viewfinder ... )

Keith Mottram · April 25, 2006

I don't know if that was discussed here before but I gotta ask. Ok, RED announced this 4K camera yesterday, there's also the SI-1920HDVR from Silicon Imaging, True Color Space is also announcing their "revolutionary" digital camera (http://www.truecolorspace.com/) and as far as I read, there's also another company called "Vision Research" introducing their version at NAB.

We've also been flooded with inexpensive HDV cameras that costs less than 10 grand and of course there's a bunch of student and young filmmakers buying those things.

Ok, but now ... what about Super 16mm cameras ? I'm wondering if we could also expect in the future some kind of "revolutionary" version for this market in particular (young filmmaker). Or, let me put it this way: what makes a Super 16mm camera so expensive ? Optical viewfinder ? Some internal mechanism ?

It's not a rant, I'm just curious. Would it be realistic a, let's say, 10 grand brand-new sound-sync S16 camera ? (I know you can buy an old Eclair or Aaton or even the A-Cam for that price but I'm talking about a new product that at least takes external magazine with reflex-viewfinder ... )

actually there was a new super 16 camera released a while back, cant remember who by. it had a very wide angle lens, no viewfinder but it did have a video assist. its used a lot by xtreme (no way dude) filmmakers mostly i think. it was also really cheap a few thousand if i remember.

Rod Otaviano · April 25, 2006

actually there was a new super 16 camera released a while back, cant remember who by. it had a very wide angle lens, no viewfinder but it did have a video assist. its used a lot by xtreme (no way dude) filmmakers mostly i think. it was also really cheap a few thousand if i remember.

Hum, interesting ... but you're not talking about the A-CAM are you ?

This one ... http://www.ikonoskop.com/acam/index.asp

Arni Heimir · April 25, 2006

Have you guys seen the True Color Space camera? Do they have a working prototype?

Mark Allen · April 25, 2006

True Color Space is also announcing their "revolutionary" digital camera (http://www.truecolorspace.com/)

Yes, no one is reporting on that, despite the fact that they are giving the details as of yesterday... hello bloggers??

Rik Andino · April 25, 2006

Ok, but now ... what about Super 16mm cameras ? I'm wondering if we could also expect in the future some kind of "revolutionary" version for this market in particular (young filmmaker). Or, let me put it this way: what makes a Super 16mm camera so expensive ? Optical viewfinder ? Some internal mechanism ?

It's not a rant, I'm just curious. Would it be realistic a, let's say, 10 grand brand-new sound-sync S16 camera ? (I know you can buy an old Eclair or Aaton or even the A-Cam for that price but I'm talking about a new product that at least takes external magazine with reflex-viewfinder ... )

This is the wrong thread for this...but...

The thing about S16 cameras is that they're mostly manufactured by two companies Arri and Aaton

So they control the market...and that means they can set the price at whatever.

There is also the fact that S16 cameras aren't as popular as digital imaging cameras...

People aren't running out and buying S16 cameras in flocks--so they'll cost more.

Manufacturing S16 cameras is probably also more expensive than video cameras as well.

You can find affordable S16 cameras in the used-market and they work just as well--afterall it's the film.

So most of us won't see a company coming out with a cheap alternative to S16, I know it sucks.

I think the A-minima is pretty affordable at around 20K

I don't know how much the new Arri 416 will cost

But I'm almost positive it'll be the same if not more than the SR3--it's already got better features.

Then there's the A-cam which was mentioned before...but it's not for heavy-duty production work.

phillipjantzen · April 27, 2006

I don't know if that was discussed here before but I gotta ask. Ok, RED announced this 4K camera yesterday, there's also the SI-1920HDVR from Silicon Imaging, True Color Space is also announcing their "revolutionary" digital camera (http://www.truecolorspace.com/) and as far as I read, there's also another company called "Vision Research" introducing their version at NAB.

Yes, it's true Vision Research did release TWO new cameras actually at NAB. The first is the PhantomHD, which is 1920 x 1080 (35mm format width, 24mm x 13.5mm) and will run from 1 - 1000fps at 1 frame increments. the other is the Phantom65, which is the first digital motion camera in a 65mm frame format. It will do 1 - 125fps at the full 4096 x 2440 resolution. Both are 14-bits in color depth. They use hot-swappable flash magazines for recording, or we have some other options too.

Oh, they both take pictures too. =)

Phil

www.visionresearch.com