Negative Scratched and light leak

KeithKim · January 4, 2004

How're you everyone?

I just got video print from lab and found that one reel of film got a scratch and light leaked. The scratch is clean vertical black line on the left side of the film. It appears from the middle of the reel till the end. Light leaked on the right side of the film and it keeps moving changing the size like a flame. The lab does not know the exact cause of it. They assume that the magazine was a problem because the image is stable (meaning that each frame was properly registered.) Anyway, I will have to shoot the part of the reel again.

The camera and magazine were rented from the same place. In this case, can I ask the rental shop to compensate some of expenses for the re-shoot?

Your experience and idea will help. Thank you.

Kevin Zanit · January 4, 2004

I doubt that the rental house would pay for your re-shoots. That is what insurance is for. The most I would expect the house to do is possibly give you a deal on the equipment (or free) for the re-shoots.

Kevin Zanit

David Mullen ASC · January 5, 2004

In fact, most rental agreements are very clear about NOT being responsible for extra production costs spent due to equipment problems. The most they would do is give you a free rental or something, assuming you can even prove it was their fault and not yours or the labs. For example, if you lost footage due to bad stock from Kodak, they would give you new stock to replace the old bad stock but they wouldn't be responsible for the reshoot costs themselves.

It's odd that it's a BLACK scratch -- that only happens in reversal or on a print. Scratches to the negative tend to be white or blue.

GregIrwin · January 5, 2004

Black sounds like a projection scratch. Like David stated, neg scratches are usually white or the color of the layer that got scratched - red, green, blue. The light leak could have been from a few places. The camera body, the mag, the dark room.

KeithKim · January 6, 2004

Black sounds like a projection scratch. Like David stated, neg scratches are usually white or the color of the layer that got scratched - red, green, blue. The light leak could have been from a few places. The camera body, the mag, the dark room.

Sorry about misunderstanding. The scrach appears as black on the video daily. I have not checked on the negative but the technician in the lab infomed me that they found scratch on the negative.

The lab I used has very good reputation. The light leak is not a sudden flash. It is not an irregular shape that appears and disappears all of a sudden. It is very constant, continuous as if it is alive. Although I am not an expert, I can tell that it was happening while the film was rolling. The scratch is very straight line along the left side of the frame. It appears for about a minute.

The lab did only developing negative and telecine to digi beta. They did not do printing on film. Is there a process in the lab that possibly could cause the light leak?

Thank you.

Tony Brown · January 6, 2004

It's odd that it's a BLACK scratch -- that only happens in reversal or on a print. Scratches to the negative tend to be white or blue.

But it would still be black when transferred....

John Pytlak RIP · January 6, 2004

A base scratch on a negative will usually show up as white in the print or video image, as the scratch refracts light away from the scratched area. Usually wet printing or a diffuse telecine (e.g., Spirit) can minimize or even completely eliminate a base scratch.

If the negative emulsion was deeply scratched, removing the dye images, then the scratch might have some coloration or even be black.

A light leak in the magazine will sometimes have a convolution repeat, or be especially severe in an area where the film was not rolling. Did the fogging have a coloration?

Bryan Jacobson · January 7, 2004

(A base scratch on a negative will usually show up as white in the print or video image, as the scratch refracts light away from the scratched area. Usually wet printing or a diffuse telecine (e.g., Spirit) can minimize or even completely eliminate a base scratch.)

If memory serves me correctly this is definitely the case after processing, but I believe if the scratch shows up black during telecine then the scartch occured before processing. Same as dirt on negative. I could be mistaken it's been awhile.

Bryan

ColinTyler · January 7, 2004

It would be hard to believe that a motion picture lab could fog half a roll of film. If the can was opened in the light then there should be evidence of fogging across the whole roll. If there was a dark room problem then even more footage (multiple rolls) would have been effected and not only on the edges of the film.

If the lab look at the scratch they should be able to tell you if the base or Emulsion was damaged. If it was the emulsion has it 'healed' over and the film is smooth, (possibly pre or during processing). Is it sharp edged and deep (possibly post processing). Could there be a build up of emulsion in the magazine?.

Does the damage start with a gate check or camera stop?

Colin Tyler

www.filmlab.co.nz

www.filmpost.co.nz

Mitch Gross · January 7, 2004

Just sounds to me like it's a misloaded roll. If the mag door was not latched properly or light hit the film while loading it could look exactly like this. I've seen it before. :( As for the scratch, it sounds like a fairly deep emulsion-side scratch, one again that could occur either in the mag or in the camera gate if they were not cleaned properly and thoroughly. The mag may even need service.

Tony Brown · January 7, 2004

What camera was it out of interest?

KeithKim · January 7, 2004

A base scratch on a negative will usually show up as white in the print or video image, as the scratch refracts light away from the scratched area. Usually wet printing or a diffuse telecine (e.g., Spirit) can minimize or even completely eliminate a base scratch.

If the negative emulsion was deeply scratched, removing the dye images, then the scratch might have some coloration or even be black.

A light leak in the magazine will sometimes have a convolution repeat, or be especially severe in an area where the film was not rolling. Did the fogging have a coloration?

Thanks for the input.

The people from the lab said that it is emulsion scratch. I could not see the scratch on the frame for the gate check because it is too bright. But I was able to see the scratch appearing more clearly as the camera rolls from the bvery beginning of the shot of the slate.

The light leak has coloration. The light leak begins on the right side of the frame from the begining of the role. Untill the middle of the role, the leack stays only on the right side of the frame. It is constantly blinking. From the middle of the role, the scratch begins and colaration happens on both sides of the frame. Coloration and scratch disappears at some point and do not appear again till the end of the role.

Could this happened by the misloaded film?

Thank you everyone.

KeithKim · January 7, 2004

Just sounds to me like it's a misloaded roll. If the mag door was not latched properly or light hit the film while loading it could look exactly like this. I've seen it before. :( As for the scratch, it sounds like a fairly deep emulsion-side scratch, one again that could occur either in the mag or in the camera gate if they were not cleaned properly and thoroughly. The mag may even need service.

Thanks for the input.

Do you mean that the cause could be a misloaded film or the magazine itself?

Or, both?

Thank you.

KeithKim · January 7, 2004

What camera was it out of interest?

It was Arri SR.

Mitch Gross · January 9, 2004

I think the roll of film was likely flashed by the AC during loading. But this is a guess and I don't think it would be fair to blame an individual. The scratch could be in the mag or from build up in the gate. It is the job of the AC to clean and check both of these.