Matt Pacini Posted December 29, 2004 Share Posted December 29, 2004 I'm getting some footage telecined to DVcam, but my JVC MiniDV camera won't play it back correctly (obviously). I'm not optimistic about a quick fix or nifty hack, but Is there any way to do this without buying a DVcam deck? MP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Stephen Williams Posted December 29, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 29, 2004 I'm getting some footage telecined to DVcam, but my JVC MiniDV camera won't play it back correctly (obviously). I'm not optimistic about a quick fix or nifty hack, but Is there any way to do this without buying a DVcam deck? MP <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hi there, If you know anybody with a Sony mini DV camera it may work. I have done this without problems many times (With PAL), The facility house's always tell me it won't work however. Stephen Williams Lighting Cameraman www.stephenw.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted December 29, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 29, 2004 Hi, Yes, many (not all) Sony miniDV devices certainly will play back DVCAM tapes. I own a GV-D900 which does it regularly. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Pacini Posted December 29, 2004 Author Share Posted December 29, 2004 Damn. I guess I should have gotten a Sony, eh? I'm depresed now... Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riku Naskali Posted December 30, 2004 Share Posted December 30, 2004 A had a Panasonic minidv camera about three years ago, it also played back dvcam. Which was strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Pacini Posted December 30, 2004 Author Share Posted December 30, 2004 So if I end up having to get a deck, can anyone recommend one? Preferrably as inexpensive as possible, if there is such a thing! Or would it be better to buy a Sony MiniDV camera, or is that a bad idea? MP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Welle Posted December 30, 2004 Share Posted December 30, 2004 You could always borrow a camcorder capable of playing DVCAM, input the footage to a computer with firewire, and then export to MiniDV. Or why not just export the DVCam footage from a playback camcorder into your own camcorder via firewire making a perfect copy? I know DVCAM has timecode advantages, but you might want to consider a MiniDV transfer (from the lab) if this, I mean the timecode, is not necessary. So if I end up having to get a deck, can anyone recommend one?Preferrably as inexpensive as possible, if there is such a thing! Or would it be better to buy a Sony MiniDV camera, or is that a bad idea? MP <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted December 30, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 30, 2004 Hi, > I know DVCAM has timecode advantages It does? Which? If one were to buy an NLE feeder deck, the obvious hoice is the DSR-11, assuming you don't need a great deal of control. That's what it was designed to be, they're common as anything, and there was one neatly product-placed in a recent ninety-minute iPod ad I saw called "Blade Trinity" so they must be good, right? DSR-11s are often available for very reasonable money on ebay. For more features, including balanced audio and component I/O which will let you get to Beta SP in the best possible way, look at something like a DSR-45, but that's halfway to a full studio VTR and they are a bit pricey. In this range, though, you could also look around for a good deal on a DSR-70, which is the portable edit controller with the flip-up screen - and the cheapest way into SDI connectivity for DVCAM if getting out to digibeta is of interest to you. In the lower end, the GV-D900 deck I have is discontinued, but Sony still make a clamshell VTR (with, bizarrely, a smaller screen) which is worth at least trying. You may be able to ebay a D900, or possibly the DSR-V10, which is the DVCAM dedicated version of the same thing. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Welle Posted December 30, 2004 Share Posted December 30, 2004 Hi, > I know DVCAM has timecode advantages It does? Which? Please see this post for an explanation: http://www.pechorin.com/m/2002/07/08/MiniD...iDV-103692.html Thank you, Mike Welle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted December 31, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2004 Hi, The conclusions drawn in that forum thread seem to support my view - there's no difference in the way the two formats handle timecode. Timecode data in DVSD formats is saved as part of the frame data, in a field into which you can put anything you like given the right options on the VTR. A device such as a desktop computer reading an IEEE-1394 video stream from a DV or DVCAM VTR wouldn't even know the difference if it were not for a flag that gets set in DVCAM-originated data. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Tim Carroll Posted December 31, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2004 My 2 cents, Faster tape speed(a little more robust stock) and locked audio, those were the two advantages I had always know of miniDVCAM over Mini-DV. -Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Welle Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 There is a difference between the time codes of several MiniDV and DVCam recording devices. A lot of MiniDV camcorders record drop frame time code. Drop frame time code will drop two time code frame numbers every minute except every tenth minute. It doesn't drop frames but simply time code numbers. The Sony VX2000 records drop frame time code, as I can see from consulting my manual. Several DVCam recorders record non-drop frame time code. I would suggest mastering to MiniDV. I simpy put it all on my computer and cut it there--that works best for me. I was just trying to clarify what I knew about the differences between the two formats--but I guess it has more to do with the recording device. Even though it doesn't matter to me, personally, it seems like Non-Drop frame is more of a professional feature since they put it on the more pro decks. But I really don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted December 31, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2004 Hi, Right, you're making the standard mistake of confusing tape formats and VTRs. What timecode can be recorded on any tape format is down to the machine that's recording it. miniDV as a tape format has exactly the same capabilities as DVCAM. The VTRs may differ. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Welle Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 What dost thou scorn me for my gentle counsel? :angry: Hi, Right, you're making the standard mistake of confusing tape formats and VTRs. What timecode can be recorded on any tape format is down to the machine that's recording it. miniDV as a tape format has exactly the same capabilities as DVCAM. The VTRs may differ. Phil <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Pacini Posted December 31, 2004 Author Share Posted December 31, 2004 (edited) ... I would suggest mastering to MiniDV..." <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, that's what I thought I was doing. I had some film telecine'd, and the tape wouldn't play back correctly. They told me that they couldn't transfer to miniDV, and seemed to indicate that there's nobody who can go right to MiniDV, just DVcam. Matt Pacini Edited December 31, 2004 by Matt Pacini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted December 31, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2004 Hi, Well you have a few choices. - See if their DVCAM deck can actually be switched into straight DV. Many can. - Have it dubbed onto a format you can read (which might be a hard drive or something) at a dubbing house. - Try every deck you can get your hands on until you find someone who can read it. You could mail it to me, if you like. My deck is PAL, but that shouldn't theoretically stop me capturing it and putting it back out to tape. Theoretically. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Alessandro Machi Posted January 5, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 5, 2005 Well, that's what I thought I was doing.I had some film telecine'd, and the tape wouldn't play back correctly. They told me that they couldn't transfer to miniDV, and seemed to indicate that there's nobody who can go right to MiniDV, just DVcam. Matt Pacini <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Sony did a very not nice thing several years ago when they came out with the DSR-40. It was missing several useful features. I was livid because I knew eventually they would offer the features but they didn't inititally and the price was kind of steep (4 grand) to be missing the several features that it was missing. 3-4 years later and Wala the DSR-45 comes out with all the features that were missing from the DSR-40 and similarly priced. The reason your transfer lab can't do a regular mini-dv transfer is they are probably using a DSR-40 which will not record in mini-dv. I suggest you insist they transfer to your camcorder directly. I believe there is a difference with time-code between Mini-dv and DV-CAM. DV-CAM time-code is settable, I'm not sure that mini-dv time-code is settable, specifically the DSR-45 (I'm not sure about DV-CAM Camcorders). I've also heard that on some camcorders that can play DV-CAM recorded on mini-dv that they have trouble reading time-code that is hour-8 or higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted January 5, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 5, 2005 Hi, Don't feel so bad; the DSR-45 also has several myopic nonfeatures, such as the way they've put in balanced audio output for all four channels, but only unbalanced inputs. Considering the third and fourth channels are almost never used you'd have thought the XLRs would have been better used for balanced I/O on the first two, and relegate 3 and 4 to the RCAs, but no. The settability or not of miniDV timecode has nothing to do with the tape format; it's down to the record device. I believe the JVC GY-DV500 and DV5000, which will take miniDV tapes, allow you to set the timecode, as does my Panasonic AG-DVC200, which records large-shell DV. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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