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The difference between pro and amateur?


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Samuel, I know you may mean well but I have too much experience working in other capacities with DSLR "filmmakers" who believe that the low-light capabilities of modern cameras means that "you dont have to have lights!" This is the slippery slope of compromise. The more you compromise, the more you can justifiy compromise. Can a DSLR produce beautiful images in the hands of a well skilled craftsman who uses proper light and form? Absolutely! Is this the norm in the ultra-ultra no budget world of indie filmmaking? No way friend!

 

It got so bad that I would bring my lighting kit with me to AUDIO gigs just because I was sickened to see such mediocrity being done so I lent them it free of charge (on already non-paying gigs.) Even then, they acted like it was a waste of their time to light very much since "my viewfinder image looks great!" only to later see on an HD monitor that the image was noisy.

 

You may treat the craft with honor but I've seen too much misuse of DSLRs to ever believe that its a serious tool.

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So HDLR's are not serious but feature films and several television shows are shot with them? You prove my point with this argument. I can make an HDSLR look good. There are many Cinematographers that can make them look absolutely amazing. The tool is nothing but a tool. Your saying nothing good can be made with them because a lot of people own them and don't know how to use them. Sorry but that's a deeply flawed and ridiculous argument based on prejudice and no fact at all.

 

I completely agree there are a lot of people out there that think they are Cinematographers because they have an HDSLR. So what? They aren't actually Cinematographers. I started with a Video camera. Upgraded to an HDSLR. I have put in thousands of hours in the past 18 months with my HDSLR. I don't even have a 7D. I am however using my HDSLR to learn and do professional work. There are Thousands of commercials, music videos, House, Wilfred, and Dexter shot with HDSLR's. I don't even like HDSLR's. I think they are over used. But they gave me the opportunity to learn and make a relatively quality movie. To say they are not a serious tool is something we can factually denounce as incorrect. But again the tool is far less important than the cinematographers ability as you said. If you don't know you need lights that's the camera operators fault not the camera.

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LOL @ camera ops. The shoots ive been on dont even have dedicated camera ops. I've seen buffoonery in the form of clueless directors who hire a "dp" and nothing else in the camera department. No grip, no gaffer, no nothing. When a "dp" is moving his own lights around, you should know its a troubled set.

 

So my reasoning is flawed because I think students should use tools that, more or less, force you to do the right thing? I would think this is a good motivator to doing the right thing. Let me remind you of what you reminded me of...which is that this is a student forum, not about TV DPs and pros. I still stand that I believe students should learn on a medium that requires discipline and accountability. That medium is film.

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The problem with your logic is that you will only know how to shoot on Film. Shooting on digital is very different. You don't need as much light. I worked a feature film that Outlaw Film did and they used 2 Kino Flo Diva lights only in one location. The rest of the time they used practicals and available light. The movie looks great so far. To the best of my knowledge you can't do this with 16mm film. If that is wrong somebody please educate me. So if we teach everyone on super 16mm how will they be prepared for the real world? I think you will find the same people who lack skill will continue to lack skill. They will just shoot ugly 16mm films.

 

But again back on topic how does super 16mm film help a 7D user achieve the look of his example video? Because really that's all that matters to this discussion. Whether students should be force to go to Fascist film school or not is really irrelevant. Knowing how to shoot in available light is actually key to shooting what Jakub is asking how to achieve. You can actually do this with a 7D although additional lighting is my preference.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Yes, I know that. That's why I've stopped complaining about 7D. The question is: how to get the best picture from this box with a hole?

 

Put your camera down. Watch films, observe and learn. There's a saying "A camera is only as good as the person using it." point being you could have an Arri and still produce awful images. You need to learn the basics about framing and composition. There's a book called The 5 Cs of cinematography. It helps.

Edited by Joshua Thomas Gallegos
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