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$10K Camera Kit Budget - Seeking Advice


Darmon Moore

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If you are up for considering cameras that are second hand you could consider:

 

Panasonic GH1 and GH2. (Both can record at high bitrates with the hacks and cost less than a GoPro new)

Sony FS100 (a bit like the FS700 but without the high speed or 4K) or even Sony EX1.

 

and if looking at new cameras I'd probably keep an eye on the GH4 too.

 

Freya

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Freya, on the other hand going for broadcast/eng cameras like ex1 is maybe not the best choice
If he conciders to become a professional DP you need to learn to work with lenses, which is a bit difficult (i think) to work with a small sensor and standart zoomlens

though my first cam was a canon xl2

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invest in glass and rent camera per project

 

Artyom is right about investing in lenses. I disagree though about not having a camera at all and relying on rentals. Perhaps Artyom has some name recognition where he is at and is getting some good work. Here in Northern California, you won't get work if you have no camera. It doesn't really matter who you are. The same is true until you get to Southern Cali where the film scene is strong. Even there, I imagine the no-budget productions wont rent a camera and pay you a rate. Sometimes the camera is the only thing that gets you work.

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Depends on the gig, on commercials we always rent cameras, because every project requires a different camera.. If ur mostly shooting short films then yes it can be handy to have your own set. Here in Europe people try to hire a cameraman because of his/her skills, not because he or she owns a camera.

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Depends on the gig, on commercials we always rent cameras, because every project requires a different camera.. If ur mostly shooting short films then yes it can be handy to have your own set. Here in Europe people try to hire a cameraman because of his/her skills, not because he or she owns a camera.

Let me rephrase what I meant. Here, skills still matter but...it is less that having a camera will get you a job than it is that NOT having a camera will lose you a job.

 

Skills are not in short supply but access to good gear is.

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If you're buying a camera you need to decide what you want to do with it and, if it's going to be a professional tool, what are the demands of your local market. Given the nature things, you also need it to earn enough in a few months in order to pay off your investment.

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Get a Blackmagic Pocket, a Nikon-mouint Speedbooster adapter, a Tokina 11-16mm and the basic Rokinon primes (24mm, 35mm, 85mm), a mattebox and follow focus and you'll be able to shoot lovely looking pictures for a pittance. I find it almost scary how close my Pocket Cam comes to my F3 image-wise.

 

That's going to be your cheapest route to high-quality video files. Which leaves the rest of your funds available for things that matter - like a good tripod, a couple of decent lights, and maybe a slider to allow some interesting camera movement.

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We used it for 3 grueling days of shooting up in bakersfield which basically devolved into just myself with the camera and the director, good guy, pulling out his hair at everything else. Camera held up swimmingly, and coupled with a cigarette adapter battery charger, camera never let us down.

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After reading everyone's posts and looking at some reviews/footage etc, this BMPCC is really starting to sway me.

 

The image you can get out of such a small camera (AND YOU GET RAW!!!) is quite phenomenal.

 

 

At the moment I think blowing money on the 2.5k or the 4k is probably going to be a waste of money. Seeing as my direct market at the moment is going to be on the web.

 

As Freya, Alex, Artyom - Well basically everyone has said, the BMPCC is amazing for it's size and price.

 

This means I can spend some money on things I can use with later cameras down the track.

 

Lenses

Tripod

External Monitor (if need be)

Cage

Rods

Audio Equipment

Lighting

etc.

 

 

So I suppose my question now is, what gear should I be looking at getting if I were to purchase the BMPCC.

 

 

Once again, your professional advice is beyond helpful guys.

 

 

Darmon.

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This is my approach, I'm used to ENG cameras so that's what I'm aiming for.

 

I tend to agree with your observations, but you need to look upon many of the cameras you could get for this price - the pocket, a DSLR (which is realy rather similar, operationally) and other small camerras - as a sensor in a box that really needs to have a camera built around it. It isn't really a camera on its own.

 

That being the case, you might need to consider something like a Tilta BS-T03 baseplate. Not only does that get you an ENG-style shoulder mount, you also have rods front and back and compatibility with a broadcast-style quick release plate. You can pick up a compatible tripod plate reasonably cheaply and gain the benefit of the sort of quick release capability enjoyed by news crews. Any decent fluid head tripod, although size it for a decent camera rig as opposed to assuming a tiny one will do because the BMPCC is tiny. Get something with triple leg extension. You can probably afford it.

 

Next consider glass. You'll almost certainly end up using DSLR lenses at this sort of price point on a big sensor, although if you're particularly dedicated you can pick up 2/3" B4 mount lenses that will cover the BMPCC with the extender in, for a few thousand used. Otherwise consider how you're going to grip the thing. I don't personally like the dual front handle approach - people do it with a lot of DSLR rigs because they see it used on high end feature films, but remember they're working with focus pullers and camera assistants. They don't need a hand free to tweak focus or turn over. You do, so consider other options.

 

Battery. Lots of people make rod-mounted battery mounts. Slide on the back of the T03. Buy batteries and chargers from wherever's the best deal.

 

Viewfinder. Various people make LCD viewfinders in the fixed-loupe style that you can mount where an ENG camera's finder would go. They may need to be mounted on a magic arm or a configuration of rods and brackets. Most of the current crop are only 800x480. A higher-res option was shown at NAB but it's several thousand dollars and may be overkill.

 

The thing to remember is that the lenses, batteries, tripod, baseplate and other accessories will cost you more than the camera and will probably last you longer than the camera - the actual light sensor is only a small part of the equation.

 

P

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This is my approach, I'm used to ENG cameras so that's what I'm aiming for.

 

I tend to agree with your observations, but you need to look upon many of the cameras you could get for this price - the pocket, a DSLR (which is realy rather similar, operationally) and other small camerras - as a sensor in a box that really needs to have a camera built around it. It isn't really a camera on its own.

 

That being the case, you might need to consider something like a Tilta BS-T03 baseplate. Not only does that get you an ENG-style shoulder mount, you also have rods front and back and compatibility with a broadcast-style quick release plate. You can pick up a compatible tripod plate reasonably cheaply and gain the benefit of the sort of quick release capability enjoyed by news crews. Any decent fluid head tripod, although size it for a decent camera rig as opposed to assuming a tiny one will do because the BMPCC is tiny. Get something with triple leg extension. You can probably afford it.

 

Next consider glass. You'll almost certainly end up using DSLR lenses at this sort of price point on a big sensor, although if you're particularly dedicated you can pick up 2/3" B4 mount lenses that will cover the BMPCC with the extender in, for a few thousand used. Otherwise consider how you're going to grip the thing. I don't personally like the dual front handle approach - people do it with a lot of DSLR rigs because they see it used on high end feature films, but remember they're working with focus pullers and camera assistants. They don't need a hand free to tweak focus or turn over. You do, so consider other options.

 

Battery. Lots of people make rod-mounted battery mounts. Slide on the back of the T03. Buy batteries and chargers from wherever's the best deal.

 

Viewfinder. Various people make LCD viewfinders in the fixed-loupe style that you can mount where an ENG camera's finder would go. They may need to be mounted on a magic arm or a configuration of rods and brackets. Most of the current crop are only 800x480. A higher-res option was shown at NAB but it's several thousand dollars and may be overkill.

 

The thing to remember is that the lenses, batteries, tripod, baseplate and other accessories will cost you more than the camera and will probably last you longer than the camera - the actual light sensor is only a small part of the equation.

 

P

 

Thanks for the reply Phil.

 

In terms of the cage/handle etc I was looking at something like, thoughts?

 

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1020904-REG/ikan_tilta_es_t13_black_magic.html

 

The thing to remember is that the lenses, batteries, tripod, baseplate and other accessories will cost you more than the camera and will probably last you longer than the camera - the actual light sensor is only a small part of the equation.

 

Completely agree, I want to invest in some accessories that will last for camera systems to come and go.

 

As for lenses, I have heard and seen great things about the Rokinon/Samyang budget CINE kit.

 

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1016626-REG/rokinon_super_fast_t1_5_cine.html

 

The quality of these lenses for their price are seriously remarkable. Plus they come with follow focus notches and T stops.

 

I would probably get the Metabones Pocket camera addtion, to get those wider angles and more light.

 

 

as for tripods and EVFS/Monitors, I'm quite inexperienced in that area.

 

Darmon.

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Both of those choices are the right ones for you I think Damon - that cage will make rigging the camera up nice and easy (a proper carry handle, rails for mattebox and follow focus). And those Rokinon lenses are a great combo with the BMPC if you pair them with a Speedbooster. You'll want the Tokina 11-16mm as well in order to get wide-angles.

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Hi Darmon,

 

There are a couple of reasons why when I originally posted you an equipment list I wrote the BMP4K and not the Pocket.

 

First, you said you wanted to practise, and as someone that started out on Super16 Film, I feel like I was much better off to start on Super 35 cameras as the use of lenses and F stops is somewhat different and when you get to a professional shoot you want to feel natural at picking up the right lenses/f stop combo, this is why you practise no? It took me a while to get all the different conversions in my head after I started using all the Super35 cameras. But maybe it's just me...

 

You also said Narrative Drama, and again, I feel super35 sensor is better suited for most narrative work except some certain films which you prefer the handheld super16 look("The wrestler" is one example), which I'm not sure the pocket can provide anyway. I know you can get the Speedbooster for the pocket, but I wouldn't want to put a piece of glass between my lens and sensor.

 

for Lenses, I strongly recommend you to get the Sigma 18-35 (or get Zeiss Contax) rather than the Rokinons. I have the Rokinon 85mm and also had the 35mm which I returned, I feel the construction of those lenses are not on par with the Contax and Sigma. Also the Sigma is a real 1.8T stop. The Rokinon, even though rated at 1.5T actually don't really get close to the sigma sharpness till you get to 2.8, The Sigma is tack sharp wide open, plus you get an 18 1.8T which is incredible for 18mm lens :)

 

just my 2c, different people different views...

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I know you can get the Speedbooster for the pocket, but I wouldn't want to put a piece of glass between my lens and sensor.

 

 

I've shot a commercial while ago using a BMCC with a dedicated Speedbooster and Zeiss CP.2 lenses. The crew did extensive tests before shooting with MB Speedbooster (with and without it with CP.2s), and I can tell you that it does not alter the inherit characteristics of those lenses so I assume it will not alter others.

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I've shot a commercial while ago using a BMCC with a dedicated Speedbooster and Zeiss CP.2 lenses. The crew did extensive tests before shooting with MB Speedbooster (with and without it with CP.2s), and I can tell you that it does not alter the inherit characteristics of those lenses so I assume it will not alter others.

Hi Alexandre, Thanks for sharing the info, That's good to know! Although, I've never really did or saw a proper MTF/Chart tests with those adapters, if anyone got a link, will be great.

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Hi Alexandre, Thanks for sharing the info, That's good to know! Although, I've never really did or saw a proper MTF/Chart tests with those adapters, if anyone got a link, will be great.

 

I remember reading something about Caldwell Optics releasing their own MTF charts when MB hit the market. IIRC it showed up a slightly resolution increase at the image centre and a slightly decrease at borders. Both of which would be practically imperceptible on a screen projected 2K DCP image.

 

Regardless of resolution however, I think that getting a wider FOV and faster apertures without messing with your lens character is a great achievement and I put that on top of increased resolution any day.

Edited by Alexandre de Tolan
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I remember reading something about Caldwell Optics releasing their own MTF charts when MB hit the market. IIRC it showed up a slightly resolution increase at the image centre and a slightly decrease at borders. Both of which would be practically imperceptible on a screen projected 2K DCP image.

 

Regardless of resolution however, I think that getting a wider FOV and faster apertures without messing with your lens character is a great achievement and I put that on top of increased resolution any day.

Thanks again for the info. I guess it's not only resolution. If you had softer borders it means it might change the character of a lens. having said that, I do agree with you 100%, making the BMCC for example match Super35 depth of field. So when are they going to get this MFT to EF mount Speed Booster, so we could check it out with the Contax lenses?! :D

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