Do the hi-priced scanners automatically adjust for framing?

[Daniel D. Teoli Jr.]

A lot of the warped films continually get out of frame when being scanned. It is about impossible to keep up with trying to adjust on the fly.

Do the hi-priced scanners automatically adjust for framing? If so, how fast do they adjust once detected? Or for problem films do you just over scan and crop?

[Tyler Purcell]

Framing is done manually on most scanners. You get an over-scanned image and then you crop in post most of the time. On telecine machines the framing can't really be adjusted much, just frame line. 

[Robert Houllahan]

Not really the best option is to overscan and then fix in Resolve after the film is scanned, and if you have 6464x4860 pixels it is fairly easy to select a custom area to make sure any framing jumps are covered to fix without loss of resolution in the final.

Most of the scanners lock onto the perforation(s) to stabilize as if the scan was pin registered.

[Daniel D. Teoli Jr.]

On 12/17/2021 at 12:00 AM, Robert Houllahan said:

Not really the best option is to overscan and then fix in Resolve after the film is scanned, and if you have 6464x4860 pixels it is fairly easy to select a custom area to make sure any framing jumps are covered to fix without loss of resolution in the final.

Most of the scanners lock onto the perforation(s) to stabilize as if the scan was pin registered.

 

Thanks Robert. I will have to see if my software has a constant crop option. As of now I crop it out but have to manually crop the rest of the sides to get it timed with the uncropped segment. 

BTW...

I looked at some of your photos of Cinelab at the site. Very impressive operation you got! And that is understating it. I like how you are open to working with experimentation and encourage film students. 

Only suggestions are...

1) Finish up the walls and paint over the drywall tape.

2) Put a few people in the photos with lab coats and ties like the old dye transfer techs used to dress up.

 

Bob Pace in his lab

Of course, if someone comes to visit, they will say...where are all the techs in lab coats!

Edited December 18, 2021 by Daniel D. Teoli Jr.

[Daniel D. Teoli Jr.]

On 12/16/2021 at 8:02 PM, Tyler Purcell said:

Framing is done manually on most scanners. You get an over-scanned image and then you crop in post most of the time. On telecine machines the framing can't really be adjusted much, just frame line. 

On the high-priced scanners can you adjust the magnification easily? On my scanner, getting an over-scan is a job. You have to change the extension tubes / washers and it is a big over-scan. There is very little range to it once it is set.

[Dan Baxter]

7 hours ago, Daniel D. Teoli Jr. said:

On the high-priced scanners can you adjust the magnification easily?

It depends on the machine, but with many of them you have absolutely no control over framing and with most you can't scan "edge-to-edge" (the Kinetta makes that a selling point since some Archives want that). A DCS XENA you probably have full control over, Robert can answer on that, but on a Blackmagic, a Lasergraphics or the line-scan scanners like the GoldenEye and Scanity I don't think the user has any control at all. The overscan is whatever is set in the factory where it's designed and manufactured. Even if you repositioned the camera in the Blackmagic Cintel yourself the scanning software (Resolve) wouldn't support scanning 16mm above 2K the software would need to be rewritten, and Lasergraphics has a hard software lock to restrict you from doing anything like that with a ScanStation Personal or the Archivist. You would need someone to write third-party capture software to do anything like that. Remember, most of the older machines only ever supported two formats at most (typically 16mm and 35mm).

It sounds like your film is going out of frame because the Moviestuff scanners don't have gates to guide the film to the correct location. There's a 3rd-party product coming for the new ones next year (the current model Retroscan).

[Tyler Purcell]

11 hours ago, Daniel D. Teoli Jr. said:

On the high-priced scanners can you adjust the magnification easily? On my scanner, getting an over-scan is a job. You have to change the extension tubes / washers and it is a big over-scan. There is very little range to it once it is set.

Yes, you on most scanners you can adjust the XYZ axis of the camera no problem. That's how you run different formats, but can use the full imager. But some scanners like the Scanity, does not allow you to do that. So it does depend on the machine. 

Edited December 19, 2021 by Tyler Purcell