Post-Production Questions

[Iggy Heringa]

Hi,

First of all, I could not find any better place than this forum to ask these questions. I know there is an editing forum on cinematography.com but it gets barely any views. If anyone knows of a better place for me to post these questions online please let me know ?

I directed a "short-feature film" (≈50min) a few months ago and we are getting closer to final cut of the offline edit (Shot on Alexa LF, K35s, 4.5 Open Gate, ProRes 4444). The film was supposed to be 30-40 minutes but it ended up longer, which unfortunately is a less advantageous running time for festivals...

I have a few simple questions:

1. Though I wanted my final delivery to be 4k, it has now become 2k. Because the shoot was a tough experience (no point in writing an essay as to why) I now have to deal with fixing certain things in post. 2k is easier on vfx amongst others ;). QUESTION: How much can I zoom into a shot without the audience at a festival noticing that the image stands out as softer? Is 150% the limit? Or can I go up to 200%? I know it also depends on the length of the shot, and also that I can get away with less sharp footage if it's a very short clip. I also know that these zoomed-in shots will need some sharpening, de-noising, etc. I much hope someone with professional experience on feature films post-production could give me their opinion  ? Should 150% be the max? Or is 200% fine?

2. Zoom-in effect. I know that one can add digital zooms via keyframing in post. I don't plan to do a lot of this and on-set we used a dolly for various sequences so its not like I planned to add this in post. However, there are a few moments in the film where adding a zoom in post was considered during prep or feels useful. QUESTION: Is there a plugin that very realistically emulates the zoom in and out of a cinema-zoom? I know that this slow-in-and-slow-out effect can be replicated with careful key framing but I'd ideally want something that speeds up the process or even makes it look better than what I can do. One thing I found online is this: https://nofilmschool.com/push-post-vashi-nedomanskys-premiere-pro-preset I'm sure there are other tools no?

3. Changing aspect ratios. We shot the film for 2:1 but I'm thinking of changing the aspect ratio to 1.85:1. Something I did not want to do but overall feels better. And there's also this other thought that I've been thinking of... QUESTION: Could you guys recommend films that change aspect ratios throughout the film. I know of The Grand Budapest Hotel/The French Dispatch and a few others but my online research can't find many other good examples. Obviously I don't want my aspect ratio to change every 2 minutes (though for a more experimental film this could be great) but I wonder how far I could go with this, which is why I'm seeking out references. Not to copy but be inspired by at best and to know what's out there! 

Really hope someone can help me out here and wishing you all a great Wednesday! ?

 

[David Mullen ASC]

Work from the original 4.5K files for any crops, stabilization, noise reduction, etc. and have the VFX people deliver them in 2K. It's crazy to first reduce to 2K, crop, and then blow that back up to 2K.

Find out if your festival wants 2K DCP or 1080P HD for screenings because HD is 16x9 (1.78) so any other aspect ratios have to be bordered within that.

Other movies that jump around in aspect ratio include Christopher Nolan's movies that mix IMAX with 35mm anamorphic. "Brainstorm" mixed 1.66 35mm with 2.20 65mm. "The Horse Whisperer" is in 1.85 until they get to Montana and then it becomes 2.40.

[Iggy Heringa]

1 hour ago, David Mullen ASC said:

Work from the original 4.5K files for any crops, stabilization, noise reduction, etc. and have the VFX people deliver them in 2K. It's crazy to first reduce to 2K, crop, and then blow that back up to 2K.

Find out if your festival wants 2K DCP or 1080P HD for screenings because HD is 16x9 (1.78) so any other aspect ratios have to be bordered within that.

Other movies that jump around in aspect ratio include Christopher Nolan's movies that mix IMAX with 35mm anamorphic. "Brainstorm" mixed 1.66 35mm with 2.20 65mm. "The Horse Whisperer" is in 1.85 until they get to Montana and then it becomes 2.40.

Hi David, 

Thank you very much for your response ?

I didn't explain myself well.. Sorry. Obviously I never intended to crop into 2k and then blow that back to 2k ? Just wanted to make sure if mixing say 150% or 200% crop in 4.5k files with none-cropped-in files would present any issues at all if the sharpening and all that is done appropriately.

Thanks for the 2K vs 1080p info regarding screenings and extra movie references where aspect ratio changes occur ? 

Also, anyone know of a convincing zoom plugin?

Thanks so much!

[Dom Jaeger]

A nice example of well motivated aspect ratio changes was WandaVision, where the early episodes were in 4:3 or 16:9 (depending on the sitcom era), but it morphed into 2.40 widescreen whenever the real world intruded. 

https://mydroll.com/wandavision-aspect-ratios-explained-by-cinematographer-jess-hall/

It's interesting how widescreen is now often the "normal" aspect ratio in blockbusters, and for action sequences the screen expands vertically to a squarer IMAX aspect ratio. It's the opposite of the original widescreen expansion which extended the screen out horizontally. 

This is a nice article on the history of aspect ratio changes with lots of examples through cinema history:

https://tadleckman.wordpress.com/2012/10/29/shapeshifiting-films/

[David Mullen ASC]

After CinemaScope, the major theaters converted their screens to 2.35-ish and used curtains to narrow that when 1.85 movies were projected. Anamorphic projector lenses widened the image to fill the wider screen.

With digital projection and 1.90 : 1 chips and DCPs, and a common spherical projector lens for both 1.85 and 2.40, it is easier to build 1.85 or 1.9 screens and just letterbox the 2.40 movies, which was not the intent of CinemaScope originally. Scope movies were supposed to be bigger horizontally, not shorter vertically.

[Iggy Heringa]

12 hours ago, Dom Jaeger said:

A nice example of well motivated aspect ratio changes was WandaVision, where the early episodes were in 4:3 or 16:9 (depending on the sitcom era), but it morphed into 2.40 widescreen whenever the real world intruded. 

https://mydroll.com/wandavision-aspect-ratios-explained-by-cinematographer-jess-hall/

It's interesting how widescreen is now often the "normal" aspect ratio in blockbusters, and for action sequences the screen expands vertically to a squarer IMAX aspect ratio. It's the opposite of the original widescreen expansion which extended the screen out horizontally. 

This is a nice article on the history of aspect ratio changes with lots of examples through cinema history:

https://tadleckman.wordpress.com/2012/10/29/shapeshifiting-films/

Thanks so much for your answer and info Dom.!These two links are super helpful. I'll be going through them later today! ?