Michael Peploe

I can certainly send them this and you can tell them yourself.

By the way i read the posts on REduser by someone with the same feelings regarding the upgrade path from X to monstro. The fact that it was a $33k upgrade path troubled him. And you know what happened he got crucified and called a retard by posters (Their words not mine), for not genuflecting enough for the new announcements. Posters it seems JaREd "whoopass" LAnd seemed to know personally. Great way to deal with an owners fear generated by a quickly disappearing in front of his eyes non obsolete camera.

$165.00 for 8gb CF $550 for 16gb CF Thats red prices and recording times being so short you'll need a bunch.

You don't know for sure if those lexars will work for the yet unreleased redcode 42, 225, 250, and 500. You don't know what the new brains require for storage of varying frame rates. You may be buying a whole new set of storage.

Listen by the time jannard is through with you, you'll be getting closer and closer to that 250k number. People have quoted $80K for a decent working red one kit with a one minute boot up time. The epic with all the necessary add ons will be even more and if you want to change brains you'll be at 250k very easily. Just the recording media costs alone for 6k and up will be pricey. Even those scarlet fanboys just see $3750 for a complete kit. But recording media for 3k will bump it up considerably. Its P2 cards all over again for them. Approx. 6 minutes at 3k on one $200 8gb card at redcode 42.

Made a mistake . Some of the scarlets can't do speed ramping but there are still more features in the scarlet that were added that still make it better than the red one.

Having just spent some time with a bunch of red one owners who are really pissed off I felt I should write what i heard because you can't voice your opinion on reduser as Jarred "I'm gonna unload a can of whoopass on you " Land has a fascistic approach to naysayers. This is in regards to the Nov announcements and the announcements made Dec. 3. When the Nov. announcements were made some REd one owners were pissed because they felt their cameras became obsolete. The scarlets were better than the red one and they were cheaper. Jannard replied that the red one still was better than the scarlets because of speed ramping, time lapse, and more shooting resolutions. This helped these red one owners a bit. With yesterdays announcement the scarlets can now do speed ramping and time lapse and have better recording compression and are cheaper than the red ones. Jannard with yesterdays announcement has put the nail in the coffin of the red one. What he said about how the red one still had more and better features than the scarlet, he, in less than 2 weeks has totally reversed himself by adding those red one features to the scarlet.. And the reason he feels he can reverse himself is because hes giving RED one owners a battery, recording and i.o module. Only if you spend $10500 minimum more. Genius Fear not he's giving you (ha ha) a special Epic with several modules for $28,000 with full trade in value of $17500 for RED one owners only. So in less than a year this non obsolete camera has become obsolete and the only way you can make it non obsolete again is to drop another $10.500. With yesterdays announcement with the added features of the scarlet Jannard has forced the hands of red one owners who had an eye on renting their redones for a long while. yesterdays announcement makes the red one more costly than the scarlets and less performing than the scarlets and the only way to fix this if you're an owner is to drop more money. Before yesterdays announcement the red one still had features that differentiated it from the scarlets, not anymore. So less than a year ago a bunch of people got excited about a camera that cost $17500 and it suddenly emerged to really be a $28,000 camera MINIMUM. Jannard is a genius at getting money out of your pocket and having you thank him for it. Yesterdays announcement was a brilliant act of marketing. Some REd one owners think yesterdays announcement is a better deal. The only thing it did was really make the red one an obsolete camera forcing you to either spend more money or just get out of the game. The only people this deal benefits are people with alot of cash in this economy and early red one owners with a low number as they can sell their red ones to someone who wants an epic fast as Red one owners are first to get epics and really fast if you have a low number red one. Those people without extra money just got a big surprise.

Chris there is nothing new in your post except that the REd one was sold as a camera you would never have to do that with. The point of the marketing was making "obsolescence obsolete". The mistake for some was thinking that that quote referred to the REd one. Surprise.

Tom if you bought a cam tell us honestly if this is what you expected. I bet you didn't. In 2010 it'll be a 6K camera, in 2011 it'll be a 7K camera and so on. 20k or 30k upgrade path each time. So whats different than owning a non upgradable Sony or Panasonic. You still have to pay the money. Man its the same story but different approach. Jannard has too many ideas and is too eager to best the big boys with his deep pockets to sit still. Most of the buyers will scramble, mortgage their homes to keep up with that madness. Have at it if its what you want. But nothings really changed here.

Well I do not believe Jannard is losing money on anything. Why. Because like a genius he made the RED one look like the end all of cameras with modularity , upgradable, making obsolescence obsolete- words like that thrown out as he pushed the cam and now he makes a better camera where you can put your red ones full 17500.00 cost towards the Epic. But how much will you have to pay 20K, 30K ? on top of the red one because your red one just became obsolete. Who would rent or shoot RED One when epic is around? Everyones who bought a REdone paid $30,000 to be a beta tester. Genius. Jannard is also a genius in getting more money out of your pocket consistently. Thank god for rentals. If I was a Red One purchaser I would be pissed. Total value of red one put towars epic is great but he really should do more for those first 500 Red purchasers at least as they made the company. I bet silently they are stewing not to enrage the leader of the revolution. The only revolution they're seeing now is how easy Jannard can get money from you. Seeing that this is the way he works I would never buy a cam from the company but I will rent the cam as much as I can. Come on boys get the epic out. For all those camera purchasers. To quote Johnny Rotten: Ever feel like you've been cheated?

I understand the conflict that arises from a companies marketing. I went to screening from crossing the line early on. There were alot of camera image issues from the image left in that film. They didn't try to hide it. I saw it projected 2K from a laptop computer And furthermore somehow lying about the image thats being shown from a company thats all about image acquisition would spell its doom if found out. This whole debate is about image quality Saul not content of story.At REds screenings we were seeing these images with our own eyes. Your trust your eyes don't you Saul. Hype is out the window at this point. So I'm just curious why we can't trust these screenings according to you, how you think a company that designed a camera that digitally acquires raw images, can be manipulated to look better when thats the whole purpose of a digitally acquired raw image.

Right. Everythings a conspiracy with RED. :rolleyes: And ultimately you are right again. "Till then" will be the only way this forum will satisfy itself.

Wow John I feel you need to be taken by the hand and have things spelled out for you. How you managed to merge two of my separate posts into this tirade is quite imaginative. I'll be clearer for you. RED has for year and a half been traveling all over the world showing 2k and 4k Digital projection of their footage on a BIG ASS CINEMA SCREEN. Filling the screen John not 7"x4'", a movie, cinema screen. For free. Thats exactly what you say you want and will get your arse to the theater. So again why didn't you get your arse to the theater?

Maybe RED should have named it the RED Digital Cinema Theater Camera instead. I can't find a definition and never thought that the word cinema meant theaters as the only defining and valid place for the showing and acceptance of images. Movies were birthed from the nickelodeon, about a 7"x4" viewing screen.

I said it was valid. It didn't elude me that you were talking about CINEMA. Whats the matter John?, If its so damn important a piece of proof to you why couldn't you get to any of the traveling 2k and 4k digital BIG CINEMA SCREEN showings that REd has given for the past year and a half all over the world for F--ks sake? I'm sure theres an excuse coming.

For most people the workflow is the mystery. This flow chart on the RED.com site is the easiest representation of workflow I have seen. There are buttons on the bottom right of the flow chart that explains Final Cut, DI, REdcine, and other NLE workflows: http://www.red.com/cameras/workflow And its important to add the free software to your system and keep updated on any issues here: http://www.red.com/support And since all RED software is free to all and rd3 raw files are available. You can play with footage at your leisure and see what it takes to get to where you want to go on the system you have.

Two things. The fact that you can shoot 4K and derive any other res size you want makes it great for multiple delivery avenues with the high res always there if you need it. And 2k is really not that much different from 1920x1080, a few pixels difference. Those 2k files might also give you extra room to resize shots or reframe shots for 1080 delivery or 720 delivery. Except for the render times for the at home shooter/editor, I can't see any minuses, yet render times can be fatiguing. Thats the thing i hope they work on.

2k is windowed off the 4K. It is not scaled from the 4k. So yes 2k to 4k or 4k to 2k, DOF and focal length with same lens will change. I assume 3K works the same, I have not used it yet. You can use redcine to scale to what you like and you can convert your raw footage to codecs and res sizes that exists in your system.

Shoots 4k, 3k, 2k. depending on your build number as 3k is only in a recent build, I believe, which is still in beta category. In order to do 120fps or other slow motion frame rates you need to shoot 2K as 4k goes only to 30fps. Not sure what the frame limit is in 3K. All lower res formats can be derived from the 2,3,or 4k raw files through redcine which is free and you can try for yourself with readily available raw files. Although a future separate build, meaning you will have to change firmware out for one or the other, will shoot some of the lower res formats. It has been promised because of some user demand but no date has been set

And thats valid but 95% of content is made for bluray dvd, DVD, TV and web , with only hundreds that will ever be projected on a screen. Most people have home digital projectors, calibrated monitors, and large lcd displays they use for conforming, color correcting and viewing so judging quality for those people is perfectly valid too.

About what i expected too. Your first and second post a snobbish whine. And if you bothered to read my other posts I regularly rent the REd and like the Red images.

Now this is the kind of elitist junk that wastes more forum space All i need is to get experienced DP's to give me the answers. Well then lets sit and wait for the final word from these experienced DP's.god forbid any individual who isn't has anything valuable to say. Redcode raw files are available in the link I posted. They are there for you to play with. They are raw files not compressed ( other than the cams wavelet cpmress), dithered or other wise. Just what the cam put out. Play with them and see what you get. Lance you can wait for the screening room to get built and the experienced dp's to tell you what to think.

Rodney I'm just going with the facts. You posted you pulled the best key ever. Your words. But there are 3 or 4 people that asked you questions about that statement aside from the antagonizers ,who you could have ignored, and you chose to answer the antagonizers instead. I'm not trying to antagonize you Rodney but you started the thread, you got offended, came back when some people graciously tried to buffer the thing. Now you call it bulls**t girlfighting. The only one acting like a 'girl' is you, respectfully. All you had to do was answer the question. If you can't post footage thats no excuse. Explain yourself thats all. The fact that you didn't offer any explanation caused this not me.

Agreed. Some are too quick on the trigger. Let me say that posting 'best ______ ever' without backup will get you nowhere here and thats okay with me because I believe when the REd gets more accepted this site will be one of the best places to get unbiased facts. Not being a skeptic myself on the RED, i will wait. I think jannard is waiting too, thats why he keeps coming back.

With all due respect Chad some of the vitriol isn't unwarranted. The Rodney West thread is a perfect example. He posts 'Best key ever', then when you and others asks questions, nothing, zip, silence. Whats wrong with not letting this forum devolve into another reduser? We all want professional discussion but why side with the people who just seem to want to convert people not based on fact but simply because they have found religion.