Mark Sperry

I just picked up the Jobo expert drum for Super 8 film.  Works great!  Easy to load too...well relatively speaking.

I have an Arkay CD40 film dryer, which is large enough for Super 8.  However, how do people go about draping all the film about safely so that it can dry?  Some tips would be appreciated on that point.   I'm curious if there is some trick to it...

I'm currently processing Tri-X as a negative.  Tonight I tried 10 minutes in a 500ml solution of 1:1 XTol, the results came out looking good.  I'd be interested to hear alternative development starting times if people have them however.

Thanks!

-Mark

All great info in the last two posts!  Thank you for that.  

I've been shooting with the camera.  It's all working well now including the auto aperture movement.  The only thing that is wrong is that the aperture wants to over expose by 1 stop.  The needle indicates over exposure so the meter is not the problem.  I confirmed the needle is correct via a spot meter on a grey target.  And I can manually adjust to the correct exposure.  

So far I just have been setting the ISO 1 stop down, but I've also been in contact with the seller who have sent me a few DIY repair techniques, and have offered to take the camera back for adjustment at no cost.  But overall, I'm not sure it's such a big issue.  

Now focusing the camera on the ground glass, yowzers that is hard haha.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/category/Camera-Photo/Beaulieu-4008-Refurbished-cameras-and-batteries-1894375727474190/

Why don't you ask them?

I have the original instructions.  The battery isn't that crazy, just a little hump that goes in the original battery port that converts it to modern lithium ion cells.  Pretty cool IMO! 

Another question, in automatic mode should the aperture ring physically move on it's own?

I purchsed a 4008ZMII with an eneloop based battery replacement.  I bought it from a European seller who says that the manual indicates a mode or switch I have to engage for the camera to charge the battery.  It came with the 'headphones' style jack that goes into the camera in the back like the original.  Is that true?  Is there a switch I engage to divert power to the batteries?

Also, is there an easy way to dust off the ground glass.  Mine definitely has some hair and spots on it.

Unfortunately 120 film base is much thinner so it's not just a matter of cutting. If the 135 market is tiny, 120 must be well nigh invisible. Sorry. You can still get Velvia in 120.

35mm motion film is thicker it's true, not sure about the still films such as Portra 160/400. The thickness is variable though. Delta 3200 for instance is a very thick film. Most 120 cameras have some degree of tolerance for a thicker stock. The Cinestill guys are running 65mm film through 120 cameras even with the perfs and don't seem to be running into problems.

The lens they have mounted is the 6mm 1.2 Cosmicar (Pentax). If it's a sunny day, and you're shooting with a 6mm lens, a better question would be how do you find anything out of focus? The DoF will be massive.

This makes me SOOOO happy. I don't know what's better, it's return to S8 or 35mm. I hope it also gets cut for 120! My Rolleiflex would love to shoot the hell out of this stock.

Well, its fairly inexpensive to test. Any NEW camera would need to be tested anyway.

If it got through one reel that would tell me that it's capable of getting through exactly one reel. That's not something on which I'm willing to gamble thousands of dollars and a client's wedding film. Plus even if I wanted to shoot 2 or 3 reels that's hundreds of dollars in dev/scan at current lab rates. Cinelab isn't even doing SD scans anymore, and PacLab NYC closed so all processing must be mailed out for me. I'll just spend the money on a camera that I know has been fully overhauled and can be serviced at any time. It's a barely a dent in the lifetime RoI of shooting and a great deal of peace of mind.

I bought the expensive Pro8mm rebuilt Super 8 cameras and it was worth it to me. I trusted their reliability far more than an eBay find, which matters because if I'm shooting a wedding for a client I'd rather know my camera is going to work than know I only spent 10 dollars on it. Now Kodak is giving us one with a video tap. That would make my life a lot easier if it's integrated with an internal light meter.

I'll write to Kodak and see if they can get Christopher Nolan to make freaking Dunkirk featurettes for Kodak on Super 8 so that everyone here is satisfied by the production value.

Yeesh you guys are being pretty hard on a prototype. It's a Super 8 camera still folks and it still looked like Super 8 to me. Some of the shots didn't have a great exposure but that shot of the truck looked great. To me it still looked like "Super 8" more or less. Meaning, a technically imperfect but aesthetically charming analog motion picture format.

I don't understand why someone would come to the Super 8 forum and lodge existential complaints against the format. There is no way I would be able to shoot film for my motion projects were it not for super 8. I don't expect it to look like freaking 65mm just because 50D is available to me. I like that it's grainy and jittery. If I didn't like those things I would either not shot it, get a Logmar, or shoot 16mm.

You can still make me an offer based on the ebay price I have. I'd love to avoid eBay fees and pitfalls.

On eBay now: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pro8mm-Classic-Pro-Beaulieu-4008-Super-8-Camera-/262644659936?hash=item3d26d776e0:g:uYkAAOSwPCVX6a~Y

Back to the OP, I've really enjoyed the last few years of seeing formats used almost completely for aesthetic reasons over cost. There were all the films that Tyler mentioned shot on Super 16 (Moonrise Kingdom was drop-dead gorgeous on screen), and even on TV the Walking Dead is still Super 16 (though I think the Cable TV compression makes it a little ugly and mushy), even as it's spinoff went digital. Then on the other side of that we have Dunkirk coming in completely shot on 70mm and we had Tarantino resurrecting a basically obsolete format and distributing projectors for it. There is some really cool stuff out there! I might be in a minority here but I think I can see the difference in formats even when just viewing a good HD copy at home on my TV. You can tell what parts of Batman were in 70mm, and Moonrise Kingdom doesn't devolve into mush, it looks great. Digital is kind of the great leveler as far as formats go, which is kind of boring in comparison (I'm no film purist but I like it see it shot as much as possible).

DSC_6502 by Mark A. Sperry, on Flickr

DSC_6501 by Mark A. Sperry, on Flickr

DSC_6504 by Mark A. Sperry, on Flickr

DSC_6503 by Mark A. Sperry, on Flickr

Updated with some photos of the camera!

Hi!

I'd like to sell my Pro8mm "Classic Pro" with max 8 modification. It will come with the 8-64 zoom, a Cosimcar Pentax 6mm 1.2 prime, and the single lithium ion cell/charger. This camera has seen probably 10 reels since purchased from Pro8mm. It's as new as it was from the company. It's in beautiful hammertone finish. I have some Hoya color correction and ND filters I'll throw in too.

This is a camera I will miss, but I have to save up for a relocation so it must go.

I'd like $1750.00. That's a $940.00 discount from what Pro8mm currently charges.

Here is the Pro8mm listing: http://www.pro8mm.com/Merchant5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=01&Product_Code=CAMERA_CLASSIC&Category_Code=S8

This camera is in my opinion the best Super 8 camera you can get. The Logmar might be modern and perfect, but this is classic Super 8.

Well if anyone wants the 4008ZM rebuild that Pro8mm does at a steep discount I'm going to be posting mine in the classifieds in a few days. It's like new, and max 8. PM me if you want to beat me to the post.

You're over-generalising again. Dust is simply not a big problem with small tank processing in the average home for b/w, not in the UK anyway. You always expect to do a bit of spotting on a b/w print. If you're particularly concerned a drying cabinet is very simple to arrange but for 20 years I never bothered.

Perhaps the USA is particularly dusty.

NYC is incredibly dusty haha. I've sworn off darkroom printing for a few reasons but they all have to do with the limitations of living in NYC. Thankfully I am moving to Maine within a year or so and I will be either using a community darkroom or building one at home. I got into photography in the darkroom and I will die in the darkroom (so to speak). :-) I wish I was still able to make RA-4 color prints from home, but if I'm being completely honest my Epson R3000 pretty much matches or exceeds what I was able to do in the color darkroom. Plus you can print on fiber paper.

For still processing It's true. There is far better quality and control of the result. But most of that is down to the hand printing. In movie processing this doesn't normally apply, except possibly some DIY optical work.

However, in theory anyway there is a possibilty that home processing of movie film can produce better images than obtained by the lab. I am really talking about black and white. Different film emulsions have optimum developer characteristics and processing times, and these are not usually provided by the lab. Also there are stunning effects such as solarisation that can only be done at home during the development process.

The only thing I've wanted to try is home development of B&W stocks. I would love to try conventional B&W developers on Tri-X in Super 8, but the problem is that there are no easy tank solutions. And once I do get the film out as a negative I still have to send it to a lab for xfer, and we're only talking about a theoretical small change in contrast or granularity.

I haven't seen anything impressive from ANY home processing, motion picture film or still.

You've never been impressed by home processing of still images? Then you haven't seen much of anything. Technically Ansel Adam's entire portfolio could be considered 'home' processed. In fact any B&W film photographer worth his or her silver forgoes the lab for the ultimate control that home processing and printing gives you in the world of still photography. Yes you need to have a darkroom that isn't complete rubbish, but you're doing it from home. The best photographic prints that I've ever made were all done by hand and some of the best ones I've seen were done by my peers when we were working in the darkroom, all by hand. You drop a roll of FP4+ off at the lab and they're going to run it through a standard XTol or TMax developer in a dip/dunk machine with no specialized agitation control. You develop it at home and you can use Rodinal or a Pyro developer that actually takes full advantage of what the emulsion is capable of. If you're shooting still B&W film you should stop using labs as soon as you can. Color, less so, but there isn't any difference between C-41 in a home Jobo vs a lab except for the fact that you're doing it yourself, assuming you don't screw it up. There certainly isn't a quality gap between the two if you know what you're doing.

For motion picture sure, there are probably no decent DIY solutions, I would agree with that.

While I won't say that it would come close to replacing 16mm, I shoot Max 8 in my Pro8mm rebuilt 4008. Given that the squared off format has pretty much gone the way of the dinosaurs, I like shooting Max 8 because it allows me to shoot with the Super 8 aesthetic, in a rectangular format. I don't think I've seen a real resolution boost, but the images from that camera are beautiful. If you wanted to shoot a film that was intentionally a lo-fi Super 8 picture, then it would be great. But as the others have said, Super 16 would be my go to for something that looks like a 'real film'.

I can say that the Ricoh 6mm 1.2 is a fantastic lens for Super 8. I use it frequently on my 4008 in max 8. Great for low light and focusing by DoF is a breeze.

Look at the Nikon R10 or R8. If you're handheld metering stock types won't matter. I also think the Nizo 481 Macro is a great camera. Again, that's assuming you're doing manual. Yes to everything the above poster has said. The 4008 is the best, but I paid $1,500 for a Pro8mm version and it's a dream Super 8 camera.

I can't say enough good things about Pro8mm's "Classic Pro." It's a refurbished 4008. I have a max 8 modified version and the images it creates are fantastic. I picked up the "Cosmicar" "Pentax" "Ricoh" (this lens goes under all these names) 6mm 1.2 and it's sharp as hell and great in low light!

Ohh I don't hate super 8! I just grinds my gears when people even consider it a "professional" format.

 

Ok, so

Is 15/70 better? Yes

Is 5/65 better? Yes

Is 4/35 better? Yes

Is 3/35 better? Yes

Is 2/35 better? Yes

Is S16 better? Yes

Is 16 better? Yes

 

So logically, wouldn't super 8 be the lowest motion picture film format made? It's just logic.

 

Then you add the other issues like camera noise, cartridge pressure plate issues, low run-time, etc.. I mean, the "benefit" of a small camera goes away super fast in the grand scheme of things.

 

 

Yep, a non-professional, consumer format designed for shooting home movies. ;)

I shoot Super 8 at weddings and that's how I make my living. I might not be in Hollywood but am I not 'professional?' In my experience the people who sit around and argue about what is 'professional' do so because they aren't actually out working. If you don't have anything constructive to say about Super 8 then get out of the Super 8 forum. Or if a mod is reading please just ban this troll. People like this ruin forum discussions because they always have something acidic to say and always have to have the last word. STFU!