Max Field

Does this mean we'll get RED sensors without horridly priced proprietary options?

Yes please DM me photos of the camera as well.

51 minutes ago, Evan Ferrario said:

It's all BS until you provide proof.

 

 

Okay next time I meet another random techie in my day-to-day life I'll be sure to record the date, time, place, photograph his computer screen, transfer several gigs worth of test files, get his ID, and swab for DNA forensics on the offhand chance a camera operator disgruntled over how his career panned out spazzes over something I witnessed 5 years ago.

5 minutes ago, Evan Ferrario said:

Max Field

THIS IS OUTRAGEOUS STATEMENT to make without any proof. Please back it up. 

This post is going to resurface over and over for years to come. 

Perhaps you were misinformed and now are too embarrassed to admit mistaken information? 

For everyone else reading these posts and coming here to ask the same question I put in a little time trying to find more I would add this: 

a)I could not find any evidence of internal 444 on F3 sxs upgrade anywhere else on the internet.

b) take a look at some of Max Field's other posts and I think you get an idea he might be shooting from the hip a little loose. See his F35 post.

 I find the virus of mis-information to be incredibly annoying. Maybe I am wrong and there is a magical F3 sxs upgrade however saying there is and then disappearing is incredibly irresponsible and the same as flat out lying about it.

 

 

This was 5 years ago that I was physically in his workshop and witnessed the camera doing said recordings. He didn't have a service listed since it was a personal project that he put together. There are tons of unofficial mods people do to cameras all the time that aren't listed services. Calm down.

I can't remember where I heard this (probably some dumb Google autofill thing) but I read somewhere it resolves up to 5.5K? When I commission illustrations that is the basis for the resolution I choose to future proof things.

Wanted to get the creative input from veteran cinematographers on my boarding of this short I wrote and directed for the promotion of a franchise I'm working on. I took a lot of what I learned through working with cameras and tried to apply it to 2D anime storytelling.

Often I like to go back to very old threads of this forum to see what the active unfiltered perspective was on various things that are now considered history. Unfortunately I think the posts here only go back to 2004, and I was wondering what the in-the-moment reaction was of cinematographers to Star Wars Episode 2, being the first full digital capture blockbuster.

At the time was Lucas held in high regard for pulling a move like this for such a big property? Were most calling him annoyingly experimental for trying to make a movie with an ENG camera?

I'd like to hear the perspective of it without the bias of today's technological landscape, from people who were there to hear the talks back in the early 2000's.

Hey all,

Got a nice deal on some SxS Pro+ cards and was revisiting cameras that used this media format. Off the top of my head it was Sony F3, F5, F55, and Arri Alexa EV Classic/Plus.

Are there other solid cameras that I am overlooking?

Thanks for any input.

36 minutes ago, David Mullen ASC said:

What “middle class” union production situations are you referring to where the switch from film caused a lot of union jobs to disappear or the rates to be lowered? Or are you saying that these productions went non-union simply by switching from film to digital?

Going back to the original post's analogy with the current AI scare of today, everyone in the industry period is worried about what AI will do to artists whether they are union or non-union.

The budgets for corporate and commercial video productions have nose-dived in the last 20 years because digital capture is far easier and more accessible than film capture, most of the upper class in this example is working on those larger union sets so wouldn't feel the brunt of it. The lower class greatly increased in numbers because of lower barrier of entry (friend or nephew with a DSLR). And the middle class (local business commercials/music videos) barely exists nowadays because clients see the cheaper option so don't even consider shelling out budget for a better set. These dynamics weren't nearly as staggering as they were 30 years ago.

I feel like this bleak state of video production can paint some of the picture of what we can expect with the AI shift.

On 8/3/2023 at 9:05 PM, David Mullen ASC said:

The camera union was not opposed to digital cameras IF it made no change to the number of crew people hired nor affected their rates

This is genuinely surprising given how cheaper digital capture utterly destroyed the middle class of film/video production. Hindsight is 20/20 I suppose

So we are seeing a whole lot about AI replacing the jobs of traditional artists, writers, actors, and more, but I feel like the transition from digital to film over the last 20 years could provide some insight on where this new AI technology might take the industry. Does anyone have any particular stories regarding unions opposing sets that used digital capture? I feel like I heard one fleeting story in the past where actors didn't like it because of increased take ratio...

Whether it was on or off camera, what were the particular oppositions in the 21st (or 20th) century that come to mind for digital capture?

18 hours ago, Joerg Polzfusz said:

Did you try contacting ASCAP, BMI or SESAC?

I looked through their catalogs and it's a two-fold problem where either they don't have the songs we want or they are only for the playing of at live events and not to be used within recorded media.

9 hours ago, Joerg Polzfusz said:

Hi!

Maybe this text helps?

https://www.renderforest.com/blog/get-permission-to-use-song
 

Sorry but #6 does not answer "what if they don't reply" which in all likelihood is what happens when you email a major record label.

Have been Googling all over the place and keep getting results for artists getting their songs into movies and not the other way around.

Has anyone produced a film before and gone through the process of officially licensing a contemporary copyrighted piece of music into the final cut? It's so hard to track which label owns what artist's catalog nowadays, as well as getting a response from them in general feels like a struggle.

If we have songs from multiple different labels, is there some kind of licensing agent who can communicate with the labels on a filmmakers behalf to acquire licensing rights to music easier?

Thank you.

1 hour ago, David Mullen ASC said:

Don't know if this improves things much -- I noticed that when I post this, the colors shift compared to how it looks in Lightroom. I pulled a lot of saturation out of his white shirt just to keep it neutral.

Perhaps documentation and camera tests of the URSA 4.6K were throwing me off or trying to get me to push the image due to expectations I have for skin tones after working with better cameras. Last week I was watching an URSA 4.6K versus Amira test and the URSA seriously lost the skin tone battle where everything had these white-ish hotspots and ugly reflections. In this new treatment you have posted I am okay with the shine on the screen-left part of the face, however something in the more shaded part of the cheeks feels off.

Here is a link to the video I am referencing:

Grabbed a sample off somebody to just grade for fun (shot on URSA mini 4.6K) and was tweaking it around for a while however could just not get the skin tones to look the least bit appealing.

The skin tones look so plastic but I am trying to figure out if there is a sole method for articulation beyond "camera has bad skin tones".
Is it because his skin is too oily? Does the sensor fumble something in particular that RED or Arri would get right? I've shot faces cast in shadow before but they didn't look this artificial.

Additionally, what methods do you use to fix skin tones that look this shiny and plastic?

Thanks to all for any input.

On 1/28/2023 at 7:03 PM, David Mullen ASC said:

Here are some conversations on the topic. It seems that the general advice is to first convert to RGB from YCbCr before downsampling to 2K or 1080P, but there is also some opinion that there isn't any real improvement in a visible, practical sense.

https://www.eoshd.com/news/discovery-4k-8bit-420-panasonic-gh4-converts-1080p-10bit-444/

https://rarevision.com/5dtorgb/

https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?t=40701

https://community.fxhome.com/discussion/52309/converting-4-2-0-4-2-2-4k-to-4-4-4-1080p

 

Thanks for this, sorry I didn't get the notification when you actually sent it.

An extremely cheap way of doing it which may not lead to scientifically perfect results is to point the camera at a white bath towel and keep it in focus and filling the entire frame. Then put a 1K tungsten or some other very bright source on it so you have tons of light to play with. Put on false color (and make sure no curve LUTs are applied) and reduce the camera exposure to the absolute darkest point that still has a bit slightly registering beyond 0 IRE. Then using triangle of exposure, count the stops you open step-by-step going brighter and brighter and see how many stages you can raise before you see any highlight clipping on the white towel.

However many stops you can count before clipping is your dynamic range (including your initial stop).

Have done this with a few cameras and it's matched up with the professional tests every time.

Haven't really looked into RED cameras for a while since all of their early stuff would overheat and partake in proprietary extortion, while simultaneously still not quite looking as good as an Arri equivalent.

Just recently I watched a test of a V-Raptor sensor shooting out against an Alexa Mini LF and was impressed by how much better RED's color philosophy has gotten to where it felt like having either image was entirely 50/50 for me. Previously being 70/30 in favor of Arri.

My question of their image has been answered with flying colors, if anyone could please answer these other 3 questions I would be very thankful:

• Are the DSMC3/Ranger era cameras doing more than 40 minutes of recording on a single battery yet?
• Has RED been continuing the practice of proprietary extortion through their overpriced memory cards? Or do they allow for good recordings in more universal media (CFast, SSD)?
• Do these cameras still overheat after running for over 2 hours?

Interested in any and all insight, please don't sugarcoat any experience with these cameras.

Thanks

2 minutes ago, Carl Nenzen Loven said:

Yeah, it comes more across like you are just sore about this.

Most of us owners look at them like a classic car we still use. And therefore we treasure them.

As you said, there are a buttload of F3, F55, and Alexa classics. Take your pick and keep shooting.

Don’t be mad because we like taking care of ours ?

(I just made mine run on TB50s, Ronin battery, to get better runtime)

C

I could drop $20k cash on a camera right now if I wanted to, I'm just anti financial gatekeeping. The under 25 crowd would care about cinematography as an artform way more if it wasn't so artificially expensive in certain areas.

2 minutes ago, Robin Phillips said:

Like, who cares if someone wants to use a certain tool that you dont want to use?

I'm not saying I'd never want to use it, it would be an interesting camera to play around with some day, but people treating their obsolete tech like a baseball card isn't exactly pro-art or pro-education for that matter. Nonsensical prices are what prevent the youth from learning about this stuff.

3 minutes ago, Robin Phillips said:

the answer is, enough to keep the market price of the camera still at around $5k.

 

Normal market circumstances would agree. But given how people still want $1000 for Digital Betacam rigs that stay on eBay for years on end suggests Gen Xers have a major problem with sunk cost fallacy.

25 minutes ago, Carl Nenzen Loven said:

Well. It was the last true CCD cam out there, so if that is your flavor, it’s the only option. And arguably the cleanest 1080p/2k image out there you can get.

The footage looks unique. And only 213 was actually made, so there is a limited supply, which isn’t increasing.

And finally, you are just looking in the wrong places. I got mine for $3700 with an odyssey 7q included. The ones posted on eBay is just there to prove a point. Most sell for $4000-5000.

I love mine, and I will probably never sell it. I spent more on it then I bought it for, but it’s a tank. I bet Mr Mullen has his own opinion on this, but Mr Yedlin recently said in a podcast that the F35 was a camera the world gave up on too quickly, it actually is a great cam, just needed some more love.

 

C

A 2K camera without "ARRI" on it is simply an extremely hard sell for clients. There's 200 of them but how many human beings on planet earth are aware of it and actively want it for their next project... Maybe 50?

52 minutes ago, Robin Phillips said:

its picture rivals or beats the alexa classics, even the mini in some circumstances. plus that global shutter. with ultra primes it upscales to 4k in post with no problem

Some F55s and Alexa Classics are cheaper cameras than the F35 at this point though. It has consistently been at $5000-$6500 for the last 5 years now.

Looked up the F35 again and am still in absolute shock that this thing is still listing for over $5,000. A 2K camera without internal SSD recording in 2023 for over $5,000.......