Boris Belay

Hi Greg, I haven't tried, but I doubt it would focus right. The 'Aspheron' knob functions a bit like a macro position when the Aspheron lens is not mounted on. What kind of V-S 12.5-100 do you have ? Is it Bolex specified or made for another brand ? C-mount, Bolex Bayo mount, or somethig else yet? Best, B.

Hi Michael, Interesting problem... The back focus distance is different on the H8RX and on the H16RX. For one thing, the turret on the H8 is slimmer than that on the H16. Besides the possible vignetting mentioned by Tim (lenses optically designed for an 8mm. coverage), I don't know what other problems you may run into. Regarding focusing, I would begin by unscrewing the lenses little by little while trying to focus on an infinity point. Since the H16 has a larger back flange distance, you may find the point where they will focus with that method. Start with the longer focal lengths as they will be easier to focus. If you get a focused infinity, then try other focus distances. Let us know the results ! B.

Yes, that is the way to do it. The leatherette is strong enough that it shouldn't tear and you can glue it back later if necessary. Also, you need to remove the metalic piece held by those two screws : it's just for decoration. And the matte-box mount should have its own longer screws (black). -B

All Reflex H16 viewfinders are non-removable, except for servicing. (And the one pictured is the wrong type.) If yours has been removed, you'll have a hard time finding a replacement one (without buying a camera attached to it, at least !). If you do find a spare one, screwing it back in is ralatively easy (with the right screws), but you will still need to adjust it, which is a bit more complicated. Given the market price of a Rex-1, a new viewfinder may or may not make economic sense to you. The other option, if you don't feel up to self-repair on a camera you're not familiar with, is to sell it back for parts and buy a complete camera instead. Are you sure your H16 is a Reflex model ? If it has a prism behind the middle, then it is. The trouble would be if it had been tempered with in other ways, or perhaps wasn't functioning correctly when its viewfinder was removed for parts... Best of luck ! -B

Mark, Regarding your telecine question, that's (more or less) strictly between you and your telecine facility... What I mean is that the problem with modifications like Ultra-16 is that you have to convince your telecine operator to go there with you, ie, find, buy, or make a gate that corresponds to your image area. It doesn't seem like such a big deal, but it's for you to do the convincing : either they will be nice and feel like experimenting a bit with a spare part, or else they will think there is a market in an up-and-coming format like Ultra-16. But as you will see from previous threads about Ultra-16 on this forum, this is an uphill battle : a lot of people balk at the very idea (and I mean, the idea itself) of modifying anything on their cameras that deviates from the accepted standard. Also economically, while the Ultra-16 modification make sense for people who have a small camera budget (like you : you have the camera, the lens (?), and all you need is a file...), this same fact means labs may not be interested in that 'market segment', annoying people with crazy ideas and no money ! I personnally like the idea of U-16, in part because I do my own transfers so I could easily modify my telecine projector to U-16, but your main problem will be to convince whoever does your transfers to modify their equipment for this format. I know some people on this forum were interested in doing U-16 transfers for people in your position, so if it's convenient for you to send your film away, look through the U-16 threads and you'll find them. They should also be able to confirm whether your lens will handle the widened format. Your pictures are so small, it's hard to tell whether there are optical aberrations on the edges. -B

Ian, Don't buy the camera until you see the other side : it could be an M-3 (flat base but no 1/1 shaft)... A very good camera indeed, but you need a solution to the viewier problem. Reflex zoom lenses make this a great beginner package (but drop the CCTV zoom that's mounted on it!). Otherwise, these make great parts cameras for Rex-4/5 and SB/SBM's : exactly the same mechanics besides the turret, viewfinder, and shutter. All the holes are there too. The best deals for a Rex-5 with a broken spring (for examples) are the M4's that were used as surveillance cameras in banks in the 60's/70's : they look bad because of external modifications for the motor mount, but they've run next to nothing (how many robberies n a bank's lifetime ?) and their spring is effectively new (electric motor all the way). Great deal for the handy filmaker ! -B

Yes, I would test the lens : what's the price of a roll of film in comparison with getting an equivalent lens ? People have different answers on the RX question... 'better safe than sorry' is the standard answer until you do your own tests... As for the Switar 75mm, it's a regular lens, so good to go for any C-mount camera. By the way, there were regular versions of most, if not all, those nice Switars, even the late preset series (26/1.1 and 10/1.6), because Bolex kept a line of non-Reflex cameras (M) until the mid-70's. Keep your eyes opened for them : I missed a non-RX Macro-Switar 26 mounted on a surveillance camera a while back on eBay (went for a ridiculously low price) and I'm still biting my fingers about it ! -B

Hi, Just checked my SBM Manual and in my version (there are several) the single-frame shooting speed is indicated in the same table as the other shooting speeds (p. 13). Actual speed is 1/30th of a sec., corrected speed (which you should use with a regular lightmeter) is 1/40th of a second (with shutter fully opened). I too would wind the spring up before it runs out... although in frame-by-frame mode, with about 650 frames on a full wind, it still means a lot of time between rewinds ! -B

B)--> QUOTE(Steven B @ Feb 11 2006, 10:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I've done some stop motion and other camera trickery with the bolex. I haven't had much trouble with the exposures changing as the spring winds down, but it is rather difficult to rewind the camera while keeping it very still. If you'd doing regular 16mm I'd recommend a Vario Switar MC 12.5 - 100mm with macro switch if you can find one. Macro can be very useful for animation and they're relatively fast for a zoom. POE vario switar is a decent lens as well. I like the bayo mount more than the turret mount, practically speaking. The turret looks a little cooler though... more of a classic. You could start your animation project or just start shooting some tests with whatever you come up with, and then let your collection evolve with your needs. I thought the smaller matte box tapers towards the body of the camera so the chunky auto exposure parts of Vario Switars wouldn't fit? Steven Right, it's the exposure meter and power zoom motor that would get in the way of the small matte-box (barring the rods being just too short). This is true of the V-S 18-86 EE, 18-86 OE, 16-100 POE, and 12,5-100 POE. But both the 18-16 and 12,5-100 were made in regular versions (no light-meter or power zoom), so these are at least slim enough. And yes, the Vario-Switar 12,5-100 MC is an amazing lens, better than the much earlier 18-86, but it's also a lot more expensive. The macro switch you mention is in fact the Aspheron wide-angle attachment button that also doubles as a macro function (nifty!). I think it's on all V-S 12,5-100 made for Bolex. Finally, you're right, the most important and practical is to begin with a simple set-up that seems fine and only build on that if you find out you actually need more. Filming in general, and animation filming in particular, is a very pratical art form where machines play a big part, but not so big that the machines should hide the forest (so to speak)! Film, film, film, try, try, try, then reconsider your gear if necessary -- that seems like the best pproach to me. And Bolex cameras are great, cheap and flexible machines to get your foot in the door of 16mm. filming! -B.

Hi, I'm not so familiar with animation work but I can provide a few more answers. I would take Clive Tobin's word on the spring motor wind-down : he's one of (if not THE) specialist on Bolex motors, and you should seriously consider his gear. Besides that, I would think the motor option is safer and more practical, but you could always rewind a lot if you have more time than money, as many of us do ! Bolex made several animation motors of their own, which show on eBay now and then and may be a cheaper option. The Bolex MBF-A motor must be used with the power and control units that went with it (MBF-B, MBF-C) but these are fairly old by now, bulky and heavy to ship, and could have damaged circuits. A later series of Single-Frame Motors (S. F. Unit 2 & 3) are smaller, and the control box is far more modern and smaller -- those may be fine. They all require 1:1 motor axes, present on all Bolex cameras from the mid/late-60's on (Rex4/5, M4/5, S4, SB, SBM, EBM -- and yes, those later Units will work on the EBM, they mount on the matte-box threads). If you're going to trigger the camera by hand only, you don't need the 1;1 shaft and can go for any model (but earlier models may be less relaible, etc.). The EL uses its own electric motor for single frame shooting, and Bolex designed a (rare and sophisticated) Remote control box. I don't know if it will eventually kill the camera... perhaps not with the controler... But it should be nice overall, if pricier than a Rex-4 set-up. With any Turret model, I would lock the turret down with a locking turret plug for animation work. H16 M4 models may make good economic sense for you if you don't need the reflex viewing or if you end up getting a reflex zoom (Berthiot) : the camera is the same as the Rex-4, with a fixed C lens mount (no turret) and no reflex viewfinder (and no prism to worry about). Some of these were (very little) used as security cameras in the 60's and make for great deals today. Regarding the lens : the Kern Vario-Switar 18-86 was introduced around the same time as those cameras, that is true, but you absolutely don't have to use them together. The EE (and later OE) versions of the V-S 18-86 had a built-in exposure meter and iris control that was a big selling point in the Bolex line of the mid-60's (first H16's with light-metering!). There was also a plain version that will certainly not interfere with a matte-box (the 'extra bits' at the base of the EE model being the lightmeter), although the lens itself is quite long, perhaps too much for the rods on the short matte-box. Other possible zooms in the same price/quality range (and Bolex RX-compatible) are the SOM Berthiot Pan-Cinor 17-85/2, 12-120/3.3 (very short for its range) and the tiny 17-85/3.8 Compact, which would pose no problem with any mate-box. Both 17-85 models have a zoom lever which may be more convenient for your set-up than regular zoom rings. The 17-85 Compact also has convenient Macro and Wide-angle complements, if that's helpful to you. But if you're not going to actually zoom-in or out in your shots, I would recommend using fixed focal lenses for your work. -Boris

Unfortunately, this is not really a possibility here : basically the seller has picked these up from the TV company and is not really the owner in that sense... That is why I was asking for these 'outward signs' tips : I have to appraise them for myself, but the good side of this is that I can choose from several units (if I'm fast enough...). The other good thing is that I know who the Aaton dealer in Belgium is, and if they haven't dealt with the cameras themselves (maintenance records with serial numbers), they'll surely know who does that for the national TV company. Thanks ! -B

Wow ! Nathan, Thanks for a great answer ! Somehow, I thought you may be the guy with the answer...wonder why ? I'll definitely look up your post on the registration test. By the way, what this board needs is an 'Ultimate Answer' category, with definitive posts on typical questions, like mine, I suppose. Where do I sent sugestions ? Thanks again... the best part about your answer is that I may get to chose among several cameras -- it'll take a long time with your check-list but what a help this is ! -B

Thanks, Are there more or less obvious signs of wear to look out for ? Sounds to listen for while it's running ? What about for the mags?

Mike, You're stating a very strong position that is definitely only one part of cinema. That I wholly disagree with it is one thing (and proves that there are other positions). But you should at least relativize your responses to somebody who's a beginner and should get a chance to hear all sides... The previous mention of Spielberg's now classic experimentation in "Saving PR" shows that cinematic language evolves also thanks to the camera/technical side of research. And perhaps not everything has been done yet... I'm sure time will prove this point. So may I suggest you begin your interesting and valid interventions with something like "In my opinion...", or "In my experience..." After all, we're trying to help people with questions, not prove we are right. -B Matt, Your question sounds very, very wide-open ! There are so many things that can be done with a camera as common as the Bolex that it's hard to even begin answering your question... Perhaps you can give us a few pointers : what sort of things do you like in films you've seen ? In the shooting you've done in video ? What kind of film are you thinking about doing for your program ? Unless you give us some amount of detail, besides the camera, about what and how you want to shoot, you're likely to get only very vague answers... Your film can be helped, bu t it's got to start somewhere, and that's for you to know -- probably the hardest quesion ! So give us pointers, and we'll give advice... -B

Yes, that's correct. All Bolex H16 have that feature. On models before the mid-60's, it's a little lever switch with 'I/T' inscribed. I is the fixed shutter speed setting for single frame shots (check your manual for exposure time, as it depends on camera models), and the T setting is for a manually controled single-frame exposure : press the side release and the shutter opens, release is to close the shutter. On later models (from the Rex/M/S-4 on), the switch becomes a small rotating button, but the function is exactly the same. This feaure can also be used in conjunction with an appropriate single-frame motor. Great stuff ! -B

I check and the Maurer 150 is indeed in the "Professional 16/35mm Cameraman's Handbook" by Verne and Sylvia Carlson, 1970-1974 but only in the early versions of that excellent reference manual, well worth investing in it. I also have a 1994 "Fourth Edition" of the same book and the Maurer is not in there anymore, so make sure you get the right one ! You can easily find this classic on internet, and you won't regret paying the $10 the early editions go for ! And yes, that elaborate viewfinder is integral to the camera. Looks good ! -B

I would say a Bolex H16 Reflex camera : I personnaly think they're great, but they're also the basic learning camera in most schools, so you cant really go wrong, will always be able to sell it back, and a lot of people will be able to help you with them. Also, they're very well conceived, extremely sturdy, there are a lot of them around, some of them still in amazing shape after 40 years in an amateur's closet, and the accessories are incredibly wide-ranging, so the camera can evolve with time. Regarding budget, I would say that with a bit of luck and patience, you can pick a Reflex model in working order (in my experience, you can trust sellers if they say it is and they've shot with it) for $250. Try to get what's called a Rex-2 model, which is still cheap (perhaps $350) but has a much improved viewfinder (10x. instead of 6x.). And look for a camera with a set of matched lenses by Kern, Berthiot, or Schneider, or a zoom lens by the same brands and Angénieux too. Besides that, there are other good starter cameras, so search through the past threads on this site and a lot of your questions will be answered ! Info on the history of Bolex : http://www.city-net.com/~fodder/bolex/history/index.html Pictures, accessories, and info, but not always accurate : http://www.bolexequipment.com/HomePage.htm -B

Hi, Your serial number seems to date your camera to 1959. That would be just before the introduction of the Rex-1 model. The Rex-1 is an evolution of the original Bolex H16 Reflex (from 1956) : it's the came camera except for the addition of a variable shutter (quite handy actually). If your camera is a Reflex model, the top viewfider should be fixed to the body of the camera, and the word 'Reflex' should be inscribed on the top of the turret. The Rex-1's variable shutter is controled by a little lever on the side of the turret (controls side of the camera) which pulls out and moves up and down to open/close the shutter. If you don't have the lever, but it's a reflex model, you have an original reflex (also refered to as Rex-0). All the info is very clearly indicated here : http://www.city-net.com/~fodder/bolex/history/index.html

Yes, This motor is a MC-17 motor (also known as Unimotor), and it will work on the camera on the picture (and in fact, on just about any Bolex H8 or H16). Your camera does not have the bottom screw mount for this motor (it appeared a little bit later), but it does not matter. The top screw (it goes into the main spring motor crank shaft) is enough : remove the crank (unscrews clockwise) and screw motor in (counter-closckwise) with the motor drive shaft going into the Bolex rewind shaft). For more details on running it, look at this recent thread : http://www.cinematography.com/forum2004/in...showtopic=11554 Good luck ! -B

Still looking for a silent camera, I came across wat sounds like a good deal : several XTR's formerly owned by the Belgian National TV -- apparently, the last few they had ! They're just out, so there's a chance they had kept the best ones for last... And hopefully, they've been maintained. The price sounds very good, but it's a camera I am not familiar with first hand. So what should I watch out for ? 1) what are the possible problems on XTRs that have been used in the field ? What are the external signs of abuse or issues ? What would you test on the camera to be reasonably sure it's ok (perhaps due for a tune-up, but nothing major), besides the obvious functions : are there tricks, for instance ? 2) What are the accessories that make the camera even better ? (Or those to avoid, if any?) This is an XTR, not an XTR prod. I haven't seen the camera yet, so I can't say anything specific about it, not even the serial #. Are there many variations in XTR's ? I may have a choice between a few cameras, mag, etc., so any pointers would be good ! Thanks ! -B

IF YOUR VIEWFINDER IS RIGHT... indeed, and then again, perhaps, maybe... The point of lens collimation is to text a lens' focus without anything else coming into play (well, besides the collimating system, but it's supposed to be right, obviously). In other words, excluding any possible problem with your camera lens mount, the gate setting, and any part of your reflex viewing system (a complex system in its own right). If you're confident about your camera (and its reflex viewfinder), then you can have a decent idea of your lens's accuracy through the viewfinder. A test roll will give you an even better idea. And a collimation of your lens on your camera (light reflected off the filming gate) will be the ultimate test and most precise way to set it up (accuracy of collimating systems is extremely high). Another way to think about it is that before you start checking things, you need to have at least one thing that you know to be right. Have a test of the lens mount, flange distance, viewfinder accuracy on your camera, and you can check your lenses to a degree, or collimate your lenses and you can check your camera's (or at least viewfinder's) accuracy. Then again, if you've shot with that combination of camera and lens and the results are good, keep shooting ! -B

Mark, More generally, your question is answered on a case by case basis. If these are the lenses that you will actually get, then you have your answer. Otherwise, for each 16mm. lens you would buy, you'd have to find out whether they will cover a full S-16 frame or not. In the case of zoom lenses, it's a little more complicated as a zoom lens may be compatible with S-16 only on part of its range (mostly true of wide-angle zooms : a 10 or 12 -100 zoom, for instance, may cause vignetting below 15 or 16, for instance, and be fine above). If you look throughthe archives, you will find a lot of questions about this or that particuar lens model's compatibility with the S-16 frame. -B

Indeed, that's the safest and simplest way to check for the rear-mount depth of a lens on a Bolex Reflex : swing the turret out, mount the lens fully on a lens port that is outside of the turret area and see if it sticks out. In doubt, swing the turret back, without forcing. I suppose some lenses could stick out beyond the turret plate without touching the prism glass, but do you really want to try ? If so, definitely insert a filter holder as protection. And obviously, your turret will be locked on that lens while shooting. In general, though, regarding CCTV lenses (and not most Television/TV-16 lenses from the 70's, which are film lenses), the first thing to do before getting your hopes up is looking up the lenses specs and make sure that model covers more than 1/3 inch CCDs, (so at least 1/2 or 2/3 inch), as those would not work on film as the image formed is too small. -B

I think you mean "and not the ACL" , no? I'm interested in the answer too... anything besides being profesionally recognized as such ?

Clive, I don't have much first hand experience of the MCE-17B + Voltage regulator setup to power a MM magazine motor, but I'm going on the manuals. In fact, even with the whole setup's factory wiring, the voltage to the MM is 24 Volts (and thus you need to use the special cable to the MM motor that has a grey plastic protection around it, meant for 24V. -- how baroque is that !). Is the point of the Voltage Regulator to insure the motor + mm have enough power (36V./3,5Ah minimum, possibly 48V.) ? And if so, could we really do without it with your re-wiring ? -B