Blue Cyc

Dave Plake · November 24, 2005

I have been cooresponding with Mr Mullen a bit and I'd like to share my dilmea with the whole crew. I have a shoot coming up... 25'widex13'high painted blue cyc. Producer wants a couple of models at a time "hangin out and walkin around a bit". Director wants full body shots but there is just no budget for it. Gaffer and I came up with 20 2k space lights hung from cieling to light the blue wall and floor, couple of blondes for fill, 10k with chimera as key plus genny and cables. Was way too muich money for producer. So now how do I do this BARE BONES, and do it in a studio that only has 100 amps available and we have no money for a generator. Any thoughts on a method of attack and with which lights?

Thanks!

Mitch Gross · November 24, 2005

If he can't afford the spacelights, then how about kinos? A bunch of Wall-o-lites might work well for you but they certainly won't light the space to the level that spacelights would. You could then use smaller fixtures for the talent lights.

Of course in the end I don't know how much cheaper this would be.

In a distant location emergency I once built a wall of light using a sheet of plywood, about 100 light sockets and the brightest standard bulbs (250w) that I could find, all from Home Depot. Took a guy overnight to wire the thing and we were afraid the board might ignite from the heat, but baby was it cheap and bright. Some diffusion in front and we had a great soft source. Just don't try to build one and then hang it bulbs down from the grid--the rising heat is sure to torch that wood.

Laurent Andrieux · November 24, 2005

Is it film or video ? If film, what stock do you plan to use ?

I feel like 20 2k for the cyc + a 10 k + some blondes is a lot of light. Don't mean it is that overrated but may be it would be possible to do it with a bit less of power... After all, cutting off 30 % of your general power is only a 1/2 stop loss...

Also if you are in studio and mind about the general amount of power as well as power consumption, working at 80 % to 90 % of the power, assuming you have a control console, will only lower the color temp a bit so that color timing or the white balance would correct this without a doubt nor a problem...

Don't know if it helps...

I feel like you could do this cutting your list by 2 : 10 2 k for the cyc and 5 k on the foreground sounds to me possible to do - but I may be wrong -, depends on the sensitivity you're working at...

David Mullen ASC · November 24, 2005

He said he had 100 amps total available, which is something like only five or so 2K's here in the US.

Bob Hayes · November 24, 2005

He said he had 100 amps total available, which is something like only five or so 2K's here in the US.

Key with a 2K, Use 2 1k?s as a back lights. Light the cyc with 4 1ks.

a 25' x 13' cyc aint' that big.

Aloha

David Mullen ASC · November 24, 2005

Key with a 2K

He told me in an email that the background to be composited in was some wintery landscape, which I assume is overcast although I could be wrong. So he'd have to recreate that look on the subject. If the background was overcast, then I suggest lighting the subject either by bouncing off of a big 12'x12' overhead frame of UltraBounce, Bleached Muslin, or a Griflon, or hanging a bunch of large Chinese Lanterns overhead.

Kevin Zanit · November 24, 2005

3 5k Skypans with 2k globes (and riser) will cover your screen with no problem.

If the screen is not curved, you could get away with 2 even. Just put them high and on the far left and right sides of the screen.

If you cant afford a few 2k space lights, you could do David's idea, or get some open face nook lights, hang them along with a 4x4 frame of fairly heavy diffusion. You may need to skirt some of the spill, especially toward the screen.

Then key with whatever you want.

Kevin Zanit

Adam Cohen IMPOSTOR · November 24, 2005

Tell the producer you want to shoot it all with flashlights. The maglites. Either she'll give in, or your talent will be walking around with flashlights.

Realistically, large chinaballs from the ceiling, and some kino divalites 400 in front. The flashlight trick only worked once for me.

-Adam Cohen

DP, Los Angeles

Dave Plake · November 29, 2005

Tell the producer you want to shoot it all with flashlights. The maglites. Either she'll give in, or your talent will be walking around with flashlights.

Realistically, large chinaballs from the ceiling, and some kino divalites 400 in front. The flashlight trick only worked once for me.

-Adam Cohen

DP, Los Angeles

K guys, I ended up going witht 9 1K china balls and a 6K key with some pars for fill. I was able to get a 240 amp genny to power it. Thanks for all of your great advice!

Peter J DeCrescenzo · November 29, 2005

K guys, I ended up going witht 9 1K china balls and a 6K key with some pars for fill. I was able to get a 240 amp genny to power it. Thanks for all of your great advice!

Interesting. Glad it worked out.

The suggestion to use overhead & side flo's made the most sense to me given the "overcast" look, and they probably would have consumed far less power compared to what Dave eventually used.

But again, it's all good. I learned a lot from this thread.

All the best,

- Peter DeCrescenzo

David Mullen ASC · November 29, 2005

K guys, I ended up going witht 9 1K china balls and a 6K key with some pars for fill. I was able to get a 240 amp genny to power it. Thanks for all of your great advice!

So how did you arrange the China Balls and 6K - you mean a 6K HMI, right? How did you light the bluescreen and how did you light the subject?

Elhanan Matos · December 1, 2005

I know this is too late, but about a year ago I was working on a green screen shoot where the DP lit the whole cyc (one of the big ones over at Quixote) with 4K arri X-Lights about six or so up on the grid and then all he used on the talent was a couple Image 80's.

Kevin Zanit · December 1, 2005

"studio that only has 100 amps available"

Michael Morlan · December 1, 2005

Dave,

What film or video-quivalent ASA were you shooting at? What were you getting on your meter? What size china balls? Were you able to sufficiently eliminate talent shadows on the floor?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Edited December 1, 2005 by Michael Morlan

Dave Plake · December 4, 2005

Dave,

What film or video-quivalent ASA were you shooting at? What were you getting on your meter? What size china balls? Were you able to sufficiently eliminate talent shadows on the floor?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Hey guys... Mr. Mullen... it actually was a 6K tungsten light that the gaffer had. Can't remember the name... can get it. had never seen it before. That with chimera for key. The chinas were arranged 5 in the front row, 4 in the back on the cieling a few feet apart from each other.

I shot with vision 2 7218 500 ISO. I put the wall at a 5.6 and talent at 8. I shot everything at 64 fps and had enough stop. Went to telecine the other night and it came out excellent. There was some shadow on the floor, but the post guy was at the shoot and said that it was negligible and would be no problem. I too have learned a ton from this thread. This is a great site with great people. Thanks again.

Dave

David Sweetman · December 4, 2005

Glad it worked out, Dave

In a distant location emergency I once built a wall of light using a sheet of plywood, about 100 light sockets and the brightest standard bulbs (250w) that I could find, all from Home Depot. Took a guy overnight to wire the thing and we were afraid the board might ignite from the heat, but baby was it cheap and bright. Some diffusion in front and we had a great soft source. Just don't try to build one and then hang it bulbs down from the grid--the rising heat is sure to torch that wood.

Son of a gun, I think I'll try that. Well, something like that, using about 1/10 of the # of lights. How was the color and quality of the light?