FCP Editing skills

Guy Meachin · May 24, 2004

I'm a student in the UK studying Contemp Film and Video, I'm looking to find some paid work or collaborative work for editing. I use FCP regularly and I'd say I'm fairly good for a student.

I'm a member of a web group 'Shooting People', they email you daily with info of any paid unpaid work. Often there are oppertunities for editing work. I'd like to get some experience in the industry and editing seems the best option at the moment as people often want editing jobs done well and quickly. The problem is that I have no official award or qualification to say I can edit.

Does anyuone know of any courses in the UK that might be of some help to me, I can't find much. Or any advice that might be useful.

Thanks B)

Michael Nash · May 24, 2004

I don't know how things are in England, but much of this industry operates without any "official" proof of qualification. You just have to be able to demonstrate or prove you can do the job. That's usually through a demo reel, a resume, first-hand demonstration, or a personal recommendation.

Cut together a demo reel that illustrates a competency of various editing techniques, and be prepared to "sell" yourself and your talent to prospective employers. You may need to offer new employers one "freebie" where you can demonstrate your ability, in the hopes that they'll hire you for real after that. Don't let yourself be abused by this system, but understand you may need to do this to build up a reel and resume when you're jst starting out.

Guy Meachin · May 25, 2004

Sounds like a good idea to me, will do

Cheers

Phil Rhodes · May 25, 2004

Hi,

> I'm looking to find some paid work or collaborative work for editing

Join the club.

> The problem is that I have no official award or qualification to say I can edit.

Nobody does. All you can do is try to get experience, and since there's so little origination of new material in the UK that's extremely hard to do. There isn't even a union you can join that has any clout. In any case, at the high end nobody's interested in what you can do with FCP on your apple mac. All decent material in this country (which is mainly limited to ads, music promos and one feature film every two years) is cut on very upscale gear somewhere within two hundred feet of Soho Square in London, and unless you can get in with one of those companies (and believe me you can't) you are going absolutely nowhere. The only way to get into those companies is to join as a runner and work for them for six months either for free or for very low pay, pay that in any case certainly won't cover either your train fares into London or living accomodation locally.

After six months you have a five percent chance of moving up from that position into something better (meaning more responsibility and longer hours but almost certainly not better paid at that point) and a ninety-five percent chance of being fired so they can try someone better looking. Even if you do luck out at this point you have about the same chance of being fired every six months for the next ten years, and it will take you at least eight to ten years to become an editor under this system.

This does of course guarantee that in about a decade, every editor, colourist and graphic artist in London will be some chinless upper-class twit from Chelsea named Tristan, whose only qualification was coming from a family rich enough to support him through this period of starving-artist boot-licking.

And no, I didn't say it was either fair or pleasant!

Phil

Guy Meachin · May 25, 2004

I guess your a bit p*ssed off at the mo Phil. Understandably so by the sounds of it!

Have you tried 'Shooting People' (the company that is). Sounds to me like it would be perfect for you to find work. Everyday they'll send you email's about workers/collaboration needed for various stuff. Costs £20 squid to join but it's supposed to be the biggest database in the UK for crew, directors, DOP's looking for work etc.

So you're in the UK Phil, hmm any chance of getting some experience with you or observing some of your work. I've been trying to find work experience but had no luck so far. Nobody seems interested. :angry: Desperate to find some for the summer, do you know of anyone that miight be helpful?

Here's the link for shooting people

http://shootingpeople.org/pcgi/more.pcgi

Guy

Phil Rhodes · May 25, 2004

Hi,

Yes I've been a member of SP for several years and I do occasionally get things through them, but it's probably about twice a year. If more than two per cent of jobs on the list were paid it'd be more useful!

You wouldn't want to observe the kind of work I do, it wouldn't be of any interest. Picture recutting a promo for a corporate trip to Dubai from material originally shot for the Dubai Tourist Board. Not interesting (Pays the bills, I've no complaints, but not interesting!)

Phil

Matt Edwards-Davies · May 25, 2004

This probably isn't the best place to post this, but since we're on the topic of u.k. and work... (Not editing work though...)

Although I live in Canada I can fairly easily obtain a working visa for the u.k. for about two years, and I was considering heading over there sometime in the next year. BUT, I do have some questions of course for people (especially Phil) that work/live in the u.k.

BTW I have little to no experience, and I'm not expecting to make any money... but I wouldn't head over there without knowing the basics about camera loading/cleaning etc.

Obviously London is the epicenter for production over there, but is there much work in other big cities like Edinburgh, Glasgow, Belfast or Dublin?

Are there any big-ish rental houses that accept volunteers or interns? (Either in or outside of London).

I'm not expecting to be a 1st AC or anything (Or even 2nd) but I was hoping to spend time in/around rental houses and maybe as a Camera Assistant Trainee (If such a position even opens up much over there)

Any thoughts on how plausible this is or any advice would be great! Thanks in advance,

Matt Edwards-Davies

Phil Rhodes · May 25, 2004

Hi,

This happens quite a lot; it's not uncommon to find that more than 50% of crew on any shoot in London are from Canada or Australia, generally people here because their great-great-great uncle twice removed was from London. Avoiding for the moment the prickly political issue of whether this is entirely just considering these countries' own stand-offish immigration policies, I'll get to the main point, which is this: you must be on crack if you think the situation here is any better than Canada. There's more film production work going on in every square inch of Canada than there is here. London isn't an epicentre; there isn't anything going on to form an epicentre!

However, there is a saving grace for someone like you - If you head over here with even the rudiments of loading down, you'll be a shoe-in, because most people here know that anyone from the US, Canada or Australia is liable to be many times more experienced than anyone from the UK, because you can get more experience in a week in Canada than you can in five years here. I'm generally lucky to work with ACs who've done a single 35mm production - mostly they've done a lot of video, and maybe two or three 16mm shorts. This would work strongly in your favour, which probably explains the high immigrant rate in local production.

There are rental places but I wouldn't count on an internship. Last time I spoke to Panavision they were practically giving gear away because it wasn't going out; how they support a full-time operation here I don't know, and I get the impression that they barely do. And this leads on to my final point - I don't know about other cities, but presumably there's less going on than in London, if that's possible, and in London you won't just not make money, you'll lose it hand over fist. Unless you manage to do extremely well, the living expenses alone will completely cripple you in a matter of months. I live forty miles outside the centre of London and the living expenses even here are equalled in the US only by Manhattan and the most expensive areas of LA. Unless you get a ten-to-a-house flat share set up, which you probably won't, there is literally no beginners' job whatsoever in London that will pay your expenses - and certainly not in the film "industry," such as it is.

As I say, I have no idea why someone from Canada would want to come here in a million years. The UK is a place where if you want to make a living in film or TV, you leave. Filmmaking isn't a business here, it's a fringe artform, and if you've any intention of making this a career you're better off practically anywhere else.

Phil

Matt Edwards-Davies · May 25, 2004

Wow, Thanks for the detailed response Phil!

Perhaps I should have made my intentions a little bit clearer, but the advice is still valuble nonetheless.

The main thing I would be seeking overseas is the oportunity to live and work in a different culture for some extended amount of time, not necessarily experience in film/tv. Right now is the perfect time in my life to do so, due to certain circumstances. I know that I can volunteer/intern at rental houses in Toronto untill I'm blue in the face, but Toronto ain't London, and I've been to Toronto way too many times.

However, I did think it would be a bonus if I was able to work in a position more in-line with my career path. I had no idea that that was the situation in London. I did, however know how expensive it can be.

Do you think that Australia may fit my requirements a little more closely?

Again, thank you very much for you response. Cheers,

Matt Edwards-Davies

Phil Rhodes · May 25, 2004

Hi,

I don't really know about Australia, but it'd have to try very hard to be a poorer bet than here - plus the weather's better!

Phil

Michael Nash · May 26, 2004

My ex-neighbor (the one I mentioned in another post who used to color-correct "Southpark") got a professional wanderlust and tried to find work in England -- to no avail. He then tried Australia, and ended up in New Zealand.