Good and Bad Experiences at Bristish Film Schools

[Morgan Peline]

It is a material fact that the likelihood of Mr Peline's ever making a living out of the skills he's currently studying are so vanishingly small as to be completely meaningless. Assuming you agree with this (and it really should be axiomatic by now) the content or cost of the course is irrelevant, as is who may once have studied there. The world now is not as it was when Deakins graduated, and neither is NTFS.

 

You're talking utter rubbish.

 

There are so many NFTS cinematography grads earning good money shooting either in commercials, documentaries or tv dramas, you wouldn't believe it. Yes most of them had to spend a few years building up a contact base but they just plugged away.

 

I agree that most other media courses / 'film schools' in this country are pretty useless. However, if you want to work eventually, you need to attend the best school you can find. That is why I attend the best film school in the country bar none.

 

You really actually believe I won't find paid work eventually? Don't be so ridiculous. Of course I will. I'm going to be an 'NFTS grad'. We all end up working in the end. Yes, sometimes it takes up to 10 years to get regular work - that's life. NFTS is not perfect by any means but in this country it is considered the 'best' and therefore taken seriously. Obviously, it won't guarantee me work but people will know I've attended the best and therefore at least look at my reel.

[Morgan Peline]

Camera movement makes the image more dynamic. Many times inexperienced filmmakers (film students like myself definitely included) shoot stuff without really, really thinking about what the camera is doing. One of our mantras at the school is 'Is the camera in really the right place to tell the story in best possible manner?'. Also you can make things much more 'cinematic' and 'visceral' by moving your camera to add to the drama or story.

 

Not that Brian suggests one should move the camera for the sake of it but he believes in making things 'cinematic' which I have come to believe means movement alot of the time or fantastic placement. One of his favourite things is to suggest a very, very slow imperceptable track in to a character at the right moment in the story to add drama even though you might not notice the move, it adds subliminal tension.

 

 

It's quite funny sometimes because at the school we have many Europeans and sometimes they love their static 'observing' camera. Some hate movement because they feel it's 'too Hollywood' - it's a debate we have amongst ourselves constantly.

 

Also Brian doesn't necessarily beleive in motivated camera movement because he feels we should be free to use the camera the way we want to use it not necessarily because a character is moving or not. Look at 'Trainspotting' - all the movement adds to our visceral experience of the film.

 

The absolute favourite mantra is 'Think about what you are doing.'

 

Why?

 

Are you adding to the story?

[Peter Emery]

Hi,

 

I was just reading a post on filmmaker.com in the LOAFS section from someone at UCLA about how people have to 'apply' for money for their thesis films and it's not always guaranteed. And I just thought how lucky I was to have just completed my graduation film at the NFTS...and it was on 16mm...actual neg, which is becoming a rarity these days.

 

So this post is directed at some of our fellow members who are constantly saying what a waste of time it is to go to NFTS and that you should study in the US, blah, blah, blah...because NFTS's teachers are not as good as US teachers and we don't learn real filmmaking like the Americans do...blah, blah, blah.

 

You know who you are!

 

So let's see.

 

I just finished a 6 day shoot last month on 16mm. The school gave us over £10,000 (US$18,900@) as a budget. People in US schools have to either 'apply' for the funds or find it themselves or pay for it themselves.

 

We got given the money. We also got a Steadicam Op; Mike Scott for one scene and I had a Chapman Hybrid Dolly for the whole shoot. We had Barney Clark, who was the lead actor in Roman Polanski's 'Oliver Twist' as our lead actor and Stephen Frears (who directed 'Dangereuses Liaisons' and 'Dirty Pretty things') who used to be the head of teh school, did a cameo. And we had a professional feature film 1st AD (who did some 2nd unit on some James Bond films) as well as a professional Gaffer and a professional Dolly Grip.

 

We shot on location in a large girl's private school and we also shot in studio. We built a musty public school headmasters office in our studio at the school. So I learnt even more about location lighting as well as studio lighting.

 

We also had £10,000 of lighting gear (2 x 2.5 K HMIs Arris Suns and 4 x 4K HMIS plus extras) donated by Lee Lighting for a miniscule fee. And all our film and processing, and transferring is at student prices because we are the NFTS.

 

So my tuition fee this year was £4,100 (US$7,700@) but I got given £4,000 as a maintenance grant so that effectively cancelled out my tuition fee. Last year was the same.

 

And this year I also got given £2,000 scholarship towards my fees as part of the Freddie Francis Memorial Scholarship Fund (I can also now visit the BSC clubhouse every month on their open day! Alec Mills BSC has become my mentor at the BSC because of my scholarship.)

 

So effectively I didn't pay any school fees for two years and the school gave my production a decent budget.

 

In America, it's pay, pay, pay, pay, pay and then maybe you'll work...What are tuition fees like in America? Upwards of $20,000 to $30,000 a year? So which schools really care about their students and which schools are more interested in exploiting them?

 

At the beginning of of next month, I get a 5 week lighting masterclass (shot on 35mm with equipment donated by Panavision) with Billy Williams BSC, who won an Oscar for 'Ghandi' and who also shot 'Women In Love' and 'On Golden Pond'. I also get taught by Brian Tufano BSC my head of studies, who recently completed a feature at Pinewood and in LA - 'I Could Never Be your Woman' starring Michelle Pfeiffer, directed by Amy Heckerling (who also directed 'Clueless'). He has also shot 'Kidulthood' in video stores at the moment, which was in cinemas this year as well as shot 'Billy Elliot' and 'Trainspotting'. We also get a lighting commercials workshop taught by Stuart Harris a very respected commercials DP, who also happens to shoot videos for Pink Floyd... We are also going to be doing a lighting 'big spaces workshop' for a week. And last year I was taught by Paul Wheeler BSC....

 

Next year we have our graduation screenings. One of the days is an industry day when we get professional from the industry including production companies and agents to come and meet with us and watch our work. Nothing will probably come of it but you never know.

 

So obviously...

 

(please note facetious comment directly aimed at members of this forum who are doubting Tomas's who continue to pessimistically believe an education at the NFTS is a total waste of time as obviously we are not as professional as the US films schools - indeed all our English tutors must obviously be incapabale of shooting a decent film...not like tutors at US film schools. True NFTS is not perfect but film school never is and it's what you make of it and well, I'm doing my best to get the most out of it!)

 

I really wasted my precious time coming to study here as I obviously I really couldn't have learnt as much as if I had studied in the US where I could have been one amongst a class of dozens, offered the opportunity to pay tens of thousands of dollars as opposed to being one of a class of six actually GIVEN money to study and make films...ON FILM.

 

Gee, I was such a bad decision to come here to study! Why didn't I bankrupt myself, go to the US to study, pay more money for my grad film, learn much less about oerating and lighting, shoot on HDV and be part of a mass of anonymous students rather than a class of six?..

--------------------

Morgan Peline

Cinematographer

National Film and Television School, UK

www.morganpeline.com

 

 

Hi,

 

I've just been reading through everybody?s experiences with film school.

 

I went to The Surrey Institute. I know endless people who went to the NFTS and other schools. I'm out there shooting now and I also do a little teaching myself at Leeds Metropolitan Uni.

 

And this is what I think: Drop your ego?s stop complaining and use your heads to learn what you can anyway you can. I spent the first year at uni complaining. By the time I got to the 3rd year I just used the system, got what I needed and had my tutorials in the pub. No film schools have enough money and it seems the students are either angry with the tutors or idolise them, what's that about!! The tutors are the same as you, just more experienced. Just get what you can from them.

 

My best piece of advice is work out a plan for yourself. Crewing for the right DPs, film school, shooting and asking an experienced old boy DP to, well, be you?re Godfather.

 

AH I feel better now.

 

Peter Emery

 

 

So let's see.

 

I just finished a 6 day shoot last month on 16mm. The school gave us over £10,000 (US$18,900@) as a budget. People in US schools have to either 'apply' for the funds or find it themselves or pay for it themselves.

 

We got given the money. We also got a Steadicam Op; Mike Scott for one scene and I had a Chapman Hybrid Dolly for the whole shoot. We had Barney Clark, who was the lead actor in Roman Polanski's 'Oliver Twist' as our lead actor and Stephen Frears (who directed 'Dangereuses Liaisons' and 'Dirty Pretty things') who used to be the head of teh school, did a cameo. And we had a professional feature film 1st AD (who did some 2nd unit on some James Bond films) as well as a professional Gaffer and a professional Dolly Grip.

 

We shot on location in a large girl's private school and we also shot in studio. We built a musty public school headmasters office in our studio at the school. So I learnt even more about location lighting as well as studio lighting.

 

We also had £10,000 of lighting gear (2 x 2.5 K HMIs Arris Suns and 4 x 4K HMIS plus extras) donated by Lee Lighting for a miniscule fee. And all our film and processing, and transferring is at student prices because we are the NFTS.

 

 

So my tuition fee this year was £4,100 (US$7,700@) but I got given £4,000 as a maintenance grant so that effectively cancelled out my tuition fee. Last year was the same.

 

And this year I also got given £2,000 scholarship towards my fees as part of the Freddie Francis Memorial Scholarship Fund (I can also now visit the BSC clubhouse every month on their open day! Alec Mills BSC has become my mentor at the BSC because of my scholarship.)

 

So effectively I didn't pay any school fees for two years and the school gave my production a decent budget.

 

In America, it's pay, pay, pay, pay, pay and then maybe you'll work...What are tuition fees like in America? Upwards of $20,000 to $30,000 a year? So which schools really care about their students and which schools are more interested in exploiting them?

 

At the beginning of of next month, I get a 5 week lighting masterclass (shot on 35mm with equipment donated by Panavision) with Billy Williams BSC, who won an Oscar for 'Ghandi' and who also shot 'Women In Love' and 'On Golden Pond'. I also get taught by Brian Tufano BSC my head of studies, who recently completed a feature at Pinewood and in LA - 'I Could Never Be your Woman' starring Michelle Pfeiffer, directed by Amy Heckerling (who also directed 'Clueless'). He has also shot 'Kidulthood' in video stores at the moment, which was in cinemas this year as well as shot 'Billy Elliot' and 'Trainspotting'. We also get a lighting commercials workshop taught by Stuart Harris a very respected commercials DP, who also happens to shoot videos for Pink Floyd... We are also going to be doing a lighting 'big spaces workshop' for a week. And last year I was taught by Paul Wheeler BSC....

 

Next year we have our graduation screenings. One of the days is an industry day when we get professional from the industry including production companies and agents to come and meet with us and watch our work. Nothing will probably come of it but you never know.

 

So obviously...

 

(please note facetious comment directly aimed at members of this forum who are doubting Tomas's who continue to pessimistically believe an education at the NFTS is a total waste of time as obviously we are not as professional as the US films schools - indeed all our English tutors must obviously be incapabale of shooting a decent film...not like tutors at US film schools. True NFTS is not perfect but film school never is and it's what you make of it and well, I'm doing my best to get the most out of it!)

 

I really wasted my precious time coming to study here as I obviously I really couldn't have learnt as much as if I had studied in the US where I could have been one amongst a class of dozens, offered the opportunity to pay tens of thousands of dollars as opposed to being one of a class of six actually GIVEN money to study and make films...ON FILM.

 

Gee, I was such a bad decision to come here to study! Why didn't I bankrupt myself, go to the US to study, pay more money for my grad film, learn much less about oerating and lighting, shoot on HDV and be part of a mass of anonymous students rather than a class of six?..

--------------------

Morgan Peline

Cinematographer

National Film and Television School, UK

www.morganpeline.com

[Morgan Peline]

Another positive about NFTS. Sorry, I can't help myself.

 

Another cool thing about NFTS which I just found outr recently is that we get to go to the CameraImage festival in Poland for eight days this year all expenses paid; flights, hotels and a per diem. I don't see that many US film schools doing that, they're usually too busy making money off their students by charging exorbitant tuition fees.

[Galen Carter-Jeffrey]

Another positive about NFTS. Sorry, I can't help myself.

 

Another cool thing about NFTS which I just found outr recently is that we get to go to the CameraImage festival in Poland for eight days this year all expenses paid; flights, hotels and a per diem. I don't see that many US film schools doing that, they're usually too busy making money off their students by charging exorbitant tuition fees.

 

You're still paying for it through tuition.

 

All the public schools that teach film do not charge "exobitant tuition fees" because they are a public school/university. I would choose my school (University of Texas at Austin) over the OPs school anyday.

[Hal Smith]

All the public schools that teach film do not charge "exobitant tuition fees" because they are a public school/university. I would choose my school (University of Texas at Austin) over the OPs school anyday.

Does UT teach film, video, or both? Any examples of student films doing well in festivals?

Being in OK it might be handy to know what UT's up to.

[Morgan Peline]

You're still paying for it through tuition.

 

All the public schools that teach film do not charge "exobitant tuition fees" because they are a public school/university. I would choose my school (University of Texas at Austin) over the OPs school anyday.

 

Maybe, but my school fees are £4,100 ($7,700) a year. As I am a UK resident I automatically get a £4000 ($7,513) maintenance grant each year. Also this year the school gave me a £2000 ($3,756) scholarship towards my tuition fees. So obviously I still have to pay my living expenses but in terms of tuition, I've come out on top.

 

Not to mention there are only 6 people in my cinematography class.

 

Also unlike many US film schools, every single one of our projects has a budget and most of them are shot on 16mm negative with developping and telecine paid for by the school. We never ever have to pay out of our own pocket, especially our graduation films which have a budget of over £10,000 ($18,776). Also we never ever have to worry about about equipment. We have at least 5 or 6 Arri SR3s as well as 5 or 6 Aaton XTRs as well as 5 digiBetas, 6 HDV Sonys, 4 DVX100s, 6 PD150s and 5 DSR130s amongst other things. All to be used by under 200 students in total. Also as long as we get permission, we are allowed to use all the equiment for personal projects. I'm always shooting shorts etc. using the schools lighitng equipment etc.

 

I'm not necessarily saying all US film schools are bad, but sometimes I get tired of some of the English members of this board constantly saying how great US film schools are when obviously here in England we are very well looked after.

 

We might not be perfect and obviously as with all film schools there are many bad things as well but we ain't that bad either.

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

> We never ever have to pay out of our own pocket

 

This is complete drivel; I've known several NTFS attendees who were scraping money together for course pieces.

 

What you say implies that the school is not anywhere near making money out of you, which is obviously wrong.

 

Phil

[Andy_Alderslade]

And this is what I think: Drop your ego?s stop complaining and use your heads to learn what you can anyway you can. I spent the first year at uni complaining. By the time I got to the 3rd year I just used the system, got what I needed and had my tutorials in the pub. No film schools have enough money and it seems the students are either angry with the tutors or idolise them, what's that about!! The tutors are the same as you, just more experienced. Just get what you can from them.

 

My best piece of advice is work out a plan for yourself. Crewing for the right DPs, film school, shooting and asking an experienced old boy DP to, well, be you?re Godfather.

 

AH I feel better now.

 

As the majority of comments about peoples experiences at film school were positive with the exception of my own I can't help take this comment as being slightly personal.

 

However not that personal ;)

 

What I will say though is, your experience was at Surrey Institute which in correlation with some of the comments here has a really good reputation, and though in a place like that things may not be perfect you are going to recieve a degree of proffesionalism. I know this because one of my classmates on the MA in Bristol did his degree on the course there, and in comparision with Bristol he had very nice things to say about Surrey.

 

At Bristol though there was no proffessionalism, and for £9000 we experienced very little practical work (one 3min documentry on a PD150, 2 basic 16mm camera exercises, and one 10min dissertation film split between 6 crew members), and some very bored bitchy back stabing full time teachers (one of which offered me unwanted sexual advise, and then latter told me his married boss the course director was 'involved with an actress,' another teacher made sure every other student knew that piece of gossip, another teacher used one of our shoots and university money as a climbing holiday.)

 

Infact when i wanted to do camera and lighting, I wasn't able to do the lighting module - they decided that I was to be a producer, that meant i lost out on doing the lighting classes and exercises and was forced to produce (which sent me a little mad!)

 

I don't want to give the impression that I'm a moaner, but I originally started this thread to vent some anger about my experiences and also to let people know that this was a course to avoid. Sometimes you have to moan and complain, otherwise you do get ripped off - the 1st rule of ripping someone off, make fun of the and call them a moaner when they point out the obvious.

 

I think films schools can be a great thing, and maybe in 20 years time i'd like to return to Bristol as a teacher and sack the old teachers try reclaim its old reputation.

 

 

Actually the only good thing about the Bristol MA in Film and Television Production was I was so bored that I started doing exercise and going to the gym for the first time in 4 years. I'm subsequently a lot healthier. :D

[Galen Carter-Jeffrey]

Maybe, but my school fees are £4,100 ($7,700) a year. As I am a UK resident I automatically get a £4000 ($7,513) maintenance grant each year. Also this year the school gave me a £2000 ($3,756) scholarship towards my tuition fees. So obviously I still have to pay my living expenses but in terms of tuition, I've come out on top.

 

Not to mention there are only 6 people in my cinematography class.

 

Also unlike many US film schools, every single one of our projects has a budget and most of them are shot on 16mm negative with developping and telecine paid for by the school. We never ever have to pay out of our own pocket, especially our graduation films which have a budget of over £10,000 ($18,776). Also we never ever have to worry about about equipment. We have at least 5 or 6 Arri SR3s as well as 5 or 6 Aaton XTRs as well as 5 digiBetas, 6 HDV Sonys, 4 DVX100s, 6 PD150s and 5 DSR130s amongst other things. All to be used by under 200 students in total. Also as long as we get permission, we are allowed to use all the equiment for personal projects. I'm always shooting shorts etc. using the schools lighitng equipment etc.

 

I'm not necessarily saying all US film schools are bad, but sometimes I get tired of some of the English members of this board constantly saying how great US film schools are when obviously here in England we are very well looked after.

 

We might not be perfect and obviously as with all film schools there are many bad things as well but we ain't that bad either.

 

 

What US film schools have you been to? I go to a public university and thus when I graduate i will have a Bachelors degree in Science. An actual degree that means something. Granted i will probably never use it, but it's nice to know that I have a degree as a fall back if it should ever come to that.

 

My tuition is around $4,000 a year (two semesters) and we have a shitload of equipment. I dont even know how many 16mm cameras we have. Also being in Austin is a huge bonus, the film community is fantastic.

[Andy_Alderslade]

Hi,

 

> We never ever have to pay out of our own pocket

 

This is complete drivel; I've known several NTFS attendees who were scraping money together for course pieces.

 

What you say implies that the school is not anywhere near making money out of you, which is obviously wrong.

 

Phil

 

The NFTS is heavily subsidised so as far as I know (and i've met quite a few of their gradutates) the UK students do get a lot more value out than the course fees they put in, and the majority will recieve grants unavailble to other MA students.

 

However like most film schools they take more international than EU students, and can subsequently charge them a lot more, so maybe those are the people you know.

 

Remember also that there is probably a big difference between those lucky few who get an MA place there, and money thrown at them and the large number of people who are attending a short course there, who perhaps have more responsiblity over finding their own budgets.

 

Cinematography wise though, the NFTS does have an excellent reputation for outputing students who may not always 'make it big' but do make a very healthy living out of promos, advertising, tv etc.

 

 

Of course this doesn't solve the problem of the hundreds of undergraduates or even masters students who want to experience film production to steer them in a line of production most suiting their talents and interests, perhaps Galen's University of Texas fills that roll in a way perhaps not properly filled by UK universities.

[Morgan Peline]

What US film schools have you been to? I go to a public university and thus when I graduate i will have a Bachelors degree in Science. An actual degree that means something. Granted i will probably never use it, but it's nice to know that I have a degree as a fall back if it should ever come to that.

 

My tuition is around $4,000 a year (two semesters) and we have a shitload of equipment. I dont even know how many 16mm cameras we have. Also being in Austin is a huge bonus, the film community is fantastic.

 

Great to hear it - I'm happy that I am wrong and that not all film schools in the US are crazily expensive. I was more talking about AFI, UCLA and NYU. Good luck - I hope you get to be where you want to be.

[Morgan Peline]

This is complete drivel; I've known several NTFS attendees who were scraping money together for course pieces.

 

Well as I say the last time I looked I was getting given money to study here.

 

But we can agree to disagree. Obviously you know better. You're out there in the harsh dog-eat-dog freelance world and I'm stupid enough to be studying here learning stuff about things that I'll never, ever, use again like exposing film and lighting. It's really tough having to force myself to learn all these really, really useless things!

 

Tomorrow is the last day of our 5 week, 35mm lighting workshop and then we get to see more of our printed rushes at Deluxe next week. I better make the most of it as obviously come graduation, the closest thing I'll get to a camera is probably an old bashed up PD150, if I'm lucky.

 

I'm actually preparing to go get a job at McDonalds as soon as I walk off that stage, certificate in hand. I've been practising the magic phrase real hard: 'Do you want fries with that?'

[Morgan Peline]

However like most film schools they take more international than EU students, and can subsequently charge them a lot more, so maybe those are the people you know.

 

Remember also that there is probably a big difference between those lucky few who get an MA place there, and money thrown at them and the large number of people who are attending a short course there, who perhaps have more responsiblity over finding their own budgets.

 

Not technically true actually - there aren't that many 'international' students here. I would say by my estimation 3/4 to 4/5 of students here tend to be European Union so they pay the £4,100 tuition, but obviously the 'international' students pay £15,000, the same kind of fees that US film students pay at places like AFI or NYU as far as I can tell.

 

In terms of the short course unit - that's run as a seperate entity, though the name says NFTS, the organisation is seperate. Their courses are fairly expensive, but they do do freelance rates.

 

Of course this doesn't solve the problem of the hundreds of undergraduates or even masters students who want to experience film production to steer them in a line of production most suiting their talents and interests, perhaps Galen's University of Texas fills that roll in a way perhaps not properly filled by UK universities.

 

As I've said before I agree that most media courses / film schools in this country are pretty useless and don't actually teach you anything practical or useful. Many of the media students I've worked with didn't have a clue about set etiquette, camera or lighting. I think the problem in this country, especially on BA courses is that the tutors tend to be academics and not practitioners so they just teach their students bad habits, if indeed they teach them anything practical at all.

[Douglas Hunter]

another teacher used one of our shoots and university money as a climbing holiday.)

 

 

You say that as if it were a bad thing. Any money and time spent on climbing is always good! :-)

[Andy_Alderslade]

Morgan,

 

Just wondering if you knew why Brian Tufano always seems to shoot features with the Aaton 35-III (well thats the impression I get), I was off the understanding that it was a noisy camera, so kinda curious what advantages it has for him.

 

Cheers

Andy

[Morgan Peline]

Hi,

 

I know that he likes Aaton 35mm and some other 'smaller' cameras because they tend to be lighter than most other 35mm cameras. He always operates for himself, unless he is working in the US, and usually does a lot of hand-held work.

[Morgan Peline]

You're paying here, and you most certainly won't work.

 

I just got hired do a six week job shooting a low-budget feature on a Sony HDW900.

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

Jeez, I've done that. You making more than minimum wage?

 

Phil

[Morgan Peline]

Hi,

 

Jeez, I've done that. You making more than minimum wage?

 

Phil

 

Yep. Not a load but not bad, probably what you would get on a low budget corporate except that this is for 6 weeks. I'll be able to pay my rent for the next few months and it keeps the wolves away from door and gets me more new footage for my showreel to get to the next better job. As the saying goes, Rome wasn't built in a day and all that.

[Adam Razvi]

I initially started reading this thread because I'm currently in my 3rd year of a BA Film Studies course at University College Falmouth in Cornwall and was intregued to find out other students experiences, but I guess the thread didnt really pan out that way!

 

Thanks Morgan for offering an insight in to the NFTS course - I would love to go there one day, but in the mean time need to build a showreel that Im proud of - Its only been over the past year or so that Ive been practicing and reading up on cinematography seriosly.... and enjoying every minute of it!

 

Phil... I dont get why you care for putting severe downers on other peoples ambitions and dreams - somebody has to live them and I would like to think it is those with passion and commitment. You're obviously very bitter, so it would probably be better to say nothing than dis-encouraging and just generally 'dis' others with your negativity.

 

To positive thinkers... What is the best way to gain experience with film, on film sets? I've heard of FT2 for trainee work, but apparently the competition is hardcore. Does anybody know of other schemes? Also... Morgan, do you guys at the NFTS ever need runners/camera trainees to help out?

 

Many Thanks,

 

Adam

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

> I dont get why you care for putting severe downers on other peoples ambitions and dreams

 

Then you haven't been paying attention.

 

All I'm trying to do is to avoid people wasting an awful lot of time and money and ending up in the same position I'm in. I've never done anything other than be a film/TV freelancer, and I am therefore completely unemployable at any other job. This is not a good time to be a penniless starving artist in London. What you need is a lot of money very very fast, more than almost any other city in the world, and the film industry cannot provide it.

 

Phil

[freddie bonfanti]

Phil,

 

your theory seems to be right when its applied to you, but what about people like Seamus McGarvey BSC, Roger Deakins BSC and many other BSC members that started off low and eventually made it, thanks to their perseverance and commitment?

their situation at the very beginning wasnt much different from Morgan's, mine's or Andy's.

 

i have the luck to know Seamus in person: he often told me how much he struggled over the years and almost quit his passion to get a job that would guarantee a secure income. but in the end he kept going, and look at him now.

 

you should stop discouraging people this way. maybe it didnt work out for you, but some of us youngsters will make it, i guarantee you.

[Matthew Buick]

I wouldn't be so blunt, Freddie.

 

Phil Rhodes could hit the big time at any time, and there's no guarrantee you will, either, so don't put the guy down.

 

I know I most certainly won't, but as long as I can light and frame a shot I'll be happy. :)

 

Success doesn't always guarrantee happiness, just enjoy not being a success, then you can't wind up dissapointed if you don't make it.

 

Phil Rhodes, if you don't have any qualifications go and get some, I've been pretty ill recently, and expect to gain only three GCSEs at the utter most, yet I'm going to do them again and again until I have them all!!!

 

And nothing's going to stop me from reaching my academic goal!!! :)

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

> your theory seems to be right when its applied to you, but what about people like Seamus McGarvey BSC,

> Roger Deakins BSC and many other BSC members

 

Yes, I can name-drop as well, but you've dug your own grave here. How many people are interested compared to those who'll ever achieve anything? The odds of success are so vanishingly, hopelessly minute that it's entirely reasonable to ignore them altogether.

 

> that started off low and eventually made it, thanks to their perseverance and commitment?

 

Yes, fine. And huge, gigantic, heaping amounts of luck.

 

It's got nothing to do with commitment or perseverance, or at least nothing solely to do with that; there's just a proportion of people who'll get somewhere and an overwhelmingly larger number of people who won't, no matter how much they persevere and commit.

 

At some point, your commitment should be to a workable lifestyle and a secure future. I am not at all happy about subsidising, through state benefits, the unemployability of most film crew. I do not wish to be a burden to the younger generation when I retire. Economic efficiency (in the technical sense) demands that we take at least some responsibility for our futures; aiming to work in the film industry is grossly irresponsible.

 

Phil