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Break-in...


Jim Jannard

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Jim, why dont you look after your project man. If I had reserved one, I would be pissed right now. But not at the burgler but at you for not protecting our interest. Sir, it all comes down to you. You are the leader and the praise and the blame stops at you. I assume 20+ years in business taught you that much.

 

Terrific logic, dude... let's blame Jim for the break-in! While we're at it, we should blame the Jews (and other minorities) for getting killed by the Nazi's - after all, they could have taken proper precautions to defend themselves. You have no idea of what the security setup is over there at RED, you have no idea what the break-in situation is, and you obviously have no reason to be saying anything anyway as you are, in fact, not a reservation holder. Please stop making yourself look like a huge anus.

Edited by Pasty Jackson
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Terrific logic, dude... let's blame Jim for the break-in! While we're at it, we should blame the Jews (and other minorities) for getting killed by the Nazi's - after all, they could have taken proper precautions to defend themselves. You have no idea of what the security setup is over there at RED, you have no idea what the break-in situation is, and you obviously have no reason to be saying anything anyway as you are, in fact, not a reservation holder. Please stop making yourself look like a huge anus.

 

If its such a great security setup than it makes it seem even more like an inside job.

 

Might I also remind you that Cinematography.com has a real name policy. I have never heard

of anyone named Pasty as a real name. Correct me if Im wrong.

Edited by Matthew W. Phillips
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If its such a great security setup than it makes it seem even more like an inside job.

 

Might I also remind you that Cinematography.com has a real name policy. I have never heard

of anyone named Pasty as a real name. Correct me if Im wrong.

 

Maybe a fast food worker who do not speak good English?

 

http://www.cinematography.com/forum2004/in...st&p=127027

 

Mate, I'm sorry that but I couldn't resist... :lol:

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Even IF it were all a hoax, it still benefits us because it's created competition, whether real or fake.

 

You can't be serious?

 

Taking people's money for a product you never intend to deliver is called fraud, people go to jail for such things.

 

Now I'm not saying that is the case with JJ and Red. But hoax's are not typically beneficial, especially when people are laying down cash.

 

R,

 

PS: Cleaning up the glass? Next time try iron bars.

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Ted Schilowitz, head/leader of RED @dvxuser.com forums (circa thirty minutes ago):

 

«Hello everyone,

 

I'm not a big forum poster as most of you know. I leave that to the trained forum professionals like Jim, Jarred, Graeme and Stuart while I focus on other parts of the RED machine.

 

But in this case I'm not satisfied to just read the posts and enjoy all the points of view like I normally do.

 

First I want to thank each and every one of the people here that have expressed their concern and support for the recent events that have occurred. The good news is equipment can be replaced, no one was hurt, and we will not be slowed down by this "random" attack. Whether or not is was something more than that I will leave for others to speculate. We certainly have our thoughts on why this has occurred. My nature is to think the best in people, but in this case... well maybe not.

 

For those on other forums that have speculated that this is some sort of publicity stunt, well that is patently offensive. I was there for the aftermath, Jarred was there, others (including substantial law enforcement) were there - What happened was very real, and quite disturbing.

 

OK - that's it for me. Back to the engineering and other tasks at hand - One thing I can guarantee is that this will not stop us, will not slow us down, and if anything has motivated us even more than our usual 178% to achieve our goals... we'll they've certainly stirred up my hornet's nest. (now I'm done talking about this - I've got things to do to make you all happy)

 

+ Ted»

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Some people here just don?t seem very bright.

 

It isn?t a cover up to hide something from investors. There are no ?investors? since Jim is paying for it all himself- and even if Red doesn?t make a penny it won?t be a hardship for the man. It isn?t chump change but for him it probably isn?t much more than two or three percent of his personal worth.

 

If Red manages to get Red One to market with the capabilities and pricing that they are targeting then there is no need for theatrics and if they don?t hit their targets... well then no amount of theatrics will sell the product. While you might not be smart enough to figure that out I?m pretty sure that he is. That?s almost as idiotic as thinking that Jim Jannard has set this up to scam ac few million dollars out of people.

 

As for thinking that it was to cover up problems they?ve had in development? He?s said that it won?t delay them more than a day or two, and since he has stated previously that they were weeks ahead of schedule it doesn?t really make sense as a delaying tactic now does it? I suppose you imagined him scheming away in his lair trying to find some way to hide the fact that he is only twelve days ahead of schedule rather than fifteen?

 

I can?t understand the hate on some people have for this endeavor and Jim personally? You act as if he just told you that your baby is really, really ugly and that his kids are way cuter. Jim, through Red, is simply trying to engineer a really good camera at a great price. He has taken the unprecedented step of opening up the design and engineering process with the expressed intent to gather constructive feedback from the community he is targeting. And some of you just can?t help but peeing in the pool and congratulate yourself on how cool you are.

 

I have put my deposit on a Red Camera but I certainly haven?t drank the kool-aid. If he succeeds I?ll happily pay the remainder but if for some reason he can?t pull off the engineering required and falls short of the target... then I will simply thank him for the effort and get my money back. And I?m not worried about getting my money back. Maybe you would jeopardize a multi-billion dollar personal fortune for a couple million dollars- but that is probably one of the reasons he has that kind of money and you don?t? Just because lies, deceit and fraud is the first place that your mind goes doesn?t mean that is how others operate.

 

Faking a robbery would have no upside for Jim or Red and would have several real drawbacks. Jumping to that conclusion shows a mean, petty spirit and an intellect in dire need of remedial courses in logic and reasoning.

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Clint, if you think people become Billionaires by being honest upright folk, you need to do your research. I quit being a business major because of the many awful and cruel stories of businessmen and their practices, which are largely acceptable in that field. For instance, car manufacturers who would rather pay out settlements instead of recalling cars because its cheaper to let people die than to recall the cars. Thats about how business works.

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Why are you posting that? I already read it at DVXuser.com. I dont need to read it here too. You couldve posted a link but this is just spam.
Yes, it could be a link. It wasn't my intention to give you spam. But...

 

Maybe all this buzz around this FUD justifies this enlightenment. They were posted serious things about people here. Regarding this project, as well. There are some interests around. I have my money on this new camcorder as a reservation holder. And there are other cinematography.com members with the same interest. It's our project too. As customers. And I take my commitments very seriously.

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Faking a robbery would have no upside for Jim or Red and would have several real drawbacks. Jumping to that conclusion shows a mean, petty spirit and an intellect in dire need of remedial courses in logic and reasoning.
IF it could be the case (I don't believe it but aside the facts like other testimonies, Jim's reaction, Ted's statement, including our own beliefs, etc) wouldn't it be smarter wait for the reservations close after October 31?!

 

Frankly, it doesn't make ANY sense -- just FUD (shame on you) ...

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Clint, if you think people become Billionaires by being honest upright folk, you need to do your research. I quit being a business major because of the many awful and cruel stories of businessmen and their practices, which are largely acceptable in that field. For instance, car manufacturers who would rather pay out settlements instead of recalling cars because its cheaper to let people die than to recall the cars. Thats about how business works.

 

 

Actually, business does reward honest and upright behavior. Of course some people build up big companies through nefarious means but for every one of those there are a hundred who get there through hard and smart work done ethically.

 

As for car recalls, most of that is about lawyers with a hard-on for cash settlements, politicians needing a soapbox and activists who have a deep seeded need to save the world and so invent problems to solve. Dishonest and lowdown behavior from these people have resulted in hundreds of millions of dollars lost, thousands of people loosing their jobs, the price of cars forced up so people have to make do with the old car that should be scrapped. How much did the invented problem of unintended acceleration cost? Addled people hammering the accelerator to the floor thinking it was the brakes took some good and safe cars off the road. How about the faking of problems with the side saddled fuel tanks of certain generations of GM pickups? The lawyers and activists trying like hell to get them off the road or recalled despite the fact that they had a lower overall mortality rate than either Ford or Dodge pickups of the same generation. They could care less about people dying, they just wanted the payout or the glory.

 

Every automobile out there is a trade of on safety versus cost versus efficiency versus reliability versus performance... there are no ?safe? cars, only a spectrum and to recall every vehicle that someone imagines has a higher accident rate than they feel it should would be insane. The car companies have to make a judgment call and it is a sliding scale... that they do sometimes take too far. But I still think that they?ve ended up on the side of right far more often than not.

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Clint, if you think people become Billionaires by being honest upright folk, you need to do your research. I quit being a business major because of the many awful and cruel stories of businessmen and their practices, which are largely acceptable in that field. For instance, car manufacturers who would rather pay out settlements instead of recalling cars because its cheaper to let people die than to recall the cars. Thats about how business works.

Yeah, I saw fight club too.

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The callous remarks to J. Jannard are rude, not funny. It's easy to take potshots at someone trying to do something great, whether that person is a writer, a cinematographer, or in this case, a camera designer. But doubting the fact there was a theft? That scenario makes little business sense, if any.

 

At the very least, Phil's dissent, where appropriate, is intelligent and reasoned.

 

We should be welcoming resources like j. jannard to this site, not running them off... while most people here love to see Jim, David or other industry pros visit this site, a couple people on here have no compunction about ruining this site's resources.

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Just for the record, I certainly did not mean to suggest that the break in was a publicity stunt or hoax. That too would make for interesting fiction, but since there is no mention of it on the website, I would tend to think that they would be seeking more....publicity than to just post it here and on dvxuser. Also the already raised arguments that they have stated that it will not slow down production, etc. I didn't mean to be callous in my remarks, just ironic speculation, but since no major damage seems to have been done to the project, it seems more like a severely infuriating annoyance than a tragedy (all due respect).

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but since no major damage seems to have been done to the project, it seems more like a severely infuriating annoyance than a tragedy (all due respect).

 

Hi,

 

I don't think we will ever know how much damage has been done to RED by the robbery. I hope it's minor and the camera is delivered on time.

 

Stephen

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Some people here just don?t seem very bright.

Yeah, especially those expecting a refund.

I have put my deposit on a Red Camera but I certainly haven?t drank the kool-aid. If he succeeds I?ll happily pay the remainder but if for some reason he can?t pull off the engineering required and falls short of the target... then I will simply thank him for the effort and get my money back.
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Yeah, especially those expecting a refund.

 

Yeah, cause that's what billionaires do, they spend millions ripping people off for a few hundred thousand dollars and then spend millions more on lawyers avoiding jail time. You figure smart business decisions like that are what put Jim Jannard where he is today?

 

Actually, I'm not really expecting a refund, I'm thinking that the odds are better than even that Red will get the camera finished and on the market so that I can put that money towards the purchase price. If it doesn't get to market only an addlepated fool would expect there to be a problem getting the refund.

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Yeah, cause that's what billionaires do, they spend millions ripping people off for a few hundred thousand dollars and then spend millions more on lawyers avoiding jail time. You figure smart business decisions like that are what put Jim Jannard where he is today?

 

Actually, I'm not really expecting a refund, I'm thinking that the odds are better than even that Red will get the camera finished and on the market so that I can put that money towards the purchase price. If it doesn't get to market only an addlepated fool would expect there to be a problem getting the refund.

 

 

One thing you havent considered Clint is that Jim could indeed give you a product, but it can be a crap product if he wanted because he makes no guarantee as to specifications or anything honestly. So you can be on the hook for the remaining 16,500 only to receive a subpar product. Not saying he would do it, but there would be nothing illegal if he did.

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One thing you havent considered Clint is that Jim could indeed give you a product, but it can be a crap product if he wanted because he makes no guarantee as to specifications or anything honestly. So you can be on the hook for the remaining 16,500 only to receive a subpar product. Not saying he would do it, but there would be nothing illegal if he did.

 

Nobody who has reserved a RED camera is "on the hook" for anything. A reservation is not a commitment to purchase. The specs and performance will be known before initial deliveries. And while specs are not finalized now because the product is still in development, at some point they'll be frozen and purchasers will know what they're buying. What's the point of spinning highly unlikely hypothetical scenarios? And why are you so suspicious of J. Jannard's intentions? His history in business is one of major success and his reputation seems similarly strong. At some point caution and skepticism just twists into paranoia. It's very tedious.

Edited by Greg Lowry
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If it doesn't get to market only an addlepated fool would expect there to be a problem getting the refund.

It's inconceivable that anyone could make a statement like that with a straight face. C'mon. You were kidding...right? Come to think of it, only an "addlepated fool" would put a deposit on something that was still in R & D. That's a terrible business practice, fraudulently preying on the naive. Perhaps your indignation should be focused more on the perpetrators, rather than those who're merely pointing it out. Swallowing everything someone tells you, especially regarding such things as their massive personal bank account (which shouldn't be anyone's business), is hardly a virtue.

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It's inconceivable that anyone could make a statement like that with a straight face. C'mon. You were kidding...right? Come to think of it, only an "addlepated fool" would put a deposit on something that was still in R & D. That's a terrible business practice, fraudulently preying on the naive. Perhaps your indignation should be focused more on the perpetrators, rather than those who're merely pointing it out. Swallowing everything someone tells you, especially regarding such things as their massive personal bank account (which shouldn't be anyone's business), is hardly a virtue.

 

Mr. Goulder, it's nice to know that someone has the courage to say that putting money down on an unfinished product is not good business. And I echo your frustration with people who act like because he has a fat bank account, that he has character.

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It's inconceivable that anyone could make a statement like that with a straight face. C'mon. You were kidding...right? Come to think of it, only an "addlepated fool" would put a deposit on something that was still in R & D. That's a terrible business practice, fraudulently preying on the naive. Perhaps your indignation should be focused more on the perpetrators, rather than those who're merely pointing it out. Swallowing everything someone tells you, especially regarding such things as their massive personal bank account (which shouldn't be anyone's business), is hardly a virtue.

 

Forbes recently listed Jim Jannard in their top 400 wealthiest Americans, with assets of $1.4 billion if I recall correctly. But perhaps that information was "planted" as part of the elaborate RED conspiracy.

 

I don't know why you guys presume to be the guardians of other people's money, i.e. those who may choose to put $1000 down to reserve a RED camera. It's their money, not yours. Why does what other people do with their money so offend you?

 

Having said that, I'm embarrassed to have been sucked in by your ridiculous trolling.

Edited by Greg Lowry
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Forbes recently listed Jim Jannard in their top 400 wealthiest Americans, with assets of $1.4 billion if I recall correctly. But perhaps that information was "planted" as part of the elaborate RED conspiracy.

 

I don't know why you guys presume to be the guardians of other people's money, i.e. those who may choose to put $1000 down to reserve a RED camera. It's their money, not yours. Why does what other people do with their money so offend you?

 

Having said that, I'm embarrassed to have been sucked in by your ridiculous trolling.

Don't be. You also shouldn't be sucked in by one member of a company offering a reward on this forum, while at the same time someone else from the company is insinuating on a different forum that they already do know who's responsible. It's insulting to play the members of this forum for a bunch of suckers. One should question the motivation for any aspect of this matter being posted in the first place. Your obsession with this guy's wealth is beyond ridiculous.

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