M. David Mullen & The Astronaut Farmer in AC

[David Sweetman]

Saw it today; some bad news today had me considering giving up filmmaking. If I didn't have a short in the can after last night, combined with this film today, I think I probably would have. Usually I'm not one for optomism - I'm more interested in absurdity, nothingness, and depression - but I think because of my state of mind this film really rang true. Long day, but I think all of these things combined have made me more emboldened than ever to continue in film. Thanks David & the Polish bros for a great film.

[Jim Feldspar]

Saw it today; some bad news today had me considering giving up filmmaking. If I didn't have a short in the can after last night, combined with this film today, I think I probably would have. Usually I'm not one for optomism - I'm more interested in absurdity, nothingness, and depression - but I think because of my state of mind this film really rang true. Long day, but I think all of these things combined have made me more emboldened than ever to continue in film. Thanks David & the Polish bros for a great film.

 

David S. , you're always a great enthusiast of film. Stick with it. You're an asset to this forum

and your enthusiasm will make you a great filmmaker (just stop doing handheld shots on the

hoods of moving cars with nothing securing you!)

 

 

 

David M., can't wait to see the film (it's first on my list; I haven't been able to get to the theater

since October!)

[JD Hartman]

First, I haven't seen the film yet, plan plan to. I went to look for local showtimes and read quite a few negative reviews from viewers. Not about the cinamatography, directing or any of the technical aspects of filmmaking, but about the story itself. Implausible, totally unrealistic, made no sense, insulting to Nasa and the scientists of the Apollo program and other comments. Did any thoughts like these cross your mind as you reviewed the script. I realize that we make (and watch) films for entertainment, but isn't there supposed to be some glimmer of realism, even in a story like this one?

This is not intended to be a criticism or critique, I'd just like to know your thoughts on the screenplay.

[David Mullen ASC]

I love the Polish Bros. screenplays! They are a cinematographer's wet dream, being so visual. They perhaps take a slightly more humorous anti-government tact than I would (perhaps they are more politically leaning towards being Libertarian-esque versus my liberal Kennedy/Johnson-era Democrat attitudes, I really don't know) but you have to remember that their films are fables of Americana.

 

I did a lot of research on the side, as they did originally, for the movie actually to get details right about the launch sequence, etc. and I don't think the general DIY rocket concept is unrealistic, just certain details like being able to get ahold of Atlas/Mercury technology when they are now valuable museum pieces, and why the barn doesn't burn to the ground, etc. Other issues are left unanswered, like how to maintain radio contact on the other side of the globe.

 

But I recall once we planned on working on a cable TV movie or something regarding a real-life incident where a rancher in Idaho(?) was accidentally allowed to purchase a nuclear missle at a military junkyard auction, only then to have the government realize its mistake and come down on him. Something like that.

 

As for scripts in general (not theirs) most that I read are crappy, low or higher in budget, doesn't matter. I could either sit at home and never work... or I can shoot them and have an income. Nobody really wants to hear a DP's view on the quality of the screenplay anyway.

[Hal Smith]

In normal situations, you'd find Eterna to be slightly more pastel than Kodak Vision 5218, more like the color pallette of Expression 500T but less grainy than that stock. It's just that in this case, you're talking about a scene lit with colored lighting.

I think I understand what you're saying. The Eterna will give an accurate rendition of highly saturated color, if that's what's presented to it by lighting and, I assume, set and costume design. Does 5218 behave the same with saturated color or is that a particularly Fuji virtue?

[Matthew Buick]

In normal situations, you'd find Eterna to be slightly more pastel than Kodak Vision 5218, more like the color pallette of Expression 500T but less grainy than that stock. It's just that in this case, you're talking about a scene lit with colored lighting.

 

The exteriors were shot on Fuji F-64D, which is more saturated & contrasty than Eterna. But in the D.I., we made the Eterna stocks look a little more contrasty to match the look of the older Super-F series stocks.

 

Hi David.

 

Do you find yourself using Fuji stock over the dominant Kodak very often? And if so, why?

 

Sorry to be a naggin' question asker, just interested, that's all.

[Rupe Whiteman]

Saw it today; some bad news today had me considering giving up filmmaking. If I didn't have a short in the can after last night, combined with this film today, I think I probably would have. Usually I'm not one for optomism - I'm more interested in absurdity, nothingness, and depression - but I think because of my state of mind this film really rang true. Long day, but I think all of these things combined have made me more emboldened than ever to continue in film. Thanks David & the Polish bros for a great film.

 

Hey David,

 

... Mate' - don't give up, from reading your posts here and there you've obviously got a lot going for you and you're a lot more together than I ever was as a student 20 years ago! - It is deeply tough (in life and work) out there but those with passion and commitment should always carry on... otherwise all that is left is the ones with all the ambition but none of the talent...

 

Chin up as we say in 'blighty...

[Jonathan Bowerbank]

Nobody really wants to hear a DP's view on the quality of the screenplay anyway.

 

I can attest to this...which is why, usually, when someone asks me how's the script for a project I'm working on, I'm usually very vague in my description. If it's a particularly poor script, I'll usually say "It's OK, the crew's great, I'm just tryin' to make it look good." Whereas with a good script I'll say, "It's great! I'm just tryin' to make it look good!".

 

:)

[David Mullen ASC]

I once read this story abour Roy Wagner, ASC in an old AC issue, I think, where he said he was hired on a show and the producers asked for an honest opinion about the script, and he pointed out some third act flaws or something minor and they replaced him with someone more "enthusiastic" for the script. I read this a long time ago so I may have the details wrong, but the lesson learned is that producers and directors just want to know that the DP is going to give them 100%, so don't mention that you have problems with parts of the script unless these are long-term associates of yours where honesty is not punished.

[Max Jacoby]

(perhaps they are more politically leaning towards being Libertarian-esque versus my liberal Kennedy/Johnson-era Democrat attitudes, I really don't know)

Have you read 'The Life of Lyndon Johnson' by Robert A. Caro? Best biography I have ever read. Can't wait for the fourth volume to come out!

[Jim Feldspar]

Have you read 'The Life of Lyndon Johnson' by Robert A. Caro? Best biography I have ever read. Can't wait for the fourth volume to come out!

 

The book does look good! but 1232 pages? How long did it take you?

[David Mullen ASC]

Have you read 'The Life of Lyndon Johnson' by Robert A. Caro? Best biography I have ever read. Can't wait for the fourth volume to come out!

 

My wife read "Master of the Senate" (volume 3?). I'm planning on eventually tackling those books. When I shot "Dot" ("The Quiet") in Austin, TX, I was able to go to the Johnson presidential library/museum.

 

I got two biographies of Thomas Edison sitting here to read once I wrap up shooting on "Big Love"...

[David Mullen ASC]

Do you find yourself using Fuji stock over the dominant Kodak very often? And if so, why?

 

I usually try and alternate on every show between Kodak and Fuji, just depends on a lot of factors. I've been shooting miles of Kodak everyday on "Big Love" (although I did not make the original decision on that) and I shot "Akeelah and the Bee" on Kodak.

 

One reason I sometimes choose Fuji is that most people choose Kodak -- not because I'm a contrarian, but it's just that I feel that the subtle difference in look might set my photography apart from the majority of features shot these days on 5218 mostly. But it's a really subtle distinction these days and a D.I. will do more to affect the look than the difference between Eterna 500T and Kodak '18 naturally have.

 

But if I'm shooting for direct print, I'd make the choice partly on the degree of saturation/contrast/grain I want to achieve. But if I'm shooting a project where it matters less, the difference in look between Fuji Eterna and Kodak Vision-2, then I might tell the production to see who has to better deal if it helps me shift some of the budget over to other cinematography items.

 

Tony Brown, I remember how much you complained about the look of the new Kodak Vision-2 stocks... you said you couldn't get them to look contrasty enough in a transfer.

[Max Jacoby]

The book does look good! but 1232 pages? How long did it take you?

There's 3 volumes: 'The Path to Power', 'Means of Asccent' and 'Master of the Senate'. It's over 2000 pages in total, but it reads really well. I went through about 200 pages a day I remember.

 

Caro does extensive research and it takes him on average over 10 years to write one volume. Which means that the fourth and last one will only come out in 5 years at the earliest...

[Jim Feldspar]

There's 3 volumes: 'The Path to Power', 'Means of Asccent' and 'Master of the Senate'. It's over 2000 pages in total, but it reads really well. I went through about 200 pages a day I remember.

 

Caro does extensive research and it takes him on average over 10 years to write one volume. Which means that the fourth and last one will only come out in 5 years at the earliest...

 

I've been wanting to check it (them, I guess) out. Have a lot of interest in Kennedy/Johnson,

having heard a lot here in Boston. With your strong recommendation, I'll get started as soon

as I finish my books about the Boston mob. It'll be a change (I hope.)

 

Since this is a cinematography forum: I think that Randy Quaid played LBJ in a t.v. movie

or miniseries in the past 10-15 years or so. Didn't see it though.

 

"The Astronaut Farmer" is next on my list when I go to the theater. I haven't been seeing as

many movies or finishing my reading other things because I tend to spend that time reading

the postings and archives on here.

[Lance Flores]

Have you read 'The Life of Lyndon Johnson' by Robert A. Caro? Best biography I have ever read. Can't wait for the fourth volume to come out!

 

Interesting off topic thread. The Polish Bros. screenplays do reflect their "classical liberal" (libertarian) influence, particularly in their vision of the story. One of their stories in particular, that I really liked, was Northfork. Some of the critics didn't, I think perhaps, because the story didn't fit the standard Hollywood script/story model. If you haven't seen Northfork you ought to buy or rent it. Excellent cinematography that captured the visual essence of the picture. That's where I came to noticed Mr. Mullen's cinematography work. In my opinion and from my observation, some of his best work.

 

But -- as far as The Life of Lyndon Johnson - well, I got though the first third, and like most books about politicians, found, there is far too many apologies that glorify the ends; and far too less to explain real motives and character. I had the advantage of having a home room teacher, also my Texas history teacher, Clyde Jones, who was Lyndon's childhood companion. He was quite easy to entice into talking about Lyndon, during class or after school hours. The other spoiler was my familiarity with his political career; much of my opinion being formed in over the fence line and small town café conversations with John Connally whose ranch was close to one of our family’s ranches near Floresville. It seems candid conversation and insight make for loss of the mystique and enjoyment of other’s biographies about political animals, particularly the secrets surrounding them. Many political writers describe LBJ as a complex man, but I found him to have been a simple man involved in many complex events.

Edited March 4, 2007 by Lance Flores

[David Mullen ASC]

My impression, from others who read the books, is that Caro is not "glorifying" Johnson. Rather, he is interested to the point of obsession, as in many of his other bios, with the acquisition and then application of political power, both for good (like the Great Society programs) and bad (the Vietnam War.)

 

I don't think he shies away from tales of Johnson's power grabs, his bullying, stealing the election from Coke Robert Stevenson (my wife says that Caro writes in his intro that Johnson "stole thousands of votes" in that election). But if that's all that Johnson did, grab power, then Caro would not have been interested in him as a subject. It's always the use and misuse of power that interests him.

 

The fact that Caro is going to live in Vietnam for a year, I've heard, to help him write the next volume, suggests that he is not planning on glorifying Johnson.

[JD Hartman]

I did a lot of research on the side, as they did originally, for the movie actually to get details right about the launch sequence, etc. and I don't think the general DIY rocket concept is unrealistic, just certain details like being able to get ahold of Atlas/Mercury technology when they are now valuable museum pieces, and why the barn doesn't burn to the ground, etc. Other issues are left unanswered, like how to maintain radio contact on the other side of the globe.

 

As for scripts in general (not theirs) most that I read are crappy, low or higher in budget, doesn't matter. I could either sit at home and never work... or I can shoot them and have an income. Nobody really wants to hear a DP's view on the quality of the screenplay anyway.

 

I don't understand why a producer wouldn't want the DP's views on the script. If you have agreed to work on the project, anything you say could only make it better. I also can see your point about being silent or risk being replaced. If it comes down to working and being silent or being correct, I agree with your choice of silence.

 

On a short that I worked on the art department was tasked with simulating handgun hits on metal award plaques. He and the producers decided that the plaque should fly into pieces when hit. They were going to saw them up, puzzle piece fashion. While I'm no marksman, I have fired a number of weapons. I just had to tell the "experts", that it just doesn't happen that way. I suppose they should have budgeted for an armorer or a special effects person.

[David Mullen ASC]

That's a different scenario, discussing how realistic to make gunfire for a shot. Sometimes a writer describes a physical action that simply doesn't make logical sense and you have to modify it for the scene -- especially if the scene described didn't take the final location into account. But sometimes you have to go with the illogical action that the writer describes for artistic reasons (like the classic "person being blown back through a window by a gunshot blast" which the Mythbusters team couldn't recreate even when firing shotguns at close range into a pig carcass...)

 

I have pointed out mistakes in scripts, but mainly when I think it was unintentional by the writer, some dangling holdover from an earlier draft maybe.

[James Erd]

On a short that I worked on the art department was tasked with simulating handgun hits on metal award plaques. He and the producers decided that the plaque should fly into pieces when hit. They were going to saw them up, puzzle piece fashion. While I'm no marksman, I have fired a number of weapons. I just had to tell the "experts", that it just doesn't happen that way. I suppose they should have budgeted for an armorer or a special effects person.

 

I'm sort of torn on this point my self although I can't come down firmly on either side of the fence. A good portion of the SPFX I see in movies are not very realistic, and that some times ruins the story for me. When some one gets shot, and they some how get knocked back five or even ten feet by the bullet as opposed to simply crumpling to the ground, or when the wall behind them looks like a Jackson Pollock painting.... that isn't realistic.

 

On the other hand the artist in me doesn't want to be limited by the tyranny of realism. I think it the final effect works best when it falls some where between believable and interesting.

[Max Jacoby]

I don't think he shies away from tales of Johnson's power grabs, his bullying, stealing the election from Coke Robert Stevenson (my wife says that Caro writes in his intro that Johnson "stole thousands of votes" in that election). But if that's all that Johnson did, grab power, then Caro would not have been interested in him as a subject. It's always the use and misuse of power that interests him.

 

The fact that Caro is going to live in Vietnam for a year, I've heard, to help him write the next volume, suggests that he is not planning on glorifying Johnson.

He's not gloryfying him at all, that's true. Indeed he did steal the Texas Senate election from Coke Stevenson. It is quite an astonishing tale, he bought loads of votes and still came in less than one hundred short. So he pays a guy who five days after the election shows up with some more votes that he 'discovered' in his district and Johnson eventually wins. It was a whole controversy that was largely forgotten until Caro wrote about it.

 

But Johnson was a master politician, at least in the Senate, where he revolutionized the whole distribution of positions for the various commitees. Before him it was all based on seniority and you had to serve for a very long time before you could get a good post, but he got rid of that and in the process became very influential, because he ended up getting control over the assignments of seats himself.

 

Anyway, Caro can explain all this much better than me, he really brings the inner workings of politics alive for you. Even someone like me, who is not very interested in politics, finds these books fascinating.

[Lance Flores]

My impression, from others who read the books, is that Caro is not "glorifying" Johnson. Rather, he is interested to the point of obsession, as in many of his other bios, with the acquisition and then application of political power, both for good (like the Great Society programs) and bad (the Vietnam War.)

 

My insuation was not that the man is glorified, but the presumed "ends" (by some) without the sufficient insight of the means and other intents. This frequently the case with biographers. This work is not of that nature.

 

I don't think he shies away from tales of Johnson's power grabs, his bullying, stealing the election from Coke Robert Stevenson (my wife says that Caro writes in his intro that Johnson "stole thousands of votes" in that election). But if that's all that Johnson did, grab power, then Caro would not have been interested in him as a subject. It's always the use and misuse of power that interests him.

 

I didn't mean to give the impression that Caro's work was lacking. It's that "if you only knew" response you feel when read about something you've experienced or know about and there is information you know is missing. Caro is among the biographers that are honest beyond expection. The book just brought back memories I had of LBJ and memories of watching that "Why Vietnam" propaganda film five or six times at Camp Pendelton, the last of which, two weeks later, our entire battalion was landing in Đà Nẵng. Loved the country, loved the people, wanted to forget the war.

 

The fact that Caro is going to live in Vietnam for a year, I've heard, to help him write the next volume, suggests that he is not planning on glorifying Johnson.

 

I don't expect he will pull any punches.

Edited March 4, 2007 by Lance Flores

[Matthew Buick]

Isn't amazing how a thread can stretch so far from it's original topic. :D

[Lance Flores]

Isn't amazing how a thread can stretch so far from it's original topic. :D

Mmmm. I was just gonna respond about the Polish Bros. mention the first time I noted David's work, and got caught up in the rest. :huh: and here we are.

[Matthew Buick]

Mmmm. I was just gonna respond about the Polish Bros. mention the first time I noted David's work, and got caught up in the rest. :huh: and here we are.

 

Just give the blame to Chuckles. :D