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the oscars / best director


John Holland

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I didn't mean to become reckless and call names, for that I appologize...but I'm seriously finished with the discussion taking place on this thread. I am no film student, just a kid who loves film. There is no pretense behind any of my opinions, as they were part of my own exploration of the medium and what I say I enjoy watching and respect is what I truly enjoy watching and truly respect. Believe it if you will...don't if you won't. It is what it is.

Edited by Robert Lachenay
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I didn't mean to become reckless and call names, for that I appologize...but I'm seriously finished with the discussion taking place on this thread.

Dude you act like your departure from this thread is some sort of major event. There are other particapents in this discussion ya know. Man you REALLY do have a sense of self inportance don't you. That explains a lot about your responces. If you don't want to particapte just don't, you don't have to announce your departure like you were Nixon leaving office, just stop posting, if that's what you want to do.

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My point is art made for the artist alone in nothing more than intellectual masturbation, again self gratification with no thought other than one's self and often at the expense of others. Though all art is personal, artists must constantly be wary of allowing their art to become so inaccessible as to alienate their audiences and lose their meaning in technique as was the case in some of Eisenstein's work. When art becomes so remote it no longer speaks to the human experience, it ceases to be art and becomes self-gratifying egotism. At that point the artist has merely jerked off on the audience, leaving them with the sense of being used and disgusted. And that in my opinion is the greater sin.

Besides, as you say, some of Eisenstein's works, can you give some other examples of this, because I have yet to experience that from any movie (or any other type of artistic work) and I watch a fair amount of obscure and remote type films. I think that it may be a matter of personal interpretation and taste, as I have heard similar comments from mainstream jazz critics about jazz pianist Cecil Taylor and I think that he is so much more creative and unconventionally talented, then the mainstream stuff, that they just don't understand him, rather then being egotistical or remote.

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:D :D :D You made my day man! (lol)

 

Cesar.

 

You know, Cesar, your assurtion that Robert is bigoted is pattenly abserd. If you can't argue a point on it's merits without resorting to pulling the some non-existant race card out of your ass to bolster your sagging argument in some vein attempt to save your pride, you really need to withdraw from the debate because you don't have anything worth while to contribute and before you call ME a racist, be aware that BOTH my neices whom I love more than my life are half hispanic. Your behavour on this forum has been deplorable and I'm embarressed for you. You really need to appologize to Robert for your ridicules accusations and unwarrented personal attacks. This 17 year old kid is 20 TIMES smarter than you will ever be so I take NO pleasure in your enjoyment. PLEASE don't "help" me anymore. <_<

Edited by James Steven Beverly
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Besides, as you say, some of Eisenstein's works, can you give some other examples of this, because I have yet to experience that from any movie (or any other type of artistic work) and I watch a fair amount of obscure and remote type films. I think that it may be a matter of personal interpretation and taste, as I have heard similar comments from mainstream jazz critics about jazz pianist Cecil Taylor and I think that he is so much more creative and unconventionally talented, then the mainstream stuff, that they just don't understand him, rather then being egotistical or remote.

 

I can't think of an entire film off the top of my head that I remember as completely self-indulgent, but as I mentioned in other threads on this forum, I tend to put bad movies out of my mind in self defence PLUS if a movie is REALLY unrelatible I won't completely watch it OR I watch it only once then never see it again and I watch so many movies that I tend to forget a lot of the forgetable ones but let me think about it for a while. One example of self-indulgent art in general is a comic cartoonist Robert Crumb did where a family have incestual sex. Crumb, who's work was cutting edge satire during the 60s moved into a self indulgent sex fantasy with that one and it was rightly lambasted by critics. One of my favorite directors, David Lynch, usually pushes the envelope right to the edge with his work, riding the line between art and insanity like a well tuned Ferrari at Le Mans but there were moments in Lost Highway (a film which for the most part I genuinely really liked) where I think he got a little too out there and fell into a bit of self endulgence. The remake of the Hills have Eyes, I felt was very self indulgent. Blood, gore and getting these people into a scary situation took presidence over good story telling but they're doing a sequiel so what the Hell do I know. I felt the Saw movies fell into the same trap, excuse the pun. The script had plot holes you could sail an aircraft carrier through and the blood and gore were the main charatures of the peice, BUT they made 3 of 'em so again, what do I know. Pink Flamingos was also a bit self indulgent in places and I'm sure you know WHERE I mean. If I can think of anything REALLY blatant, I'll post it. B)

Edited by James Steven Beverly
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Dude they're still making Preditor movies. Hollywould userped the "B" movie genra with the phenomena of Jaws. Again, BEING a "B" movie does not exclude it from being good or art.

I think you just made Ahhnuld and MacTee very proud. Who's have thought that one of their films would ever get mentioned in the same breath as the works by Eisenstein, Antonioni, Godard et al.

 

I'm afraid I'll bow out of this discussion now, as I have to go to the the videostore to rent the Predator 'intégrale' and catch up on these unmisseable masterpieces.

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I think you just made Ahhnuld and MacTee very proud. Who's have thought that one of their films would ever get mentioned in the same breath as the works by Eisenstein, Antonioni, Godard et al.

 

I'm afraid I'll bow out of this discussion now, as I have to go to the the videostore to rent the Predator 'intégrale' and catch up on these unmisseable masterpieces.

 

If your lucky, at some point, you'll get that chance to work on such a masterpiece of popular entertainment and cinemantic pop art as this one. It'll do wonders for your career. But if you do ever lower yourself to viewing it, TRY looking at it as modern myth and see if the film recalls any earlier mythical themes within it's structure. It may not be as recognisable as the themes in the Battleship Potimkin, but they are there and you MAY actually enjoy the film on a whole other level.

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You know, Cesar, your assurtion that Robert is bigoted is pattenly abserd. If you can't argue a point on it's merits without resorting to pulling the some non-existant race card out of your ass to bolster your sagging argument in some vein attempt to save your pride, you really need to withdraw from the debate because you don't have anything worth while to contribute and before you call ME a racist, be aware that BOTH my neices whom I love more than my life are half hispanic. Your behavour on this forum has been deplorable and I'm embarressed for you. You really need to appologize to Robert for your ridicules accusations and unwarrented personal attacks. This 17 year old kid is 20 TIMES smarter than you will ever be so I take NO pleasure in your enjoyment. PLEASE don't "help" me anymore. <_<

 

Wow:

 

When I have called you racist?

 

I am NOT helping you, I just pointed out some well spoken words of you in past posts, unfortunately I can not say the same for this one...I've already straiten out my "thing" with Robert. Have you?....

 

My last comment was that your comment about Nixon was really funny....Probably I did not express my-self properly....and kind of fitted your context.

 

Please James, go have some sleep, your kind of getting schizophrenic for the lack of it. There is no need for some much bla,bla,bla. Don't you know when to pull out? Please respect Robert, he already said that he was out of the conversation.

 

Why you want to bring him back with your going on and on with endless quotations of him? or it is that you have a lot of time on your hands and don't know how to use it in other constructive ways?

 

Is all that you got?...what kind of comment is that?....you want more "fighting"?...please go to a bar and you will have plenty there.

 

Or probably you are the kind of cowards that don't respect their "enemies", and when they fall you still want to make fun of them and dance over them? A real gentleman knows how to do when he wins ...and when he lose.

 

Cesar Rubio.

Edited by Cesar Rubio
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I think he might dig all the way through.

 

You are right Ken. I am over with this topic. I close my case here.

 

Now, have a feast James...Robert is out and me too. Who is going to be your next "adversary"? like I said before, go to a bar if you are man enough...at least they can see your face and respond you right away...in your face!

 

Cesar Rubio.

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You are right Ken. I am over with this topic. I close my case here.

 

Now, have a feast James...Robert is out and me too. Who is going to be your next "adversary"? like I said before, go to a bar if you are man enough...at least they can see your face and respond you right away...in your face!

 

Cesar Rubio.

Cesar,

 

I was referring to you. You have proven, without a shadow of doubt, that arrogance and ignorance are a lethal combination. You are intellectually vacuous, and a social castaway.

Edited by Ken Cangi
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pm from Cesar: "Your just a coward SB...I wish I can meet you one day in person to see if you are so opinionated...

 

Since you know that I am a man , and I won't comment anymore in that thread...now you have plenty to say....F Coward."

 

Cesar Rubio is a member of the Basic Members group and has 59 posts.

Sent on: Today, 02:50 PM

 

Cesar,

 

You are a certifiable nutbag. Can the threats before they cause you more trouble than you can handle. I am posting your pm so that the mods will see the full extent of your behavior. You are so far out of line that you should be banned from the site. You are an ignorant thug, and you have not contributed one syllable of useful information to these forums. Go the f--k away.

Edited by Ken Cangi
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You are right Ken. I am over with this topic. I close my case here.

 

Now, have a feast James...Robert is out and me too. Who is going to be your next "adversary"? like I said before, go to a bar if you are man enough...at least they can see your face and respond you right away...in your face!

 

Cesar Rubio.

 

You know Rubio, I was going to let this go because of the only intellegent thing you've written on this board. "A real gentleman knows how to do when he wins ...and when he lose" but then you had to push it. You should follow your own advice because it's actually good advice. See, I've had a few discussions in bars before and won all of them so If you ever DO feel the need to "discuss" this situation in person, I'm right here on the border in EL Paso. Feel free to drop by ANYTIME. I'll be HAPPY to "discuss" it with you IN or out of a bar. In the mean time, as a gentleman, you should apalogize to the people on this board you've insulted, IF you're man enough to do so. You see a real man , know went he's ceossed the line and has the huavos to admit it. ¿Debes intentar actuar como un adulto en vez de una cierta clase de spoided a niño y puede ser que consigas a liuttle más repect aquí, entiendes, amigo?

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