Iris setting and flare...is there a relationship?

DavidSloan · September 28, 2004

Hey guys: I posted a question a few days ago about shooting an actor from a low angle, pointing a gun towards the camera, with his body directly in front of the sun and as he moves we see huge amounts of flare. Will my iris setting affect the quality of the flare? Does flare manifest itself differently at different iris settings?

If I need to go wide, I'll have to ND the lens...if I do that, will the ND affect the look of the flare.

Also, a few of you mentioned nets to increase the flare...are you reffering to the nets that go behind the lens, in front of the lens, net fliters....? I watched Schindler's List last night and I noticed a shot where Stern is walking into a camp, at night, directly into a huge spot light. You can sort of see a net pattern on the image. Is this what you were referring to when you said that nets can show up? It looked pretty good, actually.

Finally...if I use a net stocking on the lens, how much do I compensate by, and what color stocking would be best to maximum flare?

Thanks :ph34r:

Kevin Zanit · September 28, 2004

Flare is somewhat affected by iris setting. When you stop down the shape of the flare tends to take on the shape of a star. This is because the leafs of the iris are making that pattern.

Thus the wider you are on the lens, the more the flare will take on the shape of a ball. Using any form of diffusion will make the flare more round in shape.

See below:

Kevin Zanit

David Mullen ASC · September 28, 2004

Flare can be a little worse at wider apertures, but the real reason it looks heavier sometimes is that one is often overexposing more when opening up the iris.

Black Ultra Sheer pantyhose is most common for nets; using black helps minimize any loss of contrast that happens as light hits the netting. You can use white nets if you want, but if you are going to point the camera right into a light, black will flare plenty.

How much light you lose is something you can test. If you stretch the net onto a filter frame, you can hold it over the light meter dome to see how much light is lost.

I'd make up a net filter for a 35mm still camera and shoot some tests if I were you.

Light striking the filter will reveal the pattern -- this may be OK for your purposes, but it's not the same thing as having too much depth of field by stopping down too much because then you see the net pattern even when NO light is flaring into the lens. It looks like you are shooting through a chain link fence or screen door all the time.

DavidSloan · September 28, 2004

Is there a cheapie way to throw a net over your lens without getting a filter frame? I want to shoot tomorrow with my still camera and I have no frames...maybe I can tape it to my UV filter or something.

Mitch Gross · September 28, 2004

Is there a cheapie way to throw a net over your lens without getting a filter frame?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How about a rubber band?

Nathan Milford · September 28, 2004

Dave

Call rental houses for blown/scratched Series 9 (or 4 1/2'' or whatever size) filters. They'll probably give them to you for free if they haven't already thrown them out. Knock out the glass and apply your net to the ring.

I've got a few sitting around....

DavidSloan · September 28, 2004

Of course Mitch! you guys can make me feel like an idiot sometimes :unsure:

Thanks as always, Nate. Will do.

David Mullen ASC · September 28, 2004

I made my filters using heavy chipboard like from the back of a notepad. I draw out the shape of the frame (round or rectangular, an inner and outer edge) and then use an X-acto knife to cut out the inner area. Then I cut well outside the outer area (planning on enough of a frame to stay rigid once trimmed.) The excess around the outer area is necessary because then I stretch the filter CAREFULLY over the frame and STAPLE it down in the excess area, being careful not to cause a run in the stocking as I pull on it. I staple it on opposite sides until I've stretched it evenly. Then I rub white glue all along the edges of the frame inside of the stapled area so that I can then cut off the excess area of the frame including the staples and have the glue holding the net down to the remaining cardboard frame.

I have dozens of homemade round and square net filters made over the years using this trick but I haven't found any use for them on a feature!

The key is to buy the most ultra ultra-sheer black pantyhose you can find and stretch it well.

Laurent Andrieux · October 3, 2004

I didn't read posts very carefully, but did somebody mention the fact that when you put filters in front of the camera and have flare, then the flare will be even more a problem because of diffrent reflections at each filter surface ? (a net won't occure this problem).

DavidSloan · October 3, 2004

I was watching Happy Together, last night. Some of the flare on that film!!! Ooof, it looked damn good.

Sam Wells · October 3, 2004

"I was watching Happy Together, last night. Some of the flare on that film!!! Ooof, it looked damn good. "

Note that Chris Doyle is using lens flare as an impromptu Varicon/Panaflasher, like in the street soccer game B)

-Sam

DavidSloan · October 3, 2004

"I was watching Happy Together, last night. Some of the flare on that film!!! Ooof, it looked damn good. "
Note that Chris Doyle is using lens flare as an impromptu Varicon/Panaflasher, like in the street soccer game B)

-Sam

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Can you elaborate on that?

David Mullen ASC · October 3, 2004

I saw that movie projected and that scene looks particularly underexposed and push-processed, so besides lens flares, you are seeing a lot of base fog density, like a fogging effect.

DavidSloan · October 3, 2004

I have to say I was very impressed with Doyle's work on that film...it had a spontaneous, free, wild, colorful, rugged, and other useless adjectives, feel. The man is definitely an important contemporary DP.