Global recession or just a glitch?

[Mark Williams]

UKIP can be the only political party you can vote for going on your views on being a member of Europe they are the only ones that want out as far as i know unless the BNP do not sure on that one , you really shouldnt wind me up on politics i take no prisoners .

 

Hey John Are you saying you think Im a member of the BNP? You really have lost the plot if thats your belief. I can tell you here and now I most certainly am not and its one of the dirtiest tricks to play You want to label me a racist you had better have plenty of backup. As well as a good soliciter

[John Holland]

Mark put your knickers back on i have never said that you belong to any political party i was only saying what sort of choice you have when it comes to voting [ as i said have not sure where the BNP stand on Europe] . I love France , Germany etc ,etc. quality of life food , nice people not worried about walking on the street at night ,clean fantastic public transport come on please i dont need to go on do I ? its investing in infrastructure and services it works unlike here . We have the worst of both worlds here follow everthing that goes in the States whilst being a sideline member of Europe , so we are buggered .

[Guest]

http://www.ecobridge.org/content/g_evd.htm

 

QUOTE

 

QUOTE

(this of course does not mean that we should dump waste into the water and air)

 

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Although it wouldnt matter if we did? As explained already the earth cools and heats and has done for Billions of years so no worries there.

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You missed my point. The heating and cooling pattern of the earth is well established, get rid of all human produced C02 gases tomorrow and the earth will keep heating and cooling. Makes no difference if we are here on the planet or not.

 

What I am saying is that the natural heating and cooling cycle of the earth is not an excuse to dump toxins into the environment. Of course we should recycle, build more fuel efficient cars, etc.

 

But whether we do this or not the climate will continue to change, and the earth will continue to heat and cool.

 

Sorry but the environmental nut jobs can ban all the human activity they want, it won't affect climate change.

 

 

Would like to get back to start of this post the economy ,not global warming . In the UK we are **(obscenity removed)**ed because we have our head up so far the US arse anything happens there happens here , total joke we should be like Germany , France , Denmark but alas we are owned by the US . :(

 

This is a combo post John, I'll do both!!

 

You honestly think the UK is run by the USA? Come on look at Canada.....the Canadian PM needs permission from the US president to use the rest room.

 

R,

[K Borowski]

The trouble seems to be the way presidents get elected? Do you choose the very best out of the political arena? Those whose minds mean only the cream rises to the top? Or do you elect/ select the best looking with a great personality? How is it that Bill clinton gets elected then later his wife is a candidate? How can it be that George Bush can have a son who we will for arguments sake call George Bush who also is one of your very best political intellectuals? Of course you have the Terminater Arnie in the background. But didnt you already try an actor? Perhaps you could have a lottery and whoever wins gets to run the country? Im sure you would get someone more qualified and who doesnt have an agenda? And if we're ten years behind America we may yet get Cherie Blair as leader of the labour party? It seems the more you look at our political systems the more it seems they are working together for themselves. I think good start in America would be a referendum on updating the political system so Politicians are not groomed or super rich but are selected from ordinary honest hardworking people who rise through the ranks because of performance intellect and skill. Not because their family knows the right people or they have millions.

 

This coming from a country that still has a Monarchy and a House of Lords (not that I am in any way defending America's political system here; it sucks, but you know the saying "don't throw stones if you. . .)!

[Mark Williams]

Mark put your knickers back on i have never said that you belong to any political party i was only saying what sort of choice you have when it comes to voting [ as i said have not sure where the BNP stand on Europe] . I love France , Germany etc ,etc. quality of life food , nice people not worried about walking on the street at night ,clean fantastic public transport come on please i dont need to go on do I ? its investing in infrastructure and services it works unlike here . We have the worst of both worlds here follow everthing that goes in the States whilst being a sideline member of Europe , so we are buggered .

 

Ok Knickers on!

[Mark Williams]

This coming from a country that still has a Monarchy and a House of Lords (not that I am in any way defending America's political system here; it sucks, but you know the saying "don't throw stones if you. . .)!

Karl I agree our political system sucks too. Both our countries need to be more democraticly represented

[Mark Williams]

Sorry but the environmental nut jobs can ban all the human activity they want, it won't affect climate change.

 

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Its not about banning human activity. Its about increasing energy output and advancing our civilisations while at the same time decreasing our pollution. We can do both.

[Mark Dunn]

In fact we do select our head of state by a form of lottery; it's called the accident of birth and it works quite well. The House of Lords is there as a check on an overbearing government and has come in very handy over the last decade, so much so that said government is doing its best to emasculate it.

[Mark Williams]

In fact we do select our head of state by a form of lottery; it's called the accident of birth and it works quite well. The House of Lords is there as a check on an overbearing government and has come in very handy over the last decade, so much so that said government is doing its best to emasculate it.

Well Labour have had 10 years of cash for peerages so they must have quite a bit of support in there. Although the house of lords can be a pain they can eventually be overridden As for the EU constitution we are stuffed.

[Stuart Brereton]

the world climate report is payed for by the western fuels association inc a non profit making organisation until you look at who the members are.

 

Unfortunately, the vast majority of the evidence for the link between human activity and global warming comes from studies funded by the many environmental organisations, who are themselves multi-million dollar industries with a specific agenda to promote. They are no less biased than the oil companies.

 

If you bother to do the research you'll find that:

 

1. Global Warming is a highly disputed phenomenon,

 

and

 

2. Even if it does exist, it has not been proven that we are causing it.

 

That doesn't mean that we shouldn't bother to recycle, and find renewable energy sources, all of that is common sense, but until we see some hard evidence, rather than speculation and 'flavor of the month' opinion, it seems futile to charge around the globe vainly trying to solve a problem whose cause is yet undiscovered.

[Guest]

This coming from a country that still has a Monarchy and a House of Lords (not that I am in any way defending America's political system here; it sucks, but you know the saying "don't throw stones if you. . .)!

 

Yeah I have to support you on that one Karl. How many UK PMs have come from Eton College? Geez quite a long list.

 

You have a 10X better chance of gaining elected office in the USA than in the UK if you're just an "average Joe." The UK still has a well entrenched class system.

 

R,

[Mark Williams]

Mark put your knickers back on i have never said that you belong to any political party i was only saying what sort of choice you have when it comes to voting [ as i said have not sure where the BNP stand on Europe] . I love France , Germany etc ,etc. quality of life food , nice people not worried about walking on the street at night ,clean fantastic public transport come on please i dont need to go on do I ? its investing in infrastructure and services it works unlike here . We have the worst of both worlds here follow everthing that goes in the States whilst being a sideline member of Europe , so we are buggered .

Well first of all I wouldnt have a clue where the BNP stand on europe and I dont really care. My argument is not with europe its with the EU. The idea of open borders is good but its really not practical as we are seeing as well as many coming here illegally we have a massive influx of drugs people smugglers foreign gangs guns and contraband. Yes I like all of europe too. Europe is full of history I dont have any problems with europe. BUT the EU now thats another matter and its not just people in the UK who can see what their up to but many in europe Im not a europhile I love europe just not the EU I love America although I can see America has many problems right now. I love the world but the World is often a dangerous place. Its not about disliking europe its about caring about europe and our countries and democracy. People dont realize how important our democracy is and how many have lost their lives defending it. We must look after it and stop our politicains from getting their wishlist which is our country.

 

The EU should be about trade only and it should be accountable.

 

As for America the only real issue was Iraq. And really as I recall Sadam wouldnt allow weapons inspectors to do there job. America in the first war actually saved Kuwait and its people. This treaty allowed for Weapons inspectors to look for weapons of Mass distruction. Now come on there must have been a reson for this. Sadam continually harrassed them even threw them out of the country at one time. I believe America didnt know whether Sadam had WMDs or not. And after 9/11 who can blame them for not taking the chance. Sadam did seem to be hiding soemthing with his obstructive behaviour. America has tried to do the right thing in Iraq by staying and trying to keep the peace instead they have become walking targets with an enemy that hides as civilians. This is what is costing America. Doing the right thing. Most countries in the past would have gone in. Did what they needed to do and left. America I believe should have thought more about afterwards. But then thats what happens when you elect good looking, rich and in the know leaders. Blair was a poodle in all this and should never have survived lying in Parliament about WMDs ready to go in 45 minutes.

[Mark Williams]

Unfortunately, the vast majority of the evidence for the link between human activity and global warming comes from studies funded by the many environmental organisations, who are themselves multi-million dollar industries with a specific agenda to promote. They are no less biased than the oil companies.

 

If you bother to do the research you'll find that:

 

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Your the one disagreeing. Links please

 

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1. Global Warming is a highly disputed phenomenon,

 

and

 

2. Even if it does exist, it has not been proven that we are causing it.

 

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Yes it has actually and in much more depth than you just did

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That doesn't mean that we shouldn't bother to recycle, and find renewable energy sources, all of that is common sense, but until we see some hard evidence, rather than speculation and 'flavor of the month' opinion, it seems futile to charge around the globe vainly trying to solve a problem whose cause is yet undiscovered.

 

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You think this is flavour of the month opinion? You dont know me Stuart I have been concerned about the environment for quite a while. The HARD evidence is out there and if it wasnt do you really believe our governments would be trying to take action? Its you who are in the minority most people accept the evidence for Global warming including our own media and BBC. I agree its futile charging around the globe. However we need to get our carbon emmissions down. The only practical way to do that is to build a new generation of nuclear reactors that should be the last and also mass produce electric cars. Only this way will we have the power we need and be able to seriously reduce our contribution to global warming. We have to be an example for other countries too.

Edited March 17, 2008 by Mark Williams

[Stuart Brereton]

most people accept the evidence for Global warming including our own media and BBC.

 

most people accept anything they're told by people in authority. The Media and the BBC say that Global warming is happening? WOW!, then it must be true!

 

Scientific study has been unable to prove the point either way. The evidence can be interpreted according to your specific agenda. I'd like to point out that I don't deny the possibility that the planet is warming and we are responsible, what I said was that it has not been proven. And it HASN'T, no matter what Al Gore might tell you.

 

worrying about the environment and global warming are separate issues as far as I'm concerned. I recycle, I use alternative fuels where possible, and I do my best not to pollute the environment. As I said, that's common sense. Global warming, however, is a different matter, and until it is proven that we are causing it, it seems ridiculous to spend billions of dollars trying to stop a process that may be entirely out of our hands.

[Matthew Buick]

Would like to get back to start of this post the economy ,not global warming . In the UK we are fu**ed because we have our head up so far the US arse anything happens there happens here , total joke we should be like Germany , France , Denmark but alas we are owned by the US . :(

 

 

John, you have a very valid point there, for example British car companies. Land Rover, Jaguar, Vauxhall, they're the only ones off the top of my head. Perhaps Lotus, I don't really know. Bentley, and Rolls-Royce are owned by the Germans. Quite sad really that Britain's car industry is no longer British.

[Mark Williams]

most people accept anything they're told by people in authority. The Media and the BBC say that Global warming is happening? WOW!, then it must be true!

 

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For years those authorities have been warned of the dangers and for years those authorities ignored it. Now its being taken seriously.. Why? Because of the visible evidence. I dont believe our governments work for our interests They work for their own. However they have kids its in their interests too. The BBC is no more than a government propaganda machine especially regarding the EU. The BBC have a lot to gain from being THE Premier TV station in the EU.

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Scientific study has been unable to prove the point either way. The evidence can be interpreted according to your specific agenda. I'd like to point out that I don't deny the possibility that the planet is warming and we are responsible, what I said was that it has not been proven. And it HASN'T, no matter what Al Gore might tell you.

 

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Al Gore hasnt told me anything and I wouldnt accept it as fact if he did. You accept the possibility the planet is warming and I expect you accept the possibility this is not going to be good with the possibility we could end up extinct. I guess form your perspective you want to wait until you have the level of proof that will satisfy you. Then you will support action. WOW where does that leave us?

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worrying about the environment and global warming are separate issues as far as I'm concerned. I recycle, I use alternative fuels where possible, and I do my best not to pollute the environment. As I said, that's common sense. Global warming, however, is a different matter, and until it is proven that we are causing it, it seems ridiculous to spend billions of dollars trying to stop a process that may be entirely out of our hands.

 

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You can't separate the two. Because they are cause and effect. And if you do then why worry about the environment if it has no effect on the planet?

But your not saying that either. Your saying it has no proveable effect but just in case we should recycle? Bit like keeping your bedroom tidy? I mean all were really doing is re-arranging what was there anyway?

 

But its the way things are arranged that makes the planet the way it is. Re-arrange it all in a different order and you would have a lifeless rock.

 

Meanwhile the poles melt sea levels rise Water shortages and strange weather patterns. We keep going because the proofs not there

 

Your way we get to "not worry" and carry on as we are until we get proof from a source without an agenda? Like the journal "Science" Or NASA? But they too have an agenda. In it for the money? Government help? Paid off by the government? I guess no level of proof is ever going to be enough.

 

The process of Global warming proven to have happened in the past is in our hands because we are pumping the co2 locked underground in the form of animal bones into the atmosphere and messing with the way nature has arranged things. Something nature does in symbiosis because life evolved or works in a way that allows it to survive. Life /the planet, can recover itself within its own tolerances. For example we breathe out co2 or burn trees whatever and something in nature can gain from this and convert it all back. Trees can absorb co2 and give of oxygen but we release all the co2 from trees by cutting them all down Even then nature can accomadate.

But now clever old us are digging up co2 to put into the atmosphere. We know in the past the earth has experienced higher levels and what the earth would have been like. Although we cant prove it for sure. We know the greenhouse effect works Although we can't prove it for sure.

 

What your saying is we dont know for sure it would work on us. Until its proven for sure.

 

Bit like if a nuclear bomb was launched at london we have no proof it would explode hit its target or even be real. Whose going to profit from it and why? Are the detection instruments working properly and are those operating them fully licenced and qualified? Perhaps the bomb is a hoax doesn't have a real warhead? A high school prank or media scaremongering? So the best bet is wait until it hits. Close the windows and stay indoors just in case. And when it does hit. Now we have proof and can swing effectively efficiently into action.

 

Only problem is no ones left.

Edited March 18, 2008 by Mark Williams

[Marc Alucard]

John, you have a very valid point there, for example British car companies. Land Rover, Jaguar, Vauxhall, they're the only ones off the top of my head. Perhaps Lotus, I don't really know. Bentley, and Rolls-Royce are owned by the Germans. Quite sad really that Britain's car industry is no longer British.

 

Land Rover and Jaguar were owned by Ford. Tata Motors of India is now the proud owner of the two brands.

[Matthew Buick]

Land Rover and Jaguar were owned by Ford. Tata Motors of India is now the proud owner of the two brands.

 

I like India, so I suppose that's a improvement. Still doesn't compare to these companies coming back home though. At lest it proves that British branding is hot property.

 

Speaking of Tata, I'd love to buy their Nano. ;)

[John Hall]

Scientific study has been unable to prove the point either way. The evidence can be interpreted according to your specific agenda. I'd like to point out that I don't deny the possibility that the planet is warming and we are responsible, what I said was that it has not been proven. And it HASN'T, no matter what Al Gore might tell you.

 

Having proof of a human cause of global warming is not the same as having evidence of it. There is in fact a great deal of evidence that human activity is causing a warming of the planet. Yes, there are studies that show evidence of a natural cause, and they should certainly be considered in any final analysis.

 

Is it conclusively proven? Perhaps not. Is there enough evidence to justify further research and preemptive action? The opinion of the majority of the scientific community, whether or not they are 100% convinced of a man made cause, is a resounding "yes".

 

Even if you believe it is premature to draw a conclusion as to the cause of global warming, surely you can't think that the warming of the planet, whatever the cause, isn't something we should be concerned about.

 

Is it ridiculous to spend the money researching global warming, and doing what we can to prevent it, if indeed, we can? Should we do nothing to try and stop or slow down the process? Should we instead spend the money planning on how to live on our drasticaly altered planet?

 

That, I think, would be ridiculous.

[Guest]

I always get a big laugh out of the polls that surface in Canada that say Canadians are very concerned about the environment, it's a number one priority even they say!!

 

Yet how much laundry do I see hanging on clothes lines as I drive around Southern Ontario in June-August? Zero, that's how much. How are are these environmentally conscious Canadians drying their clothes in the summer months? With an electric powered clothes dryer that's how. Gee seems Canadians don't care about the environment enough to use the non-polluting and FREE wind and sun to dry their clothes in the summer months.

 

Canada makes up .005% of the earth's population yet we produce 5% of the earth's green house gases. That means we pollute at a rate 1000 times greater than our population!!!

 

I'd like to see China, India, or the USA top that! Yet morally superior Canadians are first in line to point the finger of scorn at the US and every other country for their polluting ways.

 

Obviously we live in a glass house in Canada and should not throw stones until we get our own house in order.

 

R,

[Stuart Brereton]

Having proof of a human cause of global warming is not the same as having evidence of it. There is in fact a great deal of evidence that human activity is causing a warming of the planet. Yes, there are studies that show evidence of a natural cause, and they should certainly be considered in any final analysis.

 

Is it conclusively proven? Perhaps not. Is there enough evidence to justify further research and preemptive action? The opinion of the majority of the scientific community, whether or not they are 100% convinced of a man made cause, is a resounding "yes".

 

Even if you believe it is premature to draw a conclusion as to the cause of global warming, surely you can't think that the warming of the planet, whatever the cause, isn't something we should be concerned about.

 

Is it ridiculous to spend the money researching global warming, and doing what we can to prevent it, if indeed, we can? Should we do nothing to try and stop or slow down the process? Should we instead spend the money planning on how to live on our drasticaly altered planet?

 

That, I think, would be ridiculous.

 

I don't disagree with anything you've said. My point was (and looking back at my post, perhaps I wasn't clear) that it is still unproven. That doesn't mean that we should do nothing. As I stated, I recycle, I use green fuels where I can. I will support any sensible initiative to reduce our impact on the environment.

 

What I object to is the Green Lobby's statement of opinion as Fact. It is not anything of the sort. The scientists and researchers who work for environmental groups are every bit as beholden to their employers as those who work for the oil companies. Billions of dollars are donated each year to environmental groups. That money is spent on studies conducted by people who know perfectly well what the desired outcome of that study should be. This is not an unbiased field of scientific endeavour.

 

and now, back to the cinematography....