Three REDs For Sale -- #1520, 1521 & 1522

[Tim Pipher]

Although I'm an enthusiastic believer in RED, I'm not going to need the three cameras I have on order -- 1520, 1521, and 1522.

 

If you'd like them, please let me know. My thinking is that you would tell me the accessories you would like with the cameras and I would pass that along to RED, along with a new mailing address (yours).

 

At the proper time you would wire the money for the cameras to RED. After receiving the cameras, you might also want to send RED an additional $500 per camera to switch the name to yours -- I think you'd then have a three month warranty from RED. Normally you'd have to ship the cameras back to RED for evaluation before they'd give you the warranty, but if you immediately contacted them after receipt of your brand new cameras, I doubt they'd require that you send them back.

 

I'm looking to receive the amount of my deposit ($1,750 per camera which will be credited towards your camera purchase) plus a premium.

 

Please let me know what premium you're offering by e-mailing Tim(at)SoutheasternStudios.com.

 

Thanks!

[Guest]

Please let me know what premium you're offering by e-mailing Tim(at)SoutheasternStudios.com.

 

Thanks!

 

So you don't physically have the cameras, but you want to turn a profit on your reservation, correct?

 

Why not just tell RED you don't want them any more and get your deposit refunded?

 

R,

[rob spence]

isn't this called 'scalping' in the USA?

[Tim Carroll]

isn't this called 'scalping' in the USA?

 

We have another word for it, but since this is a family forum, I won't repeat it. Pretty disgusting.

 

At the proper time you would wire the money for the cameras to RED. After receiving the cameras, you might also want to send RED an additional $500 per camera to switch the name to yours. . .

 

I'm looking to receive the amount of my deposit ($1,750 per camera which will be credited towards your camera purchase) plus a premium.

 

Just so I have this straight. Instead of buying a camera from RED yourself, you should give this guy $1750, plus pay this guy a premium, and then pay for the balance of the price of the camera, and then pay an additional $500 to have the camera owner name changed. Wow, sounds like a great deal, PASS!!!

 

-Tim

[Freya Black]

hmmm

Edited March 20, 2008 by Freya Black

[John Holland]

It makes me more and more anti capitalism really hope it goes tits up for you.

[Mitch Gross]

You guys are bring a little rough. If one were to order a new RED today it would be mid- to late-summer before it would deliver. What Tim is offering is a way to get the cameras earlier. If you're not interested then don't buy them, but he's not the only one doing it and RED has put a mechanism in place for just such transactions to occur. It's one of the benefits to being an "early adopter" for RED.

[Tim Carroll]

It's one of the benefits to being an "early adopter" for RED.

 

Not sure having $5250 tied up in camera deposits for three cameras that you don't want is a benefit, but to each his own.

 

Best,

-Tim

[Tim Pipher]

It makes me more and more anti capitalism really hope it goes tits up for you.

 

You summed it up beautifully -- you're anti-capitalism. Imagine, making an investment and selling it at a profit -- shameful. I wouldn't be surprised if there are other businesses out there selling goods and services for more than they paid. In fact, come to think of it, every business and service provider does it -- including you -- or they go out of business. Or maybe you work for free?

[Tim Carroll]

In fact, come to think of it, every business and service provider does it -- including you -- or they go out of business.

 

So you're in the business of buying and reselling RED deposits/reservations.

 

How's that working out for you?

 

Best,

-Tim

[Tim Pipher]

We have another word for it, but since this is a family forum, I won't repeat it. Pretty disgusting.

 

 

I am absolutely mystified as to why anyone would be disgusted by someone trying to sell something in the Cine Equipment Classifieds at a profit. I don't usually disgust people, and can't quite figure out how I did it.

[Bryan Fowler]

Tim,

 

Did they give you an estimate on when they would ship?

 

Bryan

[Tim Carroll]

I am absolutely mystified as to why anyone would be disgusted by someone trying to sell something in the Cine Equipment Classifieds at a profit. I don't usually disgust people, and can't quite figure out how I did it.

 

Tim,

 

You may be too late, someone beat you to it on eBay:

RED reservation/deposit auction on eBay

 

Everything about the hype surrounding the RED camera disgusts me, and the thought of someone trying to make a profit by selling a reservation for a place in line for a camera, let along three cameras, just strikes me as absurd.

 

But hey, if that's the business you want to be in, knock yourself out. Best of luck with it.

 

-Tim

[Tim Pipher]

So you're in the business of buying and reselling RED deposits/reservations.

 

How's that working out for you?

 

Best,

-Tim

 

I'm in the business of buying equipment and putting it in my studio. If I find I've made an equipment purchase that I can't use, I try to dispose of it at the best price I can.

[Tim Pipher]

Tim,

 

Did they give you an estimate on when they would ship?

 

Bryan

 

Hello Bryan. Here's the latest update from RED, posted on Reduser.net:

 

Updated 3/20/08

 

1. SCHEDULE:

 

Quote, Jim, 12.27.07, "We expect to get production up to 400 cameras for January and 500-600 February on. 700 units by May.

That is a rough schedule. We have been late in the past so we are hesitant to post a firm schedule and be late again. But this is what we are thinking- today."

 

As of March 20, 2008, Jim's schedule is on track. Remember, this is an estimate, a best guess. It is not a guaranty.

 

Camera reservation #s1000-1250 are shipping now. Reservation #s 1251-1500 are being contacted the week of March 17th.

 

501-1000 begin shipping in February

1001-1500 begin shipping in March

1501-2000 begin shipping in April

2001-2700 begin shipping in May

2700-3400 begin shipping in June

3400+ (Current Orders) begin shipping in July

[Bryan Fowler]

Tim,

 

You may be too late, someone beat you to it on eBay:

RED reservation/deposit auction on eBay

 

Everything about the hype surrounding the RED camera disgusts me, and the thought of someone trying to make a profit by selling a reservation for a place in line for a camera, let along three cameras, just strikes me as absurd.

 

But hey, if that's the business you want to be in, knock yourself out. Best of luck with it.

 

-Tim

 

Tim,

 

Many REDs have sold on Ebay, and off ebay. Some for over 60% to people who want one now. It's not unethical, illegal, or misleading. People know what they are spending their money on. It's called supply and demand. You think supply and demand is absurd?

 

I'd love to be in an ethical, legal, honest business of making $8,000-$15,000

 

I haven't seen any hype surrounding the Red. I have however seen lots of excitement. Did you mean to say excitement?

[Tim Pipher]

Tim,

 

 

Everything about the hype surrounding the RED camera disgusts me, and the thought of someone trying to make a profit by selling a reservation for a place in line for a camera, let along three cameras, just strikes me as absurd.

 

-Tim

 

You know, I've heard about an anti-Red bias on this forum, and always taken it with a grain of salt. But Holy Smokes, when a person is even demonized for deciding not to buy RED, it makes me think that maybe reports of unreasonable Red-hate may be true.

[Chris Keth]

You know, I've heard about an anti-Red bias on this forum, and always taken it with a grain of salt. But Holy Smokes, when a person is even demonized for deciding not to buy RED, it brings Red-hate to a whole new level.

 

Not to turn this thread in the direction of others, but there is a difference between an "anti-red bias" and a "not getting overly excited until a product is thoroughly tested" attitude.

 

:ph34r:

[Tim Pipher]

Not to turn this thread in the direction of others, but there is a difference between an "anti-red bias" and a "not getting overly excited until a product is thoroughly tested" attitude.

 

:ph34r:

 

You're right Chris. I probably made a mistake bringing the "anti-Red bias" stuff into this thread. But as I said above, I'm trying to figure out why there was such venom directed at me. The person most vehemently taking shots at me made his disgust of all RED "hype" clear. It was the only explanation I could come up with for his beef.

[Tim Carroll]

You're right Chris. I probably made a mistake bringing the "anti-Red bias" stuff into this thread. But as I said above, I'm trying to figure out why there was such venom directed at me. The person most vehemently taking shots at me made his disgust of all RED "hype" clear. It was the only explanation I could come up with for his beef.

 

The RED camera has been massively over-hyped for two years now, and with not alot of "thorough testing" and delivering on promises to back up that hype. I was at NAB two years ago when it was first introduced, or not introduced, depending on how you look at it. Everything about the marketing has smacked of hype. You don't find Aaton making claims that the Penelope is going to revolutionize movie making as we know it, or ARRI making claims that the 416 will make every other camera obsolete. And Aaton and ARRI have decades of track record to back up the modest claims they do make. The RED camera may someday live up to some of the hype, and I hope for all those folks who have invested their hard earned money into it that it does.

 

But the idea of trying to make a profit from "selling a place in line" for a camera, at a "premium", is just offensive to me. I would have had the same reaction if someone had posted either of the following:

 

Hi, I put a down payment on three Aaton Penelope cameras and now I don't need them. So I will sell my down payments to you for the price of the down payment, plus a premium, and then you still have to pay the balance of the camera plus give Aaton another $500 so they will put the camera in your name, and Aaton will only give you a 90 day warranty on the brand new camera.

 

-or-

 

Hi, I put a down payment on three ARRI 416 cameras and now I don't need them. So I will sell my down payments to you for the price of the down payment, plus a premium, and then you still have to pay the balance of the camera plus give ARRI another $500 so they will put the camera in your name, and ARRI will only give you a 90 day warranty on the brand new camera.

 

I would have had the same reaction to either of those.

 

Best,

-Tim

[Alex Ellerman]

Gimme a break - this isn't capitalism - this is exploiting an inefficiency for personal gain, I suppose, but don't act like this is stock in IBM. Red Cameras aren't a commodity designed for investment and appreciation. This is no different than buying an iphone or a wii and trying to make somebody pay extra for it.

 

I seriously question the wisdom in what you are attempting, trying to game your fellow filmmakers, but to each their own. i bet your wondering if your "investment" was very smart, b/c i bet you're having trouble finding suitors willing to pony up for your positions.

[Tim Pipher]

But the idea of trying to make a profit from "selling a place in line" for a camera, at a "premium", is just offensive to me. I would have had the same reaction if someone had posted either of the following:

 

Hi, I put a down payment on three Aaton Penelope cameras and now I don't need them. So I will sell my down payments to you for the price of the down payment, plus a premium, and then you still have to pay the balance of the camera plus give Aaton another $500 so they will put the camera in your name, and Aaton will only give you a 90 day warranty on the brand new camera.

 

So somebody needs three Aaton Penelope cameras within a month or so. He calls the company -- he finds out that he can't get them until summer due to heavy demand. But he needs them for a project this spring! So he finds someone who is offering them for sale at a price he finds reasonable. He is made aware that he even has an option to receive a manufacturer's warranty if he wants to pay the company $500. So the buyer is stupid if he wants to pay a premium to get the cameras he needs sooner rather than renting for three or four months? And the seller is evil for making the deal possible?

 

Who are you to make that judgement? If you find that offensive, you get offended far too easily -- in fact, for no reason at all -- about a transaction that has nothing to do with you.

 

As a matter of fact, I'm very offended at your aspersions, and likely the people who are making me the offers are offended too.

[Tim Pipher]

Gimme a break - this isn't capitalism - this is exploiting an inefficiency for personal gain, I suppose, but don't act like this is stock in IBM. Red Cameras aren't a commodity designed for investment and appreciation. This is no different than buying an iphone or a wii and trying to make somebody pay extra for it.

 

I seriously question the wisdom in what you are attempting, trying to game your fellow filmmakers, but to each their own. i bet your wondering if your "investment" was very smart, b/c i bet you're having trouble finding suitors willing to pony up for your positions.

 

Oh brother. I give up. I didn't invest in the cameras for appreciation (although if I did, so what?) I invested to use them, and then found they wouldn't work for my application because they changed an important spec. So I try to let people know that if it would help them to get cameras in the coming weeks instead of this summer, instead of me turning them back in to RED, they can get them from me for a mutually agreeable price. Why would I go through the hassles and risks of wire transfers, contracts, phone calls, e-mails etc. without a reasonable premium, when I can simply cancel my order and get a full refund from RED?

 

Sorry for all the grief I've caused. Please forget about my offer, and for those that need or want cameras now, the consensus is that you have to wait no matter how badly you need them because you are being duped.

 

By the way, this Cine Equipment Classifieds section works wonders -- I heartily recommend it.

[Dan Goulder]

I invested to use them, and then found they wouldn't work for my application because they changed an important spec.

What spec did they change?

[Max Jacoby]

I'm afraid I don't see what's wrong with Tim's offer at all. If he wants to resell his cameras (respectively his place in line), he should be free to do that, that is his prerogative. He isn't forcing anyone to accept this offer, if you want a camera and can wait till summer, by all means order it for yourself and save on re-warranty and the premium. On the other hand if you need a camera right now, the only way to get one is to buy them from an existing owner at a premium, which in any case might still be cheaper than renting one. It's up to each one to figure out if it makes economical sense to him/her, but to condemn the poor man for his offer is just plain silly. And I have a feeling that if this weren't about Red, no one would care.