DP`s...what`s our job, really?

[Stepan Sivko]

Hey all,just wanted to ask more experienced people how it goes on professional sets, cos so far i just worked on student films and as we know as a student we do everybodys job.

My main concerns are

1\ How much is a DP involved in technical script, cos sometimes i do even a picture storyboard and story breakdown to shots and angles....i know thats probably not my job and there are storyboard artists, on the other hand i want to be part of that process.

2\ Is it only DP himself who decides which equipment to use...camera,lights,grips or he has somekind of assistant to help him specify all the terminology data...like which clamps,scrims,nets,gels to rent, which camera accessories and lenses to the last screw and clamp, must i specify even which cables should be rented ,if to rent 16A,32A type of splitters and trasnformers and all that poop...cos i do it now.

3\who has the final word on these things, me or unit production manager?

4\Can i freely decide who is gonna be my camera operator, gaffer?Im confused, because sometimes pm`s dictate this and i always fight with them.

5\Once director told me to plan steadycam shot ,so i started telling the operator which way to go and what i want to get into the frame and what not, but then the director told me to tell the actors where to stand and what to do as well....tell me honestly was he nuts or was i wrong to get angry ?Most of his time he was frozen to his chair and videoassist.

 

sorry to bother with such a thing, just the way it goes in czech republic is so confusing that many times i dont know if im dealing with children or adults,so i want to be sure what to expect from others and what is expected from me in the professional world, thank u very much

Stepan

[Mitch Gross]

1\ How much is a DP involved in technical script, cos sometimes i do even a picture storyboard and story breakdown to shots and angles....i know thats probably not my job and there are storyboard artists, on the other hand i want to be part of that process.

 

YOU SHOULD BE WORKING WITH THE DIRECTOR ON THIS. PERHAPS NOT LITERAL STORYBOARDS, BUT AT LEAST A SHOTLIST.

 

2\ Is it only DP himself who decides which equipment to use...camera,lights,grips or he has somekind of assistant to help him specify all the terminology data...like which clamps,scrims,nets,gels to rent, which camera accessories and lenses to the last screw and clamp, must i specify even which cables should be rented ,if to rent 16A,32A type of splitters and trasnformers and all that poop...cos i do it now.

 

THE GAFFER AND KEY GRIP SHOULD DO THIS, UNDER YOUR INSTRUCTION. YOU TALK ABOUT MAIN UNITS AND THE TYPE OF LOOK YOU WANT, AND THEY FILL IN THE DETAILS. I GET INTO FIGHTS WITH PRODUCERS ALL THE TIME ON THIS DURING PREPRODUCTION. THE CREW ARE THE ONES WHO HAVE TO DEAL WITH THE LITTLE DETAIL SUPPORT EQUIPMENT, SO THEY SHOULD GET TO SPECIFY THOSE DETAILS. SAME GOES FOR ALL THE SUPPORT GEAR IN THE CAMERA PACKAGE BEING SPECIFIED BY THE AC.

 

3\who has the final word on these things, me or unit production manager?

 

THIS IS A DISCUSSION TO BE HAD IN PREPRODUCTION. YOU MUST CHOOSE YOUR BATTLES, BECAUSE OFTEN IT IS A FINANCIAL DECISION. YOU NEED TO DECIDE WHICH THINGS ARE REALLY IMPORTANT BECAUSE OTHERS MUST DO THEIR JOBS AS WELL. THE UPM HAS TO KEEP THINGS ON SCHEDULE AND ON BUDGET.

 

4\Can i freely decide who is gonna be my camera operator, gaffer?Im confused, because sometimes pm`s dictate this and i always fight with them.

 

YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO PICK YOUR CREW, OR AT LEAS THE PEOPLE YOU'LL BE DIRECTLY DEALING WITH. THESE ARE YOUR ASSISTANTS--YOURS.

 

5\Once director told me to plan steadycam shot ,so i started telling the operator which way to go and what i want to get into the frame and what not, but then the director told me to tell the actors where to stand and what to do as well....tell me honestly was he nuts or was i wrong to get angry ?Most of his time he was frozen to his chair and videoassist.

 

I WOULDN'T GET ANGRY, BUT I WOULD BE DISAPPOINTED IN A DIRECTOR WHO DIDN'T WANT TO DO HIS OWN JOB. ALL OF THE POINTS YOU BRING UP ARE ALL ABOUT COLLABORATION, AND YOU MUST LEARN HOW TO WORK WELL WITH OTHERS. YOU SHOULDN'T BE TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF AT THE SAME TIME, BUT YOU NEED TO APPRECIATE HOW OTHERS FEEL AND THE JOBS THAT THEY NEED TO DO. IT'S ALL ABOUT GOOD COMMUNICATION AND EXPLAINING YOUR NEEDS AND LISTENING TO THEIRS.

 

 

sorry to bother with such a thing, just the way it goes in czech republic is so confusing that many times i dont know if im dealing with children or adults,so i want to be sure what to expect from others and what is expected from me in the professional world, thank u very much

Stepan

My response is in CAPS inside your quote.

[David Mullen ASC]

>How much is a DP involved in technical script, cos sometimes i do even a picture storyboard and story breakdown to shots and angles....

 

As much as possible. Doesn't really matter who gets the credit if the movie turns out well. I storyboard the films I shoot all the time. But it's all based on discussions with the director beforehand and all approved by the director afterwards. Some directors are more specific than others though.

 

>Is it only DP himself who decides which equipment to use...camera,lights,grips or he has somekind of assistant to help him specify all the terminology data...like which clamps,scrims,nets,gels to rent, which camera accessories and lenses to the last screw and clamp, must i specify even which cables should be rented ,if to rent 16A,32A type of splitters and trasnformers and all that poop...cos i do it now.

 

Don't you have a gaffer and key grip? They should know clamps and cabling better than you. They're the ones who have to use them. They show me their lists and I check to see if anything is missing that I need. But I don't try and guess what the cable run will be to the generator or how many distro boxes we need, or how many Cardellini clamps, etc.

 

However, I do write the initial lighting package list for the gaffer to check over (they usually add to it). I also specific grip items I think we need -- type of dolly, how much curved and straight track, large frames, types of diffusion, etc. And the key grips checks that list and obvious adds the basic package onto it.

 

And the camera package list is all mine, although a camera assistant will look at it and ask me if any item should be added that they think of and want.

 

Film stock breakdown is my list too.

 

Of course, budget considerations may require me to alter or shorten my lists. It gets silly though when your camera package is basically a camera, a few lenses, a tripod, and a couple of filters -- and the UPM asks what can be dropped from the package. Oh yeah, we can save a LOT of money by dropping that +3 diopter filter...

 

>Who has the final word on these things, me or unit production manager?

Can i freely decide who is gonna be my camera operator, gaffer?Im confused, because sometimes pm`s dictate this and i always fight with them.

 

Producers / UPM have final word on HIRING but obviously they shouldn't want to hire people you don't want to work with. They always ask my approval. I tell them who I want to be hired and they negotiate with them. Sometimes I don't get the people I want because the salary offered is too low for them.

 

>Once director told me to plan steadycam shot ,so i started telling the operator which way to go and what i want to get into the frame and what not, but then the director told me to tell the actors where to stand and what to do as well....tell me honestly was he nuts or was i wrong to get angry?

 

He was incompetent. But obviously a DP and operator should be consulted on blocking decisions. A director might let the DP adjust the actor's position if it's merely a technical adjustment, like moving the mark to the left a foot, etc. But otherwise, actor should be talking primarily to the director. Otherwise they get confused as to who is watching their performance.

[Bob Hayes]

The more you know and the harder you prepare the better you will do.

 

Q: How much is a DP involved in technical script, cos sometimes I do even a picture storyboard and story breakdown to shots and angles....

 

A: Each director is different and will need different support. Putting the work in to do storyboards etc. is a great way to prepare as long as it doesn?t take you away from more urgent needs like scouting, crewing etc.

 

Q: Is it only DP himself who decides which equipment to use...camera, lights, grips or he has some kind of assistant to help him specify all the terminology data...

 

A: It is the job of the Gaffers, Grips, and Camera Assistants to know the specific names of the gear and what they need. However each DP has different styles and will need gear specific to them. Also the better educated you are with regards to the gear each department uses the more in sync you will be. I present a complete list and down to the number of Cardelli clamps I think we need to the Gaffer/Grip/Camera person over a lunch. I have gear lists from each show in a spreadsheet and because the gear lists don?t change that much from show to show it is easy to print out. The Gaffer/Grip/Camera person shows me theirs and we create a list for the show. It?s important both of you have what you need to do the show. Also it is a good time to kick around how you plan to approach the show. Do you want to light the whole show with China Balls or 18 k?s? At the end of the shoot I sit down with all departments and go through the actual list of gear we ordered and have the same meeting. What worked and what do we wish we had more of etc

 

Q: Once director told me to plan Steadicam shot ,so I started telling the operator which way to go and what I want to get into the frame and what not, but then the director told me to tell the actors where to stand and what to do as well....tell me honestly was he nuts or was I wrong to get angry ?

 

A: Each director needs something different. It?s our job to supply it. Some are very hands on and expect us to back off. Others want the DP to run the show and as long as they are getting what they want they are happy. You need to sense the kind of director you have. And as your relationship develops seek out feed back and make sure are in sync with your director.

[L. E Bailey]

You said you are in a foreign country.

 

This does bring some questions to your question. How we do it in the states is one way. How its done in England say is another. The camera operator reports to the DIRECTOR and not the DP. I have worked in France and they have a whole different way of working also. They have "camera grips" and some other things that are different than working on a set in the states.

 

What your duties are vary from country to country has been my experience.

 

my 2 cents.

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

I tend to specify very exactly, but only because I have never yet had a location recce with a professional grip or electric. So, I do tend to number the extension cables, but I know it's not right.

 

Phil

[David Mullen ASC]

Since the movies I shoot tend to get a grip truck with a basic package, it would be silly for me to tell them to strip to down to nothing and have me add items to it piece by piece. So I look at what comes on the truck, take off what I think is really unnecessary, add what I think is necessary, have the key grip and gaffer modify the list, check it over, etc.

 

I might say we need six tweenies but if the gaffer orders two additional ones, or two 650-watt peppers, etc. I'm not going to tell him he has to take it off (unless we have to start trimming the package.)

 

I'm always walking past base camp or craft services at night and see that the electrics added a worklight, usually a 1K soft or some sort of open face not on my list (I almost never use Mole 1K soft-lites myself). I really don't want to start thinking about how I should light base camp!

 

The key grip and gaffer BETTER know more about gripping and gaffing than me... I already micro-manage them too much as is...

 

The thing is that any good key grip or gaffer will always keep you well-informed. So everyone is on the same page, equipment-wise (other than the Mole 1K soft-lites that seem to always show up!)

 

But these are shows with people who I've worked with before. With someone who is new and a little inexperienced, I do have to order almost everything just to make sure. For example, a double baby offset arm. Most of the time I can assume one's on the grip truck, but on a smaller show, I might remind someone that it's a good idea to have a couple. Or some baby combo stands, primi stands, low c-stands (I seem to use a lot of short equipment...)

[Mitch Gross]

There's certainly a few specialty items that I like to make sure are on the truck, but generally I'll have a general discussion with the Gaffer about the units I want and how I'll probably be using them, and then let him figure out all the support from there. I seriously do not want to be the one to decide how many quad-box cables are on the truck. Usually the conversation with the Key Grip is about what type of dolly we might prefer and any special rigging I forsee in the shoot., then I let him handle it from there.

[Stepan Sivko]

Thanks all of u for replies, now Im only wondering how to find out {is there any book with photos or web site} all the names for accessories and equipment, unfortunetly i know that might vary as well between UK and states, here we for example call spreadder .."pavouk", germans call it "Drei fuss" but I also heared spider, triangle and many more.....basicly what I did with my friend-gaffer that once we sat in a pub and went through the list of things and we decided to use same names for things, but still we dont know lot of them.

I will realy appriciate if someone can give me a hint were to search for such lets say "film dictionary"...I dont wanna look as a complete looser when Im renting things, thanx again

Stepan

[Mitch Gross]

There are so many different names for the same items in different countries, sometimes different names within the same country. Here in the US, the names vary some from Los Angeles to New York. Your best bet is probably to simply get all the rental catalogs from equipment suppliers in your area and learn those names.

[Christian Appelt]

Hi Stepan,

 

I've never heard the thing called "Dreifuss" in German.

It is nearly always referred to as "Spinne" , which means (SURPRISE!)

"spider" ! ;)

 

 

I have seen some handbooks with film terms in different languages, but never bought one of them after leafing through the pages. When I (with my limited knowledge of, let's say: French film tech terms) note immediately that many translations are totally wrong, I will not trust that book. The film dictionaires I have seen till now were obviously made to produce cash (and may give a lot of trouble to their users) :D

 

Chris