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Camera Cost


Jay Young

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Karl,

 

This is a common attitude in the motion picture business. That it's common makes owning equipment a good investment for those who willing to take a calculated risk. I've learned, that mostly, "If you buy it, they will come"..................

 

I've bought equipment for my day business that it would be hard to prove directly that it paid for itself. But sometimes the bigger picture is that such expenses are a form of marketing, I get a fair amount of consulting business because the words got around that I'm the guy who alway says "No problem, I can handle that". If you're always working, the gear you've bought is paying for itself, just not directly.

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Hal,

I think I'm going to use that reasoning whenever people ask me why I bought my film camera. Sure I don't rent it out nearly as much as my C-Stands/Letus/XDCam.. but hell.. what I've shot on the SR is what gets me the "Day gigs" shooting x or y interview/corporate/etc.

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A week after my 2C arrived I was testing a repair on a very funky crystal motor on my 2B and the pulldown screwed up...

 

Oy. What exactly went wrong with it? I know a couple guys here in LA who might be able to fix it, but given where you are, try Tim Carroll in Chicago first.

 

 

 

 

 

-- J.S.

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Oy. What exactly went wrong with it? I know a couple guys here in LA who might be able to fix it, but given where you are, try Tim Carroll in Chicago first.

Thanks John,

 

The most obvious symptom is the claw doesn't pull back hardly any when cycling up to pull down the next frame. That plus a tendency to jam a bit as it's starting the frame pull down. The camera has the later cardiod movement. The motor I was testing had a tendency to race fast then slow when starting up, the owner confirmed the other day that behavior is normal for the motor, a very early crystal design. I don't think the motor ever went past 50fps but the slow/fast acceleration might have exceeded the movement's ability to accelerate. The motor's owner ran it on a high speed 2C which might not have minded the acceleration.

 

Tim?

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Without seeing the camera it is hard to tell what the problem is. If the pulldown claw is not retreating far enough out of the perf at the end of the pulldown, it could be bumping the film back a bit which keeps the claw from entering a perf cleanly at the top of the stroke. Could be the rear pivot of the claw is loose, could be the interface of the cam with the fibre material the claw is made from, could be the actual metal tip of the pulldown claw is loose. Again, without having the camera on the bench, it is really tough to say.

 

Best,

-Tim

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Hal,

I think I'm going to use that reasoning whenever people ask me why I bought my film camera. Sure I don't rent it out nearly as much as my C-Stands/Letus/XDCam.. but hell.. what I've shot on the SR is what gets me the "Day gigs" shooting x or y interview/corporate/etc.

 

By having a foot in both the film and video camps you're also in the enviable position of being able to give honest and professional advice as to which might be best for a specific project. I'll bet your best clients really appreciate that.

 

Tim,

 

It's in pretty bad shape, it's so screwed up it won't even try to move film.

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Tim,

 

It's in pretty bad shape, it's so screwed up it won't even try to move film.

 

Hal,

 

You need to determine what the camera is worth to you. I can tell you, an overhaul of a IIB is going to run at least $1000 and if parts need to be replaced (which from your description it sure sounds like it) that is going to run more, and could be much more as those parts are getting extremely hard to come by. Axel Broda is the expert on those cameras, if anyone could make it "sing" again it would be him.

 

But again, you need to determine what the camera is worth to you. May be time to put that one out to pasture, especially if your new IIC is running great and it can do everything you need. I certainly would not have it repaired with the thought that you would make that money back selling the camera. As you know the market is really bad right now.

 

Best,

-Tim

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You need to determine what the camera is worth to you. I can tell you, an overhaul of a IIB is going to run at least $1000 and if parts need to be replaced (which from your description it sure sounds like it) that is going to run more, and could be much more as those parts are getting extremely hard to come by. Axel Broda is the expert on those cameras, if anyone could make it "sing" again it would be him.

 

But again, you need to determine what the camera is worth to you. May be time to put that one out to pasture, especially if your new IIC is running great and it can do everything you need. I certainly would not have it repaired with the thought that you would make that money back selling the camera. As you know the market is really bad right now.

 

Best,

-Tim

 

Pretty much my thoughts too unfortunately. I'm pretty sure handed inside the mechanicals of DAT's, CD's, VTR's, and the like so it looks like I just may be in the "fix it or f**k it" stage with respect to the 2B.

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Could be the rear pivot of the claw is loose, could be the interface of the cam with the fibre material the claw is made from, could be the actual metal tip of the pulldown claw is loose.

 

What Hal could do, having both the B and the C, is put them side by side, no magazines, no film, no doors, gates closed. Then inch them thru a few cycles, watching what goes on inside, and feeling for unusual resistance. The comparison might reveal what's wrong.

 

Hal, if you do decide that the II-B isn't worth fixing, let me know.

 

 

 

 

Thanks --

 

 

 

 

-- J.S.

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What Hal could do, having both the B and the C, is put them side by side, no magazines, no film, no doors, gates closed. Then inch them thru a few cycles, watching what goes on inside, and feeling for unusual resistance. The comparison might reveal what's wrong.

 

Hal, if you do decide that the II-B isn't worth fixing, let me know.

 

I'll do that. On a brighter note, I've got to be the luckiest guy in the world. When I bought my II-C I noticed it looked like once upon a time it had a hard front of some sort on it. There are two small engraved labels on its front plate, one with the serial number engraved on it over the original serial number location plus one exactly below it on the bottom of the front of the camera. That plus the camera front plate looks like it might have been milled flat and repainted in the past.

 

Two weeks ago a Samcine Arri standard / bayonet hard front showed up on ebay from South Africa for pretty cheap "Buy it Now" $$$. The photos showed that it had mounting holes just about where the cover plate labels are on my camera. So I took a chance and bought it. It showed up today, I took the bottom little cover off and...Taa Dah!, my camera has drilled and tapped holes plus an alignment pin EXACTLY matching those on the Samcine hard front! I've been playing around with lenses in the hard front and it's a lot easier to deal with focus ears, changing lenses, etc., etc. with the Samcine setup, no turret rotation wings, lens lockdowns, etc. to skin one's fingers on. Plus if it works out on my camera I'll leave a lot of the Arri II flaring problems behind by shedding the turret.

 

I've had the turret on and off my II-B so it'll be pretty easy to mount the hard front on my camera, one trip to the hardware store for four screws and I'm ready to try it and get a feel for collimation, alignment, etc.

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So you know the trick of wrapping a towel around it to catch the springs and rollers.... ;-)

 

Yes, it's Sooo! boring to have to crawl around on the floor looking for the rollers and springs. :-(

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Yes, it's Sooo! boring to have to crawl around on the floor looking for the rollers and springs. :-(

 

If those springs and rollers are popping out when you remove the turret, they are WAY LOW on lubrication. With all the Arriflex 16S, 16S/B, 16M and 35 IIC cameras I have worked on, I have never seen one so dry that those rollers, shafts, and springs actually shoot out. They usually ooze out. Of course then they can drop on the floor.

 

They should be greased with ARRI grease and the turret itself gets that Isoflex Cantenera (I know I spelled that wrong), which is what ARRI calls "honey grease". It makes the turret turn so SMOOTHLY.

 

And be careful with the turret lock, if you have a bayonet turret. If you unscrew the turret lock and take it out, there are a number of ways it can go back in wrong.

 

Best of luck and have fun. They're enjoyable cameras to work on.

 

Best,

-Tim

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They should be greased with ARRI grease and the turret itself gets that Isoflex Cantenera (I know I spelled that wrong), which is what ARRI calls "honey grease". It makes the turret turn so SMOOTHLY.

 

Best of luck and have fun. They're enjoyable cameras to work on.

 

Does "BARRIERTA" sound familiar? That's in Kluber's Barrierta L-55 series of lubricants. Kluber also uses the name "ISOFLEX" for other lubrication products.

 

Look at http://www.kluber.com/ click on "Products" then "Greases".

 

Well designed machinery usually is fun to work on, I once helped a friend who restores classic automobiles strip down the chassis on a 1927 Springfield Rolls Royce. Even though the car sat in poor storage for fifty years ago everything came off the car like it had been built two weeks earlier. Even way back then Rolls Royce understood fastener design and metallurgy better than anyone else.

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Does "BARRIERTA" sound familiar? That's in Kluber's Barrierta L-55 series of lubricants. Kluber also uses the name "ISOFLEX" for other lubrication products.

 

Look at http://www.kluber.com/ click on "Products" then "Greases".

 

Well designed machinery usually is fun to work on, I once helped a friend who restores classic automobiles strip down the chassis on a 1927 Springfield Rolls Royce. Even though the car sat in poor storage for fifty years ago everything came off the car like it had been built two weeks earlier. Even way back then Rolls Royce understood fastener design and metallurgy better than anyone else.

 

I get all the lubricants directly from ARRI. Not sure where they get them from. Didn't recognize anything on that web site.

 

Never had the pleasure of working on a Rolls.

 

But I did fall in love with German engineering years ago when I was still an actor and had been hired to be in the acting company at the Cleveland Playhouse for the '91-'92 season and my only mode of transportation was my motorcycle. Knew that wouldn't cut it in Cleveland where it snows pretty much every day from November 1st till almost April. So I went in search of an automobile that I could afford on my $0 budget. Found this Volkswagen Beetle abandoned in a field. Bought it for $15 (you don't get a whole lot of car for $15 these days). Had it pulled out with a tractor, and flat-bedded to my sisters barn, where I rebuilt it over 17 days with basic hand tools then drove it off to Cleveland.

 

Before1.jpg

 

Before2.jpg

 

Paint.jpg

 

After1.jpg

 

After2.jpg

 

I love things that are totally rebuild-able.

 

Best,

-Tim

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............ Found this Volkswagen Beetle abandoned in a field. Bought it for $15 (you don't get a whole lot of car for $15 these days). Had it pulled out with a tractor, and flat-bedded to my sisters barn, where I rebuilt it over 17 days with basic hand tools then drove it off to Cleveland.

 

Before1.jpg

 

BIG Mistake! You should have got it running but left it looking like this, you could have made a fortune renting it out as the world's ugliest prop car. :D

 

(Seriously though, you did a great job of turning a sow's ear into a silk purse!)

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I get all the lubricants directly from ARRI. Not sure where they get them from. Didn't recognize anything on that web site.

 

I looked them up in Google Earth. Turns out they're about 7.5 Km from Arri in Munich, line of sight. Looks like a pleasant bicycle ride thru the old city.

 

I wonder if that "honey grease" would work for fluid heads? In the old days, we had those NCE heads that would leak and lose their fluid. I tried a few specialty greases, never found anything sticky enough.

 

I also used to rebuild VW's. I did everything but open up the transmissions, you need really big presses for that work. Don't even remember how many engines I rebuilt. All from the classic Muir "Idiot" book. ;-)

 

 

 

-- J.S.

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All from the classic Muir "Idiot" book. ;-)

 

Yep, that's the ticket. Used that book to rebuilt two engines in another Beetle I had after the one pictured above.

 

On the one above I was able to replace the whole front suspension (H-Beam) using regular hand tools, a piece of nylon webbing, and a stick (used the webbing and the stick to make a spring compressor). Turned down the brake drums holding them in my lap and using a piece of sand paper. Re-attached the body to the floor pan with a couple of 1/4" angle brackets and some boat fiberglass. Patched the holes in the gas tank, replaced the front windows that were broken out, and re-upholstered the front seats that had been eaten by horses when it sat out in the field. Then painted the whole thing with a few cans of Rust-Oleum and a brush after sanding off most of the rust. They were just totally "user serviceable" vehicles. If the heat worked better and didn't smell so bad, they would still be great cars today.

 

Best,

-Tim

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If the heat worked better and didn't smell so bad, they would still be great cars today.

 

Alas, they couldn't make the modern government smog limits with the air cooled engines, even with fuel injection.

 

 

 

 

 

-- J.S.

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They should be greased with ARRI grease and the turret itself gets that Isoflex Cantenera (I know I spelled that wrong), which is what ARRI calls "honey grease". It makes the turret turn so SMOOTHLY.

..........

 

You have to love the Internet, I spent a little time digging around, emailed Kluber Support and here's the result:

 

Hal,

Funny thing happened on the way to the Forum as they say. Steve Mazzola, our Customer Service Manager, pointed out that the Catenera (Tim, you spelled it correctly!) product is specifically made for your application. He also let me know that we have stock here in the U.S. So, rather than send the other product we discussed, we will send you the product you originally mentioned. This product currently sells for $20.53 per 50 gram tube. For future reference, you can also speak directly with our customer service department at the contact numbers below or purchase directly from our web site. Hope this helps. Thanks for your interest in Kluber. llt

 

KLÜBER LUBRICATION NORTH AMERICA L.P.

www.kluber.com - now available in 7 languages

Customer Service: 1-800-447-2238, Ext 143 or 170

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You don't have annual MoT (roadworthiness) tests, do you?

Lovely to look at though. Hope it lived a long time.

 

After we finished our last show at the Cleveland Playhouse, I drove it out to Boulder Colorado where I spent the summer building houses. In fall, when I was heading to New York City, I drove it back to Columbus Ohio and gave it to a charitable group (in Columbus) who did Meals-on-Wheels for home bound AIDS patients, then hopped on a plane to NYC.

 

I too hope it lived a long time.

 

Best,

-Tim

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