Larry Levinson Productions

[Guest]

We should let the Free Market operate unhindered..

 

 

This of course is where you and I diverge :rolleyes:

 

I think the laisse fare approach is what got the USA into this mess, and it's regulation that will help get the USA back onto its feet.

 

When you say "We should let the Free Market operate unhindered.." does this mean you oppose the idea of government restaurant inspectors? You are ok with restaurants having rats run around their kitchens? After all restaurant inspectors seem to be at odds with the idea of an "unhindered free market."

 

Fact is David you already accept lots of regulation in your economy, would you fly into an airport knowing there was no FAA enforcing some basic safety standards?

 

The stock market does not operate "unhindered" in the USA after the crash of 29. Today there are controls that stop the trading if the drop is too great in a single day, this lesson was learned from the disaster of the "unhindered" stock market.

 

The list goes on and on. The key is to have a balance of "hands off" and regulation, too much of an extreme one way or the other is bad for a free market economy.

 

What the magic balance is, I have no idea? If I did I'd be richer than Bill Gates ;)

 

R,

[David Rakoczy]

When you say "We should let the Free Market operate unhindered.." does this mean you oppose the idea of government restaurant inspectors? You are ok with restaurants having rats run around their kitchens? After all restaurant inspectors seem to be at odds with the idea of an "unhindered free market."

 

Diverge? You went off the deep end :lol:

 

Of course not... come on... those examples are ridiculous Richard :rolleyes: .. and anti-trust laws have helped.. but (for the most part) I trust collective individuals (us) to steer the economy more than some 'czar'.

 

When I say unhindered I mean the example I gave:

 

We should let the Free Market operate unhindered.. if you want to pay your Grip & Elecs $9 and hour so be it... you will get $9/hr crew.. and you will get what you pay for.. basically a P.A who knows what a C-Stand is. Obviously you won't be able to get a lot done no matter how many you hire so in the end the Free Market will win because you will pay for what you need... real money for real crew.

 

Of course if $9/hr labor is all you need.. help yourself... it's a free country.

[Brian Dzyak]

To anyone who believes that a completely unregulated Free Market is something that can be a viable reality, I highly suggest reading "The Shock Doctrine" by Naomi Klein. In it, she does an incredible job explaining the motivations behind the Milton Friedman theory of free markets, how he (with the help of our CIA) destroyed working "Socialist" nations and put into place evil dictators just to prove that his theory would work. The truth is that Free Markets DO NOT work... they enrich a few at the top and leave the rest of the nation in shambles. Country after country after country has been raped and reduced to disaster as Free Market advocates kill off the rising Middle Class with the promise that the market will work itself out to everyone's benefit.

 

This long-term hate of "socialism" and claim that it doesn't work is a sham idea created by those who are at the top of the food chain. The truth is that Socialism has worked quite successfully in many nations. The examples that are frequently brought up to suggest that it doesn't are intentionally misleading just to "prove" the McCarthy mindset that Socialism is somehow inherently evil. The fact is that markets THRIVE in a semi-Socialist economy because everyone benefits. Unrestrained Capitalism, however, has been PROVEN to destroy economies no matter what Milton Friedman and his ilk claim.

 

From Chili to Argentina and Uruguay and on and on and on... to the United States now, unregulated Capitalist policies are designed to enrich a few and leave everyone else behind. Quite the ideology from the so-called "Christian" Party here in the United States. :blink: There's never a shortage of hypocrisy.

 

 

The fact is that Republican policies have been working to break union and worker rights for over thirty years. In "third world" countries, leaders had the freedom to use violent and deadly tyranny to turn over functioning economies in order to destroy worker rights and enrich a few. It's been a bit more difficult to overturn our semi-Socialist economy in a democracy, but those with Rs after their names sure aren't giving up. They'd love to see a society where you'd have to pull out a credit card to pay a fire department that comes to save the house (after negotiating for the lowest bidder). They'd love to see our infrastructure controlled by private companies so that we'd have to pay MORE for roads, bridges, mail, etc. They'd love to see every school privatized so that the poor would remain undereducated and ignorant so they wouldn't understand the abuses. Unrestrained Capitalism is designed to leave most people behind so that only a few can have the lion's share of what this world has to offer. Those who are in favor of unrestrained Capitalism claim indignation that they have to share their booty with others who haven't earned it. Understandable, except that when we work in a system that is designed to give unfair advantage to a scant few, then it IS NOT a situation where we all have equal opportunity to succeed. This is not a level playing field so the suggestion that we all go out and become our own "Producers" of a product isn't even close to realistic.

 

Milton Friedman believed in his theory because it worked ON PAPER. He couldn't put it into place here in the US so he found a way to experiment on other nations. His theory IN PRACTICE has failed completely time and time again... and now, the US is next, following the exact same path that so many other countries have experienced. It was only after tyrannical dictators were removed from those countries and "socialist" policies were re-enacted, were those nations able to recover from the nightmares they were put through by those greedy few.

 

When the playing field is tilted in favor of just a few (like Levinson), only a few win. That's not what this country is supposed to be about. Thank god for our new "Pharoah," who is more like Robin Hood, trying to instill a sense of balance back into a system that has been out of control for too long.

[Brian Dzyak]

I'm sorry I don't understand your logic at all? It's OK for an actor to get as much as they can up front but not a producer? Sorry, does not compute :blink:

 

The difference is that an Actor is the employee. The Producer is the employer who controls how much everyone will be paid. Employees are interested in earning as much as they can "command" so they can at least have a decent quality of life. Producer's (Manufactuers) are interested in making as much as they can, so they'll try to save money in whatever way is possible. Understandable, but when those money-saving techniques involve conscious efforts to undercut a minimum wage (that a cost of living should demand), then that is the problem.

 

 

What I am saying is that it is far easier to find a new grip than it is to replace a producer who is arranging for 25 million dollars of financing for a 50 million dollar movie. How many people do you know in your circle of friends that can arrange for 25 million of financing for a movie? Not many guys like that are there?

 

 

 

Well sorry but there is a "ranking" system on set based on importance. If the star actor shows up three hours late to the set because he is hung over from a drunken binge the night before what happens to him? Nothing. If a grip or electric shows up three hours late to set because of a drunken binge the night before what happens to him? He gets fired. The grip is not as important to the film as the lead actor, he can be replaced much easier. Fair no, fact yes.

So you're not placing any value on the skill level of a Grip or any other employee who isn't on screen? We're all just expendable monkey's with a pulse?

 

 

 

 

Well actually....yes I do as a matter of fact. I mean on the one hand you come on here and argue very passionately against capitalism and producers in general yet you seem unwilling to put your money where your mouth is and walk away from the very work that by your definition is immoral. Lot's of great reformers practiced what they preached. If it means jeopardizing the welfare of your children then so be it. Would not your actions speak louder than mere words on a website?

 

No offense Brian, but you seem unwilling to put your philosophies into action.

The fact is, I HAVE walked away from jobs... plural there... because I wasn't going to be paid appropriately. I sat at home, poorer, but able to live with myself for sticking to my principles. And I know that when I was "replaced," it was by someone less "expensive" than me, but also less experienced and arguably, the client didn't get as good of a product. Of course that's a subjective argument, except that I was asked first which suggests that I was considered "better." But at the end of the day, they made a choice that quality was less important than their ability to take more of the profit. I won't go into all the specifics of these instances, but suffice it to say, they could afford to pay me what I was asking, but tey were more interested in keeping more of the budget for themselves. I walked away.

 

 

 

 

 

So tell me then, if you hit the 30 million dollar lottery tomorrow how much of the fortune will you give away? 29 million perhaps? 1 million should be enough, no?

 

R,

I'm confused by these ultimatum arguments that have nothing to do with the discussion. :huh: The question is, should a Producer be allowed to actively "screw over" employees when the playing field has intentionally been tilted in his favor? I'm not sure how lottery winnings fit into the question of worker rights.

 

 

 

I think that the bottom line is that not everyone can be a "Producer" or the "Boss." If "we" all were bosses, then who will be left to do the work? Free Market Capitalists suggest that everyone has the right and duty to become a boss. And if a person isn't or can't become the Boss, then that worker should just be happy with whatever wages the Boss decides to throw his way no matter what. No value is placed on skill, experience, quality?

[David Rakoczy]

To anyone who believes that a completely unregulated Free Market is something that can be a viable reality,

 

I don't think anyone is suggesting that... certainly not me.

 

The truth is that Free Markets DO NOT work... they enrich a few at the top and leave the rest of the nation in shambles. Country after country after country has been raped and reduced to disaster as Free Market advocates kill off the rising Middle Class with the promise that the market will work itself out to everyone's benefit

.

 

mmmm.. I see :rolleyes:

 

 

The fact is that markets THRIVE in a semi-Socialist economy because everyone benefits. Unrestrained Capitalism, however, has been PROVEN to destroy economies no matter what Milton Friedman and his ilk claim.

 

oh really?

 

They'd love to see every school privatized so that the poor would remain undereducated and ignorant so they wouldn't understand the abuses.

 

Now I am wiping tears.. from laughing! Sure, private schools can't teach :lol:

 

When the playing field is tilted in favor of just a few (like Levinson), only a few win. That's not what this country is supposed to be about. Thank god for our new "Pharoah," who is more like Robin Hood, trying to instill a sense of balance back into a system that has been out of control for too long.

 

Robin Hood is a thief... supposed 'noble' endeavors do not cover that fact... and Brian.. this is not a children's story we are discussing.

 

The fact is, I HAVE walked away from jobs... plural there... because I wasn't going to be paid appropriately. I sat at home, poorer, but able to live with myself for sticking to my principles. And I know that when I was "replaced," it was by someone less "expensive" than me, but also less experienced and arguably, the client didn't get as good of a product. Of course that's a subjective argument, except that I was asked first which suggests that I was considered "better." But at the end of the day, they made a choice that quality was less important than their ability to take more of the profit.

 

Welcome to reality.. you can't 'muscle' people to hire you at your requested wage.. employers have freedom too.

 

I won't go into all the specifics of these instances, but suffice it to say, they could afford to pay me what I was asking, but tey were more interested in keeping more of the budget for themselves. I walked away.

 

You do not know that.. you did not open the books... sometimes it is more a matter of meeting their OBLIGATION to get the job done on budget.. with whatever it takes. After all, they have people to answer to as well.. oh yeah.. THOSE are the evil ones.. the ones investing and risking.. let's chase those people away!

 

I think that the bottom line is that not everyone can be a "Producer" or the "Boss." If "we" all were bosses, then who will be left to do the work?

 

No doubt.

 

Free Market Capitalists suggest that everyone has the right and duty to become a boss.

 

The 'right' yes... duty no.

 

And if a person isn't or can't become the Boss, then that worker should just be happy with whatever wages the Boss decides to throw his way no matter what. No value is placed on skill, experience, quality?

 

mmm let's see.. I freelanced for over twenty years (non-union) and didn't become a 'boss' until seven years ago. During my freelancing, I was NEVER a miserable sap hung out to dry waiting for someone to throw me a morsel from the dinner table... I was good at what I did and people paid me well for that service. Now, I pay my Keys $400 - $500/ day because I WANT talented crew on my Sets.. but that is MY choice... If I wanted to hire $9/hr crew I certainly have that freedom.

 

The Free Market System has done more to enhance the lives of people that any other system (thus far).

 

God Bless America!

[Justin Hayward]

Robin Hood is a thief... supposed 'noble' endeavors do not cover that fact... and Brian.. this is not a children's story we are discussing.

 

Yes, but he only stole from the government who was over-taxing everybody. So, I guess neither side can use the Robin Hood analogy. ;)

[Guest]

Yes, but he only stole from the government who was over-taxing everybody. So, I guess neither side can use the Robin Hood analogy. ;)

 

Are you sure, I thought he stole from the rich as in "wealthy private citizens."

 

While we're on this point.....

 

1) How long will it be before some one does a feature film on Bernie Madoff? I give it 18 mos.

 

2) We've had movies where people steal from the mafia and casinos, no one has done a movie where they steal money from the IRS. I thought the IRS was more hated than the mafia and the casinos combined :lol:

 

R,

[Brian Dzyak]

Are you sure, I thought he stole from the rich as in "wealthy private citizens."

 

While we're on this point.....

 

1) How long will it be before some one does a feature film on Bernie Madoff? I give it 18 mos.

I'm sure the ink on the script is already dry. ;)

 

2) We've had movies where people steal from the mafia and casinos, no one has done a movie where they steal money from the IRS. I thought the IRS was more hated than the mafia and the casinos combined :lol:

 

R,

 

Hmm.... the Mafia and casinos would probably just send a couple of hired Italians out to "talk"... maybe. But the IRS, if insulted, would probably audit the living sh** out of whoever they felt like and destroy their lives. Broken legs vs a ruined financial future. Tough call. ;)

[Brian Dzyak]

I don't think anyone is suggesting that... certainly not me.

 

.

 

mmmm.. I see :rolleyes:

 

 

 

 

oh really?

 

 

 

Now I am wiping tears.. from laughing! Sure, private schools can't teach :lol:

 

Yes, private schools can teach, but not everyone can afford them. That's the point. A civilized society recognizes the importance of an educated society. That's why we have publicly funded education. Free Market Capitalists espouse doing away with publicly funded schools. They did this in New Orleans post Katrina. Even as the water was receding, Republicans swooped in to do away with public schools and forced in Charter Schools in their place. They take "shock" moments while a populace is reeling from some disaster and take advantage of the situation. While everyone is looking over "here," they move in and do something "there" hoping that nobody is paying attention. They did this in New Orleans. They did it in Indonesia after the Tsunami. They created shock in Chili, Argentina, Uruguay and other nations (via truly horrible means when the CIA helped install dictators to replace the DEMOCRACIES that were working beforehand). And then in 2001, the Republicans used the shock of 9-11 to move on their agenda to invade Iraq and remove some of our liberties here...for profit motive.

 

Before you laugh again in public and disagree, it might help to do some research into history and politics. Making movies is fun, but we do it in the arena of a real world with real economic policies that impact us all. Basing opinions and decisions on real knowledge instead of errant ideology is the only way to achieve any real progress.

 

 

 

 

You do not know that.. you did not open the books... sometimes it is more a matter of meeting their OBLIGATION to get the job done on budget.. with whatever it takes. After all, they have people to answer to as well.. oh yeah.. THOSE are the evil ones.. the ones investing and risking.. let's chase those people away!

 

I said I wasn't going into the details of those situations and I won't. But I DO know precisely what the financial situations were. I stand on my previous statements. Someone else was hired to do the job I was initially asked to do... he lives in a place with a lower cost of living so he could afford to work for less than the going rate IN LA. The same situation exists on a macro level when Producers troll the planet for cheaper labor to exploit. Again, why should we who live in a country and area with X cost of living be expected to compete on wages with people who live in an area that has >X cost of living? Again, this is a massive issue that delves into large scale politics and isn't about to be fixed here. And it does come down to basic ideology. I believe that we are all on this planet together and we have to make it work for everyone. Others don't care about others and only care about getting what they feel is theirs, everyone else bedamned. I can't support that attitude. But that's me. I won't apologize for caring about the big picture.

 

I just kinda wanna make movies and have the ability to earn a decent living at it without fear that I'll have to choose to be exploited or be forced out of the industry. Union contracts make that a fairly easy situation for everyone... meaning, if a Producer wants to make a product, it will cost X much and everyone goes home happy. But when Producers make the decisions to try to pay less than the going rate, that's when the "fun" of doing the job goes away and we all have to worry about the financial logistics. It doesn't need to be that way if everyone just played by the rules. There is enough to go around... but some aren't happy with "enough." They always need more and it doesn't matter to them if they have to take it out of somebody else's share. I don't know where those kind of people come from but we should find out where and stop 'em when they're young. <_<

 

 

 

mmm let's see.. I freelanced for over twenty years (non-union) and didn't become a 'boss' until seven years ago. During my freelancing, I was NEVER a miserable sap hung out to dry waiting for someone to throw me a morsel from the dinner table... I was good at what I did and people paid me well for that service. Now, I pay my Keys $400 - $500/ day because I WANT talented crew on my Sets.. but that is MY choice... If I wanted to hire $9/hr crew I certainly have that freedom.

Yes you would. Would you wait for the market to work in your favor so you could get the best people who are hungry for work or would you hire at $9 an hour in the best of times? In other words, would you freely take advantage of people in need even if you could afford to pay more, which is what Capitalism espouses or would you pay people what they deserve no matter what? That's the real point of all of this. At what point does a Producer (like LLC) become opportunistic? He clearly can afford to pay his crew more (including OT, etc)... he just chooses not to. The argument is that the workers don't have the right to "demand" better treatment and pay so long as there are saps out there willing to bend over and take whatever pennies he is tossing to them. It has been suggested by me and others that those qualified workers HAVE TO take that work because there aren't a lot of other opportunities out there. That LLC can afford to pay some employees their union wages but they refuse to do so for the "expendable" crew, speaks of unfair Capitalistic opportunism. Illegal? Not really. Fair? No. And THAT'S why unions are supposed to exist... to protect worker's rights and guarantee AT LEAST fair wages. When the unions are all broken, then the employers of all industries will have the freedom to pay $9/hr or less no matter what the project budget or quality of the employee.

 

You spoke of Pharoahs? That's what unrestrained Free Market Capitalism establishes... essentially slave labor because the "boss" can pay whatever he wants and the employees have to take it or go in a corner and die. I personally don't think that's right. But that's me just being an advocate of kindness and humanity. Call me crazy for caring about others. <_<

 

 

The Free Market System has done more to enhance the lives of people that any other system (thus far).

 

God Bless America!

You have a lot of catching up to do with history and reality. The Free Market System has done more to DESTROY WORKING DEMOCRACIES and working economies around the world. There really are a lot of resources out there for real information. Fox News isn't one of them.

[David Rakoczy]

Yes, private schools can teach, but not everyone can afford them.

 

If more used them they could.. I am all for a public school system but not what we have right now.. we have never paid more for less. Things are almost always better where there is competition... don't you agree.. isn't competition what drives 'quality' for the consumer?

 

Before you laugh again in public and disagree, it might help to do some research into history and politics.

 

I do.. but boy you sure have the CIA pegged as the root of all evil... a bit of conspiracy is always entertaining reading.

 

I believe that we are all on this planet together and we have to make it work for everyone.

 

That is a great politically correct sound bite... but really?.. even if they do not want to work?... or work hard enough to achieve that which they desire?

 

I just kinda wanna make movies and have the ability to earn a decent living at it without fear that I'll have to choose to be exploited or be forced out of the industry.

 

We would all love that assurance, however, there are no guarantees in ANY profession... be ready to move or change or do something to achieve what you desire for you (and your family)... you have no 'right' to be a DP and earn a decent living... YOU need to make that happen.

 

 

Union contracts make that a fairly easy situation for everyone... meaning, if a Producer wants to make a product, it will cost X much and everyone goes home happy.

 

Really?... tell that to my friend who was shook down for $140,000.00 USD!

 

But when Producers make the decisions to try to pay less than the going rate, that's when the "fun" of doing the job goes away and we all have to worry about the financial logistics. It doesn't need to be that way if everyone just played by the rules. There is enough to go around...

 

Again.. tell that to my friend.. and btw.. that is awfully presumptuous of you.

 

Sometimes they have to trim to afford what ultimately they need... to get the job done, period.

 

Unfortunately, your job does not guarantee 'FUN'...

 

And rules???.. what rules?.. the rules are minimum wage is the only rule. After that, it is all an assumption on your part that the money people aren't sharing enough with YOU... not that they even have to.. let them get what they pay for.

 

to protect worker's rights and guarantee AT LEAST fair wages. When the unions are all broken, then the employers of all industries will have the freedom to pay $9/hr or less no matter what the project budget or quality of the employee.

 

We have that right now in Florida and all the other Right To Work States... but you saw what I pay my Crew (real crew wages) and why (because I desire quality.. not because it is forced on me). See? The Free Market works!

 

..and what is fair.. should EVERYONE make $50k a year... $100k? Is that their right?.. or should they get out there and EARN it?

 

You spoke of Pharoahs? That's what unrestrained Free Market Capitalism establishes... essentially slave labor because the "boss" can pay whatever he wants and the employees have to take it or go in a corner and die.

 

The 'boss' can ALWAYS pay whatever (he) wants.. the choice is his to balance what he can afford to pay with what results he needs. If he can not afford to do it in Hollywood he will take it somewhere else.

 

I personally don't think that's right. But that's me just being an advocate of kindness and humanity. Call me crazy for caring about other

s.

 

I agree.. but that is their right.. you can not legislate morality.

 

Ya know, it is sad that you have forgotten ALL THE FOLKS with a lot of cash (they EARNED) who share it with others to uplift their lives... you thus far have simply dismissed these folks and treat all with money as the enemy... very misguided Brian.

 

btw.. I wonder how much of your income you give to the poor and needy... without the Govn't steeling your money and doing it for you...?... Any?

 

I noticed you blew off Richard's question about the lottery..

 

So let's get down to your idealic world:

 

1. How much should EVERYONE make?

 

2. What are the Tax Rates you suggest to afford all that you seemingly want to do?

 

This is an amazing conversation from someone who (presumably) works on the Set with folks who are making MILLIONS for a weeks worth of work... but you do not hold them to the fire.. it is always the evil 'producer'.. (who is probably a CIA Agent). :lol:

 

Brian, I appreciate your passion and willingness to articulate your opinion. I respect that very much... wholeheartedly disagree... but respect you very much.

 

I hope we can have some spicy tuna rice cakes and sake at Kushi-Yu someday.

 

Sincerely.

 

btw.. I have a great talk by Walter Williams.. ever hear of him?... one of this Nation's greatest Economists. I would be happy to send you that talk on DVD (FREE.. see...no hyper capitalism here ;) ). just IM me your mailing address.

[Michele Peterson]

An Employer, or producer in the case of LLP, does have the legal freedom to not pay higher wages, but the employees also have the right to boycott and protest what they find unacceptable. Free speech and the right to protest. The producer can try to keep all the profit to himself, and the employees can try to get more wages (by banding together in a union), it leads to negotiations between the two so they can each can get some of what they want.

[John Sprung]

Yes, private schools can teach, but not everyone can afford them.

 

There are two main kinds of private schools. You're thinking of the ultra expensive ones where the rich send their kids. There are also religious private schools. The Catholics in particular have a large school system. They generally do better on less money per head than the public schools. Working people can afford them, but not everyone is religious.

 

 

 

 

 

-- J.S.

[Thomas James]

I think this whole idea of Christian libertarianism creates a lot of problems. For example these self styled libertarians think that land reform for peasants is just a bunch of evil communism and amounts to theft to a landlords God given right and freedom to own and hold land in his posession forever. However a year of Jubilee was created so that once every 50 years land would be returned to these poor peasants even if they could not afford to redeem it or buy it back.

[David Rakoczy]

An Employer, or producer in the case of LLP, does have the legal freedom to not pay higher wages, but the employees also have the right to boycott and protest what they find unacceptable. Free speech and the right to protest. The producer can try to keep all the profit to himself, and the employees can try to get more wages (by banding together in a union), it leads to negotiations between the two so they can each can get some of what they want.

 

Boycott sure.. stay home or work for.. or doing.. something else if you'd like. However, showing up, disrupting, intimidating and extorting,... no. Go do that to almost any other business and you'll get arrested. Try that on a Set in any Right To Work State and the Sheriff will escort you away...

[David Rakoczy]

Along these lines, is the amazing Free Choice Act the Unions are pushing... Free Choice... sounds good huh?... Well, this act PREVENTS a Secret Ballot Choice!!!... the hallmark of ANY Free Society/ System.

 

Again, no cohersion here.. oh no....

[David Rakoczy]

Sorry David, but Canada will soon annex the USA- R. Boddington

 

I hope not... interesting that 41% of those with colon cancer in Canada die... while 32% in the US die... The reason is because Canada sees one of the most effective drugs for fighting colon cancer as TOO EXPENSIVE. This (may) be what we have to look forward to here... (I hope not)... not to mention there are no where near enough medical techs to suddenly handle all those brought in by a 'comprehensive' healthcare system... not to mention giving amnesty to 12 million illegal aliens... and everyone running in when they have the flu. :o

 

Look, I am all for helping each person who (needs) help. I really am.. and do... but... we can't afford what (Obama) is spending and no where NEAR what (he) intends to spend! I mean really.. over a Billion an hour has been spent during this Admin... he has spent more than ALL previous presidents (combined) before him! :blink: ..and we are less than 100 days in... and hey, he just picked up where Bush left off (with regard to spending).. but added Nitrous!

 

My wife works for the Social Security Administration here in the US... believe me, we give a TON away to those who in no way deserve it. A week spent in any Social Security Administration office will turn you around... BIG time! Now, THERE is a Docu ready to be made. People filing for "disability" because "well, I don't deal well with authority"... yah. That is not a joke.. she hears it all the time!.. from people who can't (won't) name the father of each of their children.. who can't remember the spelling of their children's names... for REAL! At times... it has literally made her sick. They are smart enough to 'work' the system so, no, they aren't mentally incapable...

 

So what does this have to do with film...not much more than many other posts in this thread other than, well, it is a mentality that promotes a Big Government (Big Brother).. that can easily smother creativity, risk taking, entrepreneurialism, private ownership and on and on...

 

Since when did Big Brother become so 'cool'?

 

Let's give some trust back to the States... and most importantly.. to INDIVIDUALS.

[Michele Peterson]

Boycott sure.. stay home or work for.. or doing.. something else if you'd like. However, showing up, disrupting, intimidating and extorting,... no. Go do that to almost any other business and you'll get arrested. Try that on a Set in any Right To Work State and the Sheriff will escort you away...

 

The freedom to assemble allows people to protest (peacefully) if they desire to. Protesting is not the same as extorting or intimidating. No one here has shown proof of extortion or intimidation or disruption of the production in question. From what has been said, they are continuing to shoot. They are protesting to show their disagreement and make their opinion obvious to others. There is a reason the union members protesting have NOT been arrested.

[Guest]

I hope not... interesting that 41% of those with colon cancer in Canada die... while 32% in the US die... The reason is because Canada sees one of the most effective drugs for fighting colon cancer as TOO EXPENSIVE.

 

You can't possibly be thinking of getting into a "I have more horror stories about your countries health care system than you have about mine" debate?

 

I mean seriously that would be like a WWF star taking on a 98 year old woman. And Canada's system would be the WWF star. I mean really the two systems are not even in the same league.

 

Any way, picking on the US system is just too easy of a target, so I'll skip it in the spirit of forum brotherly love ;)

 

R,

[Daniel Madsen]

My wife works for the Social Security Administration here in the US... believe me, we give a TON away to those who in no way deserve it. A week spent in any Social Security Administration office will turn you around... BIG time! Now, THERE is a Docu ready to be made. People filing for "disability" because "well, I don't deal well with authority"... yah. That is not a joke.. she hears it all the time!.. from people who can't (won't) name the father of each of their children.. who can't remember the spelling of their children's names... for REAL! At times... it has literally made her sick. They are smart enough to 'work' the system so, no, they aren't mentally incapable...

 

Really? If we are talking about wasteful government insurance policies, you might want to start with a discussion about our nation’s financial institutions and the “too big to fail doctrine” that has prompted a public bailout. Starting with a discussion of SS is just laughable- it doesn’t even compare. If US banks are too big to fail then they shouldn’t exist. Otherwise, corps will be in our rears by design.

 

well, it is a mentality that promotes a Big Government (Big Brother).. that can easily smother creativity, risk taking, entrepreneurialism, private ownership and on and on...

 

Since when did Big Brother become so 'cool'?

 

Let's give some trust back to the States... and most importantly.. to INDIVIDUALS.

 

 

Are you trying to paint a picture in which big brother and entrepreneurialism are working against one another?

 

Not in the real world.

 

http://www.chomsky.info/talks/199805--.htm

 

 

 

Dan

Edited April 18, 2009 by Daniel Madsen

[David Rakoczy]

Really? If we are talking about wasteful government insurance policies, you might want to start with a discussion about our nation’s financial institutions and the “too big to fail doctrine” that has prompted a public bailout

 

You are a bit behind in this discussion my friend...you might want to read before posting. We have already covered that exact topic (see page 2) ;)

 

Are you trying to paint a picture in which big brother and entrepreneurialism are working against one another?

 

Not in the real world.

 

:lol:

[K Borowski]

Not that the U.S. Healthcare system isn't totally f*cked up, but, why is it then, that, the United States of America, objectively, has the world's best doctors?

 

I mean, I have had, like, 80% of my doctors who were not from the U.S.A. at birth, British, Eastern European, Polish, Indian, only one American in that bunch.

 

Hmmm.. .

 

We must be doing *something* right that all of these countries with "superior" healthcare's finest medical students are coming here in droves.

 

I agree that healthcare should, to some extent, be socialized in the United States, but not to the extent that you have to pay friggin' 30% sales taxes on top of everything to get it!

 

I think 8-5/8% is steep enough; thank you very much :ph34r:

[Guest]

why is it then, that, the United States of America, objectively, has the world's best doctors?

 

Sorry but that is a totally false claim, there isn't even a shred of evidence to support that claim.

 

Do you want a list of all the major medical break throughs that have been achieved recently and in the past that where done outside of the USA?

 

Do you want a list of how many people in your own country practice "medical tourism"?

 

Come on Karl, you are not one to make such ridiculous claims.

 

R,

[Stephen Williams]

Sorry but that is a totally false claim, there isn't even a shred of evidence to support that claim.

R,

 

Hi Richard,

 

Having seen this prostate operation I would not be quite so sure!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ME3FziQk_vs...=PL&index=4

 

Stephen

[Guest]

Hi Richard,

 

Having seen this prostate operation I would not be quite so sure!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ME3FziQk_vs...=PL&index=4

 

Stephen

 

They can do some good work in the USA, for the 13 Americans left that can afford to pay for it :lol:

 

France has pioneered the face transplant operation, a South African performed the world's first heart transplant operation, two Canadians discovered insulin, the list goes on.....

 

R,

[Stephen Williams]

They can do some good work in the USA, for the 13 Americans left that can afford to pay for it :lol:

 

France has pioneered the face transplant operation, a South African performed the world's first heart transplant operation, two Canadians discovered insulin, the list goes on.....

 

R,

 

A French surgeon pioneered liposuction, I guess that has made some American surgeons rich!

 

S