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MichaelFrymus

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The better restaurant analogy is if you were running a restaurant and expected the waiters to bring all the cutlery and crockery and the chefs to bring all their own pots, pans and ovens.

(Edit: as Stuart just said.)

Ah, but chefs do bring their own knives which are usually more expensive than pots and pans. And I do not believe they charge their employers more for that.

 

This is all irrelevant anyway because we can all argue about what is right or wrong and you are not exactly objective in this (don't you own a rental house?)

 

The point is...the market will determine what is normal in the coming days and people either make themselves competitive or they will have to find other ways to support themselves.

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I dont know why anyone has a problem with flat rate pricing

 

 

If I quoted a flat rate for Myself, Camera, and G&E, my rate would be over $10,000 a week for even a low budget feature. The very first thing the producer would request would be an itemized breakdown so they could see what they were paying for, and when they had that they'd start striking stuff off my quote and sourcing it elsewhere to get the best deal. If they're going to do that anyway, there's no point in me investing in all that equipment.

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If I quoted a flat rate for Myself, Camera, and G&E, my rate would be over $10,000 a week for even a low budget feature. The very first thing the producer would request would be an itemized breakdown so they could see what they were paying for, and when they had that they'd start striking stuff off my quote and sourcing it elsewhere to get the best deal. If they're going to do that anyway, there's no point in me investing in all that equipment.

I was referring to asking a Producer first what they require and then quoting them your rate. If a Producer doesnt want a DP/Op with camera then I am sure they would not require you to have one. But if he wants one with gear and you either cant provide it or want too much to provide it then you arent getting the job anyway. I dont see the issue.

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The only reason a producer wants a DP/OP with gear is because they think they are going to get a better deal that way. There is no other advantage to them. Most owner operators will end up sub renting parts of the package anyway.

 

Personally, I find the idea that it's my camera package that gets me the job, rather than my ability, to be quite offensive. I've certainly lost a few jobs to 21 year old 'DPs' who 'own a RED'

 

You say you want a flat rate, but you also want it broken down. Those things fly in the face of each other. Flat rates are always higher than an itemized rate because they have a safety net built in to cover unforeseen circumstances and the inevitable additions. Only a fool is going to quote you cost.

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Only a fool is going to quote you cost.

I guess I am not a good person to ask because I am in Northern California where you cant get a job without gear. No one around here cares about your skill level if you dont have tools of the trade. We dont even have rental houses here so a camera becomes a necessity. And if a filmmaker owns a camera here, they figure they have more experience than some wannabee DP/Op that doesnt own a camera because they have more access and practice. In certain areas, the classic Hollywood style is drying up if it ever existed in the first place.

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