Maia Martin Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Hallo! I need to shoot some super8 scened in Black and White. I don't have much experience with super8 but I would like to achieve clean pictures, with as much detail as possible, not too much noise. I will shoot both in daylight and at night. Someone suggested that I use the Kodak Vision 200 and 500 and bring it to balck and white in post production, since negative film is more precise than reversal. What do you think about that? Did someone do that before? Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberto Pirodda Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 to get clean picture w/o noise in Super 8 is a challenge :-( anyway, in daylight scene you could use Vision 3 50D nowadays the sharpest filmstock. Use tele/middletele lenses. f5.6 iris gives the best out from every lens, from the most economic to most expensive ones. In night scenes Vision 500 is the way to go, but expect coarse grain. Overexposing negative filmstock ( about 1/3 to 1/2 f stop) gives less noticeable noise. Use good S8 camera with C-mount lens like Beaulieu ZM if possible, and fit a 35mm still lens at full aperture ( with proper c-mount adapter) for night shots. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zac Fettig Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 They shot "The Artist" on color film (albeit 35mm) and turned the saturation down in post. Heck, if you just get a DVD copy of "Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow" and turn the saturation all the way down on your TV, it's a much better movie. Noise and jitter are big problems in super 8. Not much you can do about that. If you really want a clean film image, move up to 16mm or 35mm. Part of the charm of super 8 is the lack of clean image. Double-x isn't available in super 8 and Plus-x was discontinued years ago. The only options in B&W film stock today are Tri-X and Wittner-54. Personally, I don't like Tri-X much. The Wittner 54 (repackaged ORWO UN-54; it can be used as either negative or reversal) would be an ideal choice (since you're in Europe. It's not availble in the US). Kodak Vision3 with the saturation turned down would also work very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Tyler Purcell Posted August 26, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted August 26, 2015 I can't imagine how bad vision 3 500asa will look in super 8, its pretty grainy in 16mm as it is. For super 8, you really need to be in the 50 - 100asa range to keep the grain down and have some sense of a clean image. Since you really can't get 100 anymore, you're kinda stuck with 50. So lighting your night scenes appropriately will be your biggest challenge. Desaturating in post is what most people do anyway, so that's not a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lasse Roedtnes Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Hi Tyler, I can't imagine how bad vision 3 500asa will look in super 8, its pretty grainy in 16mm as it is.For super 8, you really need to be in the 50 - 100asa range to keep the grain down and have some sense of a clean image. Since you really can't get 100 anymore, you're kinda stuck with 50. So lighting your night scenes appropriately will be your biggest challenge.Desaturating in post is what most people do anyway, so that's not a problem. I think 500T can look fantastic just see here: especially the lamp shot I think is one of my favorites All the best Lasse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Will Montgomery Posted August 26, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted August 26, 2015 Good Night, and Good Luck was shot on Vision 500T color stock then the color was removed in post. That gets you a finer grain film with decent ASA. In Super 8, you will still get a "small format" look but it will be much less contrasty than a B&W reversal film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Will Montgomery Posted August 26, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted August 26, 2015 I can't imagine how bad vision 3 500asa will look in super 8, its pretty grainy in 16mm as it is. Huh? Vision 3 500T is amazing and is BY FAR the most used motion picture stock. Yes, it can be more grainy but that is more about the lighting...if you try to shoot 500T in minimal light as most people in small format would do, it will be grainy. Light it properly in 16mm and you'd be fine. Super 8; yes more grainy than 50D of course but not unusable...just light it well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maia Martin Posted August 26, 2015 Author Share Posted August 26, 2015 Thanks everyone for answering and for the great advice. @Lasse, that actually looks very good, not so much grain as I expected. This stock seems to vary quite a lot, according to different tests I have seen on the internet. Is it true the negative film stock is somehow more precise than the reversal (more detail)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Tyler Purcell Posted August 26, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted August 26, 2015 If you light things properly, you can get away with a higher ASA stock and reduce that grain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Bill DiPietra Posted August 26, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted August 26, 2015 I can't imagine how bad vision 3 500asa will look in super 8, its pretty grainy in 16mm as it is. I have to disagree with that one. I was going for a grainy look on 7219 for my last project and wound up having to push it 2 stops to get it. All of the Kodak stocks have become rather fine-grained these days, including 7219. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Stevens Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 500T is going to be grainy, no matter what you do. I chose it for that reason when I shot a short film that involed nudity and :blink: masturbation. I didn't want it to look like a porno. I'm in pre-production on a project that will be shot on Super8 and we are shooting almost exclusively on Vision2 200T, which will be converted to B&W in post. The few exterior shots will be photographed on 50D and we do have some shots to nail in the NYC Subway system, and for those we are using 500T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maia Martin Posted August 27, 2015 Author Share Posted August 27, 2015 Very interesting Matt!....is there something of what you shot on 500t visible online? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Stevens Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Miscommunications... https://vimeo.com/27267624 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Tyler Purcell Posted August 28, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted August 28, 2015 The 50D stuff looks great! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Bill DiPietra Posted August 30, 2015 Premium Member Share Posted August 30, 2015 Hi Matt. I liked that film very much. Very interesting concept. The interiors seemed a bit flat, but I liked the shot where she is looking at herself in the mirror - the practical lamp in the background is very nicely blown-out. Also, I always watch reels and shorts with the sound off, then again with it on. It would have been even more effective without the voice-over because you conveyed everything very clearly with the imagery. In any case, nice job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christophernigel Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Hallo! I need to shoot some super8 scened in Black and White. I don't have much experience with super8 but I would like to achieve clean pictures, with as much detail as possible, not too much noise. I will shoot both in daylight and at night. Someone suggested that I use the Kodak Vision 200 and 500 and bring it to balck and white in post production, since negative film is more precise than reversal. What do you think about that? Did someone do that before? Thank you It 's the other way around ? to shoot reversal Film imeans you need to get it right / with Negative film you can over or under Expose and then fix in post . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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