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Question for Mr. Mullen


Ckulakov

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Daniel & Landon...

 

Sorry guys but you still have no concept of the economics of life. Remember that jobs in the film industry are hard to come by. Not only that, but how much time & money have you spent trying to break into the industry? How often do you think about working in the film industry? How much time have you spent researching films, books, online forums, discussing the industry, sucking up to the right people, etc.

 

Film jobs are not like "normal" jobs. Normal jobs are much easier to come by, generally less stressful, usually pay better & have better conditions.

 

Lets say you finally break into the film industry after years of freebies, hard work & years of research, what happens if you make some mistakes on the job? Maybe upset the wrong person & says "you'll never work in the film industry again"?

 

Most people who work in the film industry are very devoted, have films 24/7 on their mind so its a "full-life-time" job, not to mention are very good at it. With many regular jobs you just rock up to work, clock on, get through the day, clock off & go home knowing theres plenty more work tomorrow, & usually still get paid reasonably well in comparison to many film jobs. If you get sacked from a regular job, who cares? You'll find another job somewhere else usally quite easily.

 

Its funny ya know, here in Australia we have heaps & heaps of jobs in the building industry. Many of my mates work in building & are earning anything between AU$50,000 to $100,000. They have little stress, know theres heaps of work & once they clock off the job exits their mind. You never seem to clock off with a film job, you're constantly trying to educate yourself after hours, its your life....

 

Film crew should be compensated appropriately, simple as that.....

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Note however, If David would actually come work on my film set, and I had the money to pay him, I would more than likly offer more than $700/day upfront. I mean having someone like David on board your team could mean the difference between a good film and a bad film (at least in the overla look of it). $700/day in the industry is not a lot of money, I was just consider hoe people outside the industry see it.

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Daniel,

 

David's wife also works full time, so I'm sure that helps to smooth out the gaps. And I'm sure there are lots of film workers who have a spouse with a "regular" job.

 

Did you not read this statement from David regarding his car....

 

"When I drive to ASC meetings, I notice the range of cars in the parking lot, from my 15 year old Toyota Tercel, to the latest Porsche, etc."

 

If he was as dripping in money as you seem to think, would he drive a 15 year old Toyota Tercel?

 

*************************

 

Then there's Landon who seems to be embarking on a teenage marriage :blink:

 

I guess there's no point Landon in quoting you the stats on the success rate for teenage marriages? Right, never mind.

 

R,

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And it was my wife who made the payments on the car during the decade I was getting established (we bought it while I was in film school...)

 

There are some advantages to being home so much of the year, not working, being with my wife, sure. But that's not all by design.

 

You spend a lot of your time going on job interviews as a DP. In fact, I have one this morning. Lower crew members get work more casually, a call to come in and day-play on some feature, etc. Doesn't work that way for me. I go to job interviews, prepare for them, prepare for features, then maybe the feature doesn't happen and I go back into the job interview cycle. Hence why it can take a month or two looking for the next feature that will employ you for the next few months.

 

Ideally, I'd fill in the gaps with commercial work, but that's a whole nuther arena, another set of connections, etc. It's like the Catch-22 of getting into a union -- you can get commercial work when you have commercial credits... And honestly, my heart is in features.

 

Directors have it worse than DP's though -- I may do two features a year, they are lucky to do one feature every two years. Hence one reason why the pay rate goes up in these higher positions.

 

I don't mean to sound whiney -- it's a GREAT life, regardless of what it pays. Much better than a 9-to-5 job in an office! If I can keep making a decent living at it, I'm one of the lucky ones.

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David,

 

I have just secured financing for my next project and I'd like you to DP it.

 

It's about guys who work 9-5 in an office, so we'll be shooting 9-5 in an office :D

 

R,

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Guest Daniel J. Ashley-Smith
Daniel,

 

Did you not read this statement from David regarding his car....

 

"When I drive to ASC meetings, I notice the range of cars in the parking lot, from my 15 year old Toyota Tercel, to the latest Porsche, etc."

 

If he was as dripping in money as you seem to think, would he drive a 15 year old Toyota Tercel?

Your either dripping with cash or you have plenty of spare time, depending on how often you work. Most people have neither and they work full time.

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Guest Daniel J. Ashley-Smith
Normal jobs... generally less stressful, usually pay better & have better conditions.

Uhh.. yeh, right.

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Note however, If David would actually come work on my film set, and I had the money to pay him, I would more than likly offer more than $700/day upfront.

 

David - I'm curious. In the acting world, once you start doing features, you don't go back to certain indie fare for fear it might hurt your quote/status. Not until you get firmly established, and only then for certain directors, writers, etc.

 

At this point in your career, it's not just about a paycheck, yes? Haven't you also established a certain baseline of who you would work with, studios, established filmmakers, sold screenwriters, some name actors?

 

I think it's a bit presumptious to think a good DP can be had strictly for a quote... but maybe I'm wrong?

 

theturnaround

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Depends on how much you need the paycheck. Most of us aren't so well off that we can sit and wait for only the most artistic projects to come along. Plus the truth is that we find the work pleasurable, we find a lot of the people fun to work with, etc. -- so those two factors, the need for a paycheck and the joy of shooting -- account a lot for some of the bad movies we all shoot from time to time.

 

Personally, I feel more inclined to shoot something small and low-paying, but artistically rewarding, if I had just come off of something bigger that put a little money in my bank account. So a lot of it is timing.

 

Which is another reason we often take the first thing offered to us, because (1) you never know where it will lead, it may cause a connection to be formed that could improve your career, and (2) we never know if there will be a slow-down in the industry so we work as often as we can, small or large. Any money is sometimes better than no money, although you're right, you have to watch doing too many small or bad films because you get typed that way. Sometimes you hold out for more money or a better project in order to improve your status, but there are financial limits before you are forced to consider any work that comes along again.

 

It's like that line of Gus Grissom's in "The Right Stuff" where the younger pilots at Edwards AFB consider going into the Mercury space program as a way of jumping ahead of the seasoned pilots making fun of the space program: "You know the old saying about never turning down a flight assignment?"

 

You have to watch saying "no" too many times because you may be shutting the door to a new opportunity. One bigger ASC cinematographer told me years ago that he once charted all his movies based on who got him the job on each one and the connections that led to another movie, and he found that it was some of his worst movies that were eventually the connection to some of his best movies if you looked carefully at the chart.

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I actually turned down a feature last Friday night.

 

It was one of those "swords and sorcerers" movies, relatively low budget. I just can't stand that genre. They had good costumes though!

 

I may live to regret it, who knows?

 

R,

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Guest Daniel J. Ashley-Smith
I actually turned down a feature last Friday night.

 

It was one of those "swords and sorcerers" movies, relatively low budget.  I just can't stand that genre.  They had good costumes though!

 

I may live to regret it, who knows?

It might have been worth going for it, I mean it's good to get experience in a range of work, hell you might have enjoyed it, plus you would have got paid for it. Unless you done that kind of work before and hated it...

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It would have meant a major time committment for one thing, including shooting on weekends.

 

I have other day shoots lined up over the next 4-6 weeks and it's tough to just cancel them all. Even though they are self imposed stock shoots I need to get the work done during the brief summer here in the Canadian arctic.

 

I read many script pages and the dialouge was killing me! If they invested half the time and resources into the script as they did the costumes, it might be brilliant. This film is obviously a direct to video type of project, if they're lucky.

 

One sword fight after another after another....

 

So I'll wait for the next bus, there's always another one coming down the street.

 

R,

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Guest Daniel J. Ashley-Smith
It would have meant a major time committment for one thing, including shooting on weekends.

Am I missing something here or I am right in thinking you're complaining about working on weekends??

 

But either way, you said that you would have to cancel some other shoots, which just isn't worth it. Plus it'l give you the reputation of the guy who pulls out last minute, unreliable.

 

So I'll wait for the next bus, there's always another one coming down the street.

Yeh well.. easy for you to say that!

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Hi,

 

I don't mind working weekends, and I do it all the time. I'm working tomorrow. The problem here is that if you are working weekends and it isn't paying full rate, ergo not enough to allow you to take time off during the week, you do end up working every day straight for months on end. I did that for most of last autumn and through the winter and eventually it starts to affect your work, doing fourteen hour days every day on the trot.

 

Phil

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To throw a final expensive part of life into the mix, the color timing and DI process is still unpaid for the DP (and the telecine, on a commercial and/or music video), at least with the DPs I know.

 

That's not a huge deal with a traditional color answer print, but spend 4-5 weeks full-time in a DI suite, unpaid? DPs do it because if they don't, a movie with their name on it isn't going to look as they intended, and producers know this and are dragging their feet on changing the pay system to include DI. Someday, DI will be paid work time for the DP, but not yet.

 

I wonder how much of the 16 weeks david mullen wasn't working, he was not only hunting for work/interviewing, but also sitting in timing rooms or telecine suite's for recent work or the DVD releases of works from years past, unpaid but still working?

 

Interestly, Wally Pfister mentioned in AC this month how the producer just assumed he'd want to DI Batman Begins, and he said he felt he could do everything photochemically. Of course, I'm sure that that was a largely aesthetic decision, but not having to donate a month of his life to the sort of dark office room we are in the film industry to avoid was a bonus he probably appreciated.

 

Anyone getting paid to work the DI yet, is my info out of date? I wonder about someone with the clout of Robbie Richardson on the Aviator?

 

chuck

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This just came up in conversation recently. Andrew Lesnie was talking to a group of us (he just arrived in L.A. to deliver elements for the trailer for "King Kong" and make sure the prints look correct). He said he got paid for post work on the "Rings" movies and for "King Kong" and was a little surprised to hear that so many big-name ASC DP's didn't get paid for their month or so of D.I. work.

 

I don't put in those sorts of hours but I often spend at least two weeks doing the print timing and then the home video transfer, all for free.

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"I don't put in those sorts of hours but I often spend at least two weeks doing the print timing and then the home video transfer, all for free. "

 

Great! I have some home movies on Super 8 that need to be transfered to video, what is your mailing address?

 

R,

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I understand commercial D.P.'s generally maintain control up through transfer. Of course it costs them time, but their absense could cost a career if it's being performed at a poor level. Seems like a necessary component if one wishes to have their work distributed as they intended. There is surely a kind of "Quality Control" layer to the occupation that many of us younger guys fail to consider.

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Professionals should be paid for their time on a funded production because that's, well, one of the definitions of being a professional...

 

It's a serious problem, not being paid for post work. When it was just timing an answer print, where you might spend two hours at a lab a couple of times over a week, it was not a big financial burden.

 

To spend 8 hours a day for five days straight, like an office job but unpaid, in a telecine bay for a home video transfer is a little more annoying.

 

Now imagine spending the same time in a color-correction suite for a month unpaid -- you start to LOSE work because you're unavailable, so it's costing you money to be there. It's like you're investing your own money into a production that you don't actually own nor get a percentage of profits from, just "for the good of the movie." Well, that sort of charity only goes so far.

 

Studios are going to have to start to budget for these things. Some already do -- a DP told me that he did a feature for HBO films where he was told without asking for it that there was money in the budget for him to supervise the color-correction in post.

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Professionals should be paid for their time on a funded production because that's, well, one of the definitions of being a professional...

 

It's a serious problem, not being paid for post work.  When it was just timing an answer print, where you might spend two hours at a lab a couple of times over a week, it was not a big financial burden.

 

To spend 8 hours a day for five days straight, like an office job but unpaid, in a telecine bay for a home video transfer is a little more annoying.

 

Now imagine spending the same time in a color-correction suite for a month unpaid -- you start to LOSE work because you're unavailable, so it's costing you money to be there.  It's like you're investing your own money into a production that you don't actually own nor get a percentage of profits from, just "for the good of the movie."  Well, that sort of charity only goes so far.

 

Studios are going to have to start to budget for these things. Some already do -- a DP told me that he did a feature for HBO films where he was told without asking for it that there was money in the budget for him to supervise the color-correction in post.

Would it be possible for you to get in your contract that you get to OK the post work? Then they could pay someone else to do it, and if you didn't like it, then they'd HAVE to pay you to sit in there as they do it right? Hopefully they'd recognize the folly and just pay you in the first place. No good?

 

That sounds like a real bummer. What do you do if you have a gig lined up right after you wrap production?

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That sounds like a real bummer. What do you do if you have a gig lined up right after you wrap production?

 

That's always a problem -- color timing can occur six months to a year (or more) after picture wrap when you are most likely on another shoot. You can't really plan your life around when the picture will be locked and ready to be conformed and printed.

 

Not many people can get a contract signed that guarantees them any approval over the final film, not even directors.

 

I'm sure Storaro had all sorts of requirements in his contract to shoot "The Exorcist" prequel, but when he was hired, it was called "John Frankenheimer's The Exorcist...(whatever)" because that's who was directing it at first.

 

So after it was made and the studio refused to do the finishing using a 4K D.I. or in the 2:1 ratio he shot the film in, I heard a rumor that Storaro objected and basically the studio said "your contract said your work was for 'John Frankenheimer's The Exorcist...' and that's not the movie that got made, so we don't have to honor your contract." It's one of those "so sue us" attitudes that people with all the power have.

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That's always a problem -- color timing can occur six months to a year (or more) after picture wrap when you are most likely on another shoot.  You can't really plan your life around when the picture will be locked and ready to be conformed and printed.

 

Not many people can get a contract signed that guarantees them any approval over the final film, not even directors.

 

I'm sure Storaro had all sorts of requirements in his contract to shoot "The Exorcist" prequel, but when he was hired, it was called "John Frankenheimer's The Exorcist...(whatever)" because that's who was directing it at first. 

 

So after it was made and the studio refused to do the finishing using a 4K D.I. or in the 2:1 ratio he shot the film in, I heard a rumor that Storaro objected and basically the studio said "your contract said your work was for 'John Frankenheimer's The Exorcist...' and that's not the movie that got made, so we don't have to honor your contract."  It's one of those "so sue us" attitudes that people with all the power have.

Wow! Even Vittorio Storaro can't get the love...

 

It seems like any producer with half a brain wanna would listen to the multiple award winning DP?

I guess maybe since Frankenheimer became unavailable, and the thing ended up less than originally thought, perhaps they didn't want to sink any more $$ into it? I missed that one.

 

Haven't producers learned anything from the "Major Dundee" fiasco?

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