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"CineZooms" with AF capability?


Joseph Tese

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Good Morning!

On behalf of a new corporate video department, I am helping build the equipment and workflow. As you may imply by the name corporate (or may not), and highly considering the C70, the type of work can and will vary in scope , where versatility is a huge consideration (run and gun single/2person operation, with the potential to evolve into more complicated setups). The 15.5-47 Canon CineZoom caught my eye (which had a crazy price drop in the past year or so). Then I discovered the 18--80, which is more of a hybrid lens between DSLR and CineLenses. The 18-80 is a manageable weight that may not require rails, and in situations with minimal crew and fast setups, the AF on the 18-80 will come in handy. I can only find the 18-80 and 70-200 boasting AF capability in that line. I know there will be times the T4.4 will kick me in the butt. Do you know of any other "hybrids" that boast Cinequality and functionality but also incorporate AF? Do you feel that there will be more of these lenses as the two worlds seem to be merging more and more?

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As far as I am aware, the Canon 18-80mm and 70-200mm are the only autofocus cine zooms so far in EF mount. Sony also make a few for their E mount cameras. 

That said, I’m not sure the ‘autofocus cine zoom’ is a lens category that makes much sense, as least given the current available options. 

‘Cinema’ to me means several things - an aesthetically pleasing look, parfocal, well-spaced, repeatable witness marks for the 1st AC, well-controlled tracking, low-breathing, constant size/volume for use with matte box/follow focus, serviceability for backfocus and other adjustments, and robust build for constant use. A minimum aperture of around T2.8 would also be a priority for me. None of the currently available options meet that criteria. Of course, if you don’t need all of those things then your calculus may be different. 

There are some quite affordable options in cinema zooms and primes available these days that did not exist a few years ago. For example, DZO Film is putting out some remarkably high quality lens offerings at crazy prices, and they are not the only ones. 

Re: autofocus

There are quite a few lenses that work well for this, while having an acceptable or even pleasing look. So if autofocus is a priority, then I would consider buying two separate sets of lenses for each use case. Personally, I am looking at a Sony FX6 and G Master primes, specifically for autofocus use. I’m not getting rid of my cinema lenses though! Different tools for different applications.

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1 hour ago, Satsuki Murashige said:

As far as I am aware, the Canon 18-80mm and 70-200mm are the only autofocus cine zooms so far in EF mount. Sony also make a few for their E mount cameras. 

That said, I’m not sure the ‘autofocus cine zoom’ is a lens category that makes much sense, as least given the current available options. 

‘Cinema’ to me means several things - an aesthetically pleasing look, parfocal, well-spaced, repeatable witness marks for the 1st AC, well-controlled tracking, low-breathing, constant size/volume for use with matte box/follow focus, serviceability for backfocus and other adjustments, and robust build for constant use. A minimum aperture of around T2.8 would also be a priority for me. None of the currently available options meet that criteria. Of course, if you don’t need all of those things then your calculus may be different. 

There are some quite affordable options in cinema zooms and primes available these days that did not exist a few years ago. For example, DZO Film is putting out some remarkably high quality lens offerings at crazy prices, and they are not the only ones. 

Re: autofocus

There are quite a few lenses that work well for this, while having an acceptable or even pleasing look. So if autofocus is a priority, then I would consider buying two separate sets of lenses for each use case. Personally, I am looking at a Sony FX6 and G Master primes, specifically for autofocus use. I’m not getting rid of my cinema lenses though! Different tools for different applications.

Thanks for the reply. Considering the budget and type of work, and in light of your reply, I am shying away from the cinezoom idea and heading back to the regular af/photography lens market. Again, concerning AF, I also assume Canon glass is going to be optimized greatly for Canon camera's AF abilities. The RF lenses look like great quality, but I'm a bit confused by Canon's decision to suspend EF lens creation? Especially knowing, that the C300mkiii is a great partner to the C70, since they share the same sensor. The C300mkiii I believe can never swap to an RF mount - I think that would require a whole new body because of how short of a flange distance it is. The RF camera mount is great as far as adaptability to other lens mount types, but not the other way around. It makes me not want to invest in RF lenses, knowing I can't use the glass on C300mkiii or other cameras "above" the C70. So, the RF lens market is appropriate for only C70 and mirrorless users. It pushes me back to just investing in EF canon glass for my scenario.

Edited by Joseph Tese
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Well, it’s just one person’s opinion so please take with a grain of salt and get a few more opinions for a well-rounded outlook! 

I haven’t used the C70 or C300Mk3, but from experience with the C300Mk2, the EF photo lens autofocus with at least the L series 50mm, 85mm, 16-35mm, 24-70mm, and 70-200mm are decent. If your subject happens to look down, the autofocus can loose the face and default to the background, which is problematic for interviews. Maybe this has been improved with the newer cameras, not sure. 

Re: RF mount

Yes, the timing of releasing EF mount-only cine cameras at the same time as switching focus to RF mount is poor planning. RF lenses are also eye-wateringly expensive and large.

Frankly, I think Sony FX6/FX9/A7S3/E-mount  ecosystem makes more sense for corporate work with the vast amount of interviews that could use Face/Eye tracking, but I also recognize that many production companies are locked into the Canon ecosystem after all these years with C300s...

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I fall into the category you speak of, of being so used to the Canon EOS line and their lenses. I did some self mental abuse comparing both the FX6 and C70. Wish I could have them in front of me, but fell back to what I felt confident in, the EOS line. I've never had any issues with the C300 and C200 AF ability, was always impressed. But, like we just pointed out, that's been my world - not able to compare it side by side to other systems. Ultimately, I sometimes toggle to AF  for  shoulder mounted scenarios, or for run and gun B-Roll and tracking people while handheld.

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