Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Will Montgomery

Black & White Stocks

Recommended Posts

Just got out of "Good Night, And Good Luck."

 

Have to say that I was stunned at how beautiful the film looked. The sharpness and detail was amazing, and the shadows were handled great too. I know many cinematographers who dream of shooting a feature in B&W so Robert Elswit must have had a wonderful time shooting it.

 

As far as I know, there are only 2 b&w negative stocks available from Kodak... is there any way to tell what might have been used? Or is there a possibility that a color stock was used and printed in b&w?

 

Kodak also has a 3200 speed "Max-T" stock for still cameras... I wonder what that would look like in a movie film? Probably no compelling financial case could be made for its production, but it would be fun to experiment with.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kodak has 4:

 

Plus-X reversal

Plus-X negative

Tri-X reversal

Double-X negative

 

Fuji has one:

 

Neopan

 

and there's stock from other companies too. I'm a big fan of Fomapan, for instance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm familiar with Kodak's B&W stocks, I'd love to run some tests with Neopan or Fomapan. I'm sure I can get Neopan from Fuji, but are there any US distributors for Fomapan?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm familiar with Kodak's B&W stocks, I'd love to run some tests with Neopan or Fomapan. I'm sure I can get Neopan from Fuji, but are there any US distributors for Fomapan?

 

J and C photo carries it in 16mm.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Fuji has one:

 

Neopan

 

But Neopan isn't available in motion picture lengths and perfs is it ?

 

News to me if it was.

 

-Sam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

 

There are possiblities to do like exposing with a color negative and print in color positive and develop the color positive in a B/W contrast developer for the required product gamma.

As I have done this test and got it , try it. Look what others tell.

 

L.K.Keerthi basu

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
J and C photo carries it in 16mm.

 

Checked with J and C photo, they were out of stock, but expect more in within 3 or 4 weeks. Guess its a good sign that they still make it.

 

The price is $22 a piece while Kodak's Tri-X and Plus-X is $18.56... But the extra silver content interests me enough to give it a try. Just want to make sure I get it processed properly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From the trailer of "Good Night, And Good Luck" it looks to my eye like it was shot on color film stock. It's just something about the texture.

 

I think ORWO still makes a negative B/W stock.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I think ORWO still makes a negative B/W stock.

 

They do, bit I wouldn't recommend it to anyone though. For my last film we compared it to Kodak's Double X and found them to be indentical looking (down to the ASA which is really 200, not 400 like they claim). So we picked the ORWO, wanting to support the East-German economy a bit. However after 2 days, we switched back to Kodak, because the ORWO was just not manufactured to very high standards: the thickness and with of the stock varies a lot, it is noisy as hell and we had hairs in the gate all the time. There was one scene in particular where the gate was dirty on litterally every single take. I have never seen such sloppy manufacturing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have shot about 28.000 meters of 35mm Filmotec/Orwo black&white stock and never had any of these problems. The problems you described were typical of old Orwo stock, which used to be madeon machines from the 1940s (before WW2, the Orwo plant used to be Agfa's main factory). They had big problems in keeping thickness of base and cutting dimensions under control, and with old NP55 and NP7 neg stock, you sometimes had dust and even nicks in the base that produced pressure exposure lines once or twice in a 400ft. roll.

 

Since the new Filmotec/Orwo b&w stocks were launched - they are manufactured on state-of-the-art machinery - I have a lot of 35mm Filmotec/Orwo negative and never had this problem. It was used with Arri 2C, Arri 3, Arri BL4 and Konvas 2M cameras, and there was no more emulsion shedding than with standard Fuji or Eastman color stocks.

 

Personally, I prefer Filmotec/Orwo's emulsions to Eastman Plus-X and Double-X because they give more of a vintage "1960s" black&white look. In telecines from camera negs, steadiness was perfect, so the tolerances in perforating and slitting must have been OK.

 

Adam, did you contact the manufacturer's service dept. about the problems you had? Maybe it was a compatibility problem with a specific camera, I recall problems with certain panavision models and others black&white stocks.

 

All in all, I consider Filmotec/Orwo b&w a good alternative both in terms of quality and budget, and if somebody is unsure about it, just get a roll of the stock you need and test it. I tried some variations in devellopment time with my particular lab and prefer the results to anything I did with Plus-X or Double-X before.

 

Data Sheet Filmotec N 74

 

Data Sheet Filmotec UN 54

 

Just my $0.02 from the low budget b&w world... :)

Edited by Christian Appelt

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just before the shoot I did call the head technician at ARRI Munich to enquire about the ORWO stock and he strongly recommend not to use it because of the aforementioned problems. By then we had the stock already delivered to use, so we decided to give it a go anyway. After two shooting days we switched to Kodak and my line producer called up ORWO to talk to them about the problems we've been having. They did not sound very convincing in their claim that they had never encountered these problems before, but they took the stock back.

 

We used both an Arri 535A and a 435 on the shoot. Both cameras ran fine with the Kodak stock.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I think Ilford might be persuaded to bring back their movie film if enough people ask.

 

My understanding is that the Ilford Unit in the Uk was placed under receivership a while ago. :o The swiss operation that makes Ink Jet Paper was not affected. :angry:

 

If the Uk operation carries on, they would need a strong order to justify making a batch of MP film. Mind you, the Ilford MP film was suposed to be identical to their still film, except for the Perforations and lenght.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  


  • Wooden Camera



    G-Force Grips



    Tai Audio



    Glidecam



    Serious Gear



    Ritter Battery



    FJS International



    The Original Slider



    Broadcast Solutions Inc



    CineLab



    Rig Wheels Passport



    Metropolis Post



    Paralinx LLC



    New Pro Video - New and Used Equipment



    Just Cinema Gear



    Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS



    Gamma Ray Digital Inc



    Visual Products



    Abel Cine


    Cinematography Books and Gear
×
×
  • Create New...