Jim Jannard

This is the last time I will allow Mr. Rhodes to infer that we are "lying" about anything. Or that we owe any explanation to Mr. Rhodes about any topic. My suggestion, Graeme, it that we all spend our time in a more productive forum.

Jim

Yeah, the script could go something like this: New hi-tech startup borrows lots of money to develop prototype. Investors get antsy when prototype doesn't live up to hype...feel they're being taken for a ride. When company can't make good on investment, investors decide to confiscate equipment. Company employees hasten to hide gear, claiming it was stolen. They even keep jacking up the reward money, since they know it will never be paid anyway. Company brass end up being charged with fraud, after which they're sent to "country club" prison, where they proceed to hustle fellow prisoners into backing them for the next startup, which will be referred to as "Blue". Sorry, I couldn't resist, but something sounds fishy.

Why don't you guys come help us clean up the glass? I can't believe I stayed here this long to put up with this crap.

Last post.

Jim

The reward has been raised to $100K.

Jim

There was a break-in at the RED offices last night. Everything they took was camera and camera file related. We will NOT be slowed up by this distraction, but we are offering a $50K reward for information that leads to the arrest and conviction of those that did this.

Jim

Richard... no problem. Shoot film. BTW, why do you own a GL1 instead of a pocket film camera?

Jim

Our footage is not film. It was never intended to be exactly like film. We certainly are NOT trying to emulate grain. What we are doing is to try to capture a digital image that doesn't look like traditional video. The goal was to make an image that has great color, ultra high resolution (not necessarily sharpness) and a rich "feel"... much like film has. I think we are well on our way. Those who want to shoot film (and develop, process and telecine) certainly have many options to do that. We want to provide an alternative that feels right, and is viod of the unnecessary costs associated with film. Pretty simple.

Jim

I echo Graeme's comments. Dalsa has truly set the mark for Digital Cinema (certainly the one we are shooting at) :-) and cannot be described as a "video" camera.

Jim

Deanan... we haven't shot the Ultra Primes yet. Got a set you want to lend us?

We'll post 12-bit tiffs pretty soon. Remember, we are still a few months out from shipping. ISO is a very tricky subject. We are playing it on the conservative side until we do more testing. Our sensor turned on for the 1st time about 4 weeks ago. And we spent a lot of time getting ready for, and attending, IBC. We are now back on the development track. By showing "work in progress" it is easy to assume we are done. We are not. The images we have posted don't even have dead pixel correction. We'd like to get a few more things done before we post full 4k images that will be under a microscope.

Jim

This was shot with a Cooke 65mm S4. We really like the Cooke primes.

Jim

We are a garage operation and had three days to shoot something to get ready for IBC. We can handle the 1980's comments. We are building a camera, not trying to raise funds for a movie. We have just posted the 1st 2k image. It is interesting because it captures that "instant". Please note the noise levels (or lack thereof). And the "hand" that certainly does NOT smack of video. A 4k version (8-bit jpeg) will be posted tomorrow.

http://red.com/gallery-still.htm

Jim

There are a few frame grabs from the footage shown at IBC on the RED website. Shot 24 fps at 1/48th sec and around f4.

Jim

Matthew... again I ask you. What the hell are you talking about? Do you always jump to conclusions this quick, build a picture in your head and convict? Come on, man.

Jim

... or written by you?

It would be visually lossless either way. I'd vote for the elbow room.

Jim

its a 9.99% increase in picture area. At that difference, I think it comes down to a matter of asthetic preference, as to whether you want your anamorphic artifacts or not.

As a sidebar, I still think it'd be a great idea to be able to tell the Red to pre-crop your picture to specific parameters BEFORE ENCODING, thereby saving your 27MB/s just for the info you intend to use.

We agree with your math and conclusion. We are considering offering the option to crop before recording, although if we do it is likely to be an upgrade after release (free, of course). But the question begs to be asked if saving a little disk space (in REDCODE RAW) is worth giving up post choices?

Jim

Sorry, no, I don't automatically trust you, and you are asking for a lot of my money so I will microscopically examine it all I like.

 

Phil

Phil... we aren't asking for any of your money. In fact we don't want to take a reservation from anyone who is nervous. If someone changed their minds after placing a reservation and gets nervous, we'll promptly refund their $1000 deposit. And we will present what we are doing as we see fit.

Jim

Somebody else raised this somewhere, and I think it's an excellent question:

 

And Graeme answered it the same place you read the question. Maybe you should have just posted his answer instead of the game?

I'm holding up OK. And since there are several posters on this board that hold reservations, I might only be speaking to them. You tout yourself as supreme expert, maybe you would like to tell us about yourself/selves. Maybe some PV history? And currently?

Jim

Thanks Jim, finally I got your attention for once. My hypothesis was correct in thinking that you would not leave these boards afterall. I had previously asked you a question in another thread and I dont think it was ever answered. I was utmost sincere when I asked it and I still am.

 

I will rephrase how I asked it before...

 

Is RED a good value for the filmmaker who can only afford to shoot on 16mm? When I ask this, I mean total workflow and everything. Would the cost be reasonable considering shooting till editing on a computer? For instance, if I want to make a 90 minute feature, would the RED be a better cost/ value tradeoff than 16mm film? I mean this question with all sincerity. And I dont consider a fire sale of the RED after production as a true indicator of value. Afterall, you have to come up with money initially to fund a project.

 

As far as my remark about him never having it in his hands, it is because I think as the project goes on, demand will increase such that he wont get one. Also, I feel that the price will go up as interest increases. A good thing never lasts for us poor folks, you can count on that. And I am assuming this will be a good thing. But if it is, there will be a catch.

Matthew... we had begun a cost analysis of shooting 35mm and S16 vs. REDCODE RAW before leaving for IBC. It isn't finished yet but I hope to have it done in a couple of weeks. Testing the camera is 1st priority and we still need some current numbers for telecine. Thing to remember is that from the time we post, digital will go down (drives, etc.) and film will go up.

Jim

I'm in Prague (unreal city) but heading back tomorrow to OC to do some dynamic range testing. :-) Thanks for the offer.

Jim

You guys are too much. After all the grousing, it sounds like you support the footage. How about I buy you all a beer when we get together?

Jim

We had three days to shoot and still make IBC. The Porsche 959 shot was our attempt to show something brave and difficult.. We'll shoot more and test more as soon as we get home. But we are very proud of what was presented at IBC. We had many people tell us the footage was more than they had ever expected and better than they had ever seen from digital... some said better than 35mm film. We expect extreme scrutiny. And we are prepared to provide footage and information to satisfy the most demanding critic. Just give us a week. After all, we started 8 months ago.

Jim

OK, Stephen. You can't test our sensor. That's my answer. Only because you wouldn't answer my question. "What did you see that was a dissapointment?" When you posted that comment, it gave the impression that something was wrong with the dynamic range. I don't think you meant that, but that is the impression you gave. That shot has baffled many in the industry. How it could elegantly handle a 4k light IN the shot and show incredible gradation on the 959, show detail in the shadows INCLUDING the orange power cord which was not lit at all.

Had you said you were amazed (as all the other people who saw it), I would have flown you out to test our sensor, on my dime. Too late. :-)

Jim

I answered the question. You did not.

"I heard the 15 stop claim before I saw the footage, that may account for some of my dissapointment."

You saw the Porsche shot. You heard the 12-15 stops from the exiting viewers. What did you see that was a dissapointment? Exactly?

I'm going to post that shot. You are the critic. Here is your chance to to say what you saw before I post it.

Jim

Stephen... yes, the answer to David's question. I wish you would answer the questions I ask as directly as I answer the ones you ask.

Jim