Will Novy

just curious as to what shooters are setting there scene files to or rather what they found worked best for them.

Here you go: http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=47406

No, that's correct -- 1/96th is one-stop less exposure than 1/48th. As you can see, it's the SHUTTER SPEED that determines exposure, whereas the frame rate only matters in that it affects the shutter speed (i.e. at 24 fps with a 180 degree shutter angle, the shutter speed becomes 1/48th of a second.)

 

Now with most video cameras, you can turn off the shutter, thus at 48 fps, for example, you can have the frame exposed for that entire period, i.e. 1/48th of a second (it's not physically possible to take 48 pictures per second and have a per-frame exposure time longer than 1/48th, not without dropping the capture speed.) However, you get twice as much motion blur over the standard 180 degree shutter used by a film camera, so the motion looks smearier than is possible with a film camera at that frame rate.

Interesting information. Ill have to remember that later on. I thought that both the shutter and frame rate determined the exposure. But since it seems the shutter determines it, its a interesting way to increase, lower exposure for tricky shots without messing too much with the source of light.

Yes, shooting at 12 fps on the Varicam with a 1/24th shutter is one-stop more exposure than 24 fps with a 1/48th shutter.

So i take it david, 48 frames a second at 96 shutter is one stop less? Or am i way off?

Affordability is definately an large issue with this film. Being that the equipment is most likely going to be rented, would it just make sense to rent enough cards to last through one day (one rental house has extra cards at $25 each), and then do all the downloading directly to a firewire drive at the end of a day's shooting?

 

As for the editing, shooting 720/24p-->P2-->harddrive was based on the assumption that it would be problematic to edit. If the G5 can handle this easily, is it possible to edit 1080/24p-->P2-->harddrive on a G5? Is there a certain drive speed I need?

lets just say that my g4 laptop can edit 720p/24pn without a problem. I think the G5 will be fine, even if editing 1080i.

okay, so I post a similar thread a while ago in the jvc forum, but I still have some other questions.

 

First, compared to the hd100, any thoughts? Workflow, quality, use, design, anything and everything.

 

Secondly, and somewhat on the technical side I have some specific questions here.

 

1. when shooting the 'special frame rates', it's shot at say 60 frames a second but saved and played back as say 30 frames a second right, so if I go to preview it, it will look as it should without any special processing.

 

2. When shooting at a frame rate for a frame rate, say 24 for 24, is it "REAL" 24 frames, or is it through a pulldown or frame blending or something, just want to make sure that if I shoot 24p or 30p, or whatever, I just curious.

 

3. Heard that the 1080 is up-converted, true or not? Also, in terms of quality, what's 1080 look like? And is it 1080p?

 

4. p2. Thoughts on a 4 gig and field use? I'm on a very very very limited budget, and can't afford anything other then at most 1 4 gig p2... Laptop and external reader to a hard drive and/or dvd? 4 gig p2 cards backed up to a 4.7 gb DVD sounds like a easy equation right?

 

I am sure I have more questions, but that's all I can think of right now...

1. If you play it back and you didnt record 24pn, it wont look slow motion. if you do, then on playback it will play back in slow motion.

2.24pn is "true" 24 frames. 24p is 29.97, progressive.

3. the upconverted is true. To tell the truth, unless you have a 50' HD TV and up, you really arent going to notice the quality difference between 720p and 1080i. And the camera does not have 1080p.

4. if i were you, i would pitch that a second P2 card is needed, otherwise you wont be able to shoot while it downloads on the computer. (hot swapping as they call it)

I saw this discussion: "the HVX200 cannot stream 24p Native out of firewire; it can only write 24pN to P2." - indicates it won't work full bandwidth for the 24p unless you are recording to P2

Yeah, i just felt it better to have the option of shooting all formats then being limited out of the over/under crank, which is one of the bigger selling points of the camera in my opinion.

You need to be in 24pn mode because when you shoot in 24p or 30p, its still keeping all the frame information as if shooting 60i, but with 24pN it drops the un wanted frames and shows you playback..

 

The good thing about shooting 24p is that you can speed it up and slow it down in post, because it's saving all that information even though your not using it.. It's still there..

Yeah, but the post slow downs always look like crap. True in camera slow motions looks soo much better in my opinion. No computer regenerator can top that.

I've been shooting stuff for productions with a GL-2 and am about to make the big leap up to a DVX100-B. Do people have opinions about the relative merits of the DVX vs. Canon XL-2?

 

Two other questions:

 

1. People talk about the "flicker" inherent in shooting 24p vs. interlaced video. "Flicker" doesn't sound like a good thing--can someone explain what this looks like and/or point me in the direction of a sample, so I can see what they're talking about?

 

2. I capture my tape from a Sony clamshell into my computer and don't plan on transferring to film for any projects in the near future. Can someone explain to me (in basic terms) what the purposes are for the 24p Advanced vs. 24p Normal setting. I don't really understand what the various pulldown ratios associated with them mean--can someone explain to me what you'd use the different ones for?

 

3. I edit with PPro 1.5, use AE 6.5, and author in U-Lead's DVD Workshop 2--any conflicts or special settings to use in any of these apps for stuff shot with the DVX?

 

Thanks so much-

Ruby

Usually for the DVX vs. XL2 it is just personal preference. As for the flicker, it usually happens when 24p footage is blown up to big screen. Since you said you arent going to do that, 24p is fine. And as for the difference in 24p vs 24pa, that link should be helpful.

Bogens 501 head is pretty nice as far as smoothness goes. I think they are only like 3-400 dollars. I have them mounted on 3036 legs, but I dont really like those legs bc it doesnt have a ball level.

I agree. I have a Bogan as well and couldnt be happier. Although i use it for a little heavier camera than the DVX, but it should work well with it.

..land in the film industry?

 

(If any)

 

Thanks,

Jonathan

Maybe film posters/dvd covers/etc. Anything that deals with graphics really. Or if you know web design as well, building a webpage for the movie pays well.

Hi,

 

I have found that 1550 just barely edges inside what most airlines consider a carryon, so long as it doesn't become too heavy to manhandle into the overhead locker.

 

Phil

I have a pelican 1600 for my HVX. The 1550 sounds about right and as for "airline proof" you wont have to worry about opening it back up to find what looks like a exploded DVX :-D.

You need to be in the 24p or 30p recording mode in order to shoot undercranked or overcranked footage.

 

Make sure you are in 720/24p(n) mode, hit the MENU button, select: "1. Scene File" -> "Frame Rate"

"24 Frame" will be highlighted, then arrow up or down to find the frame rate you want to record and hit the SET button. You should be able to see the slo-mo effect in the camera when you play back.

 

You can also convert footage recorded using the 60P mode into 24p slo-mo in Final Cut Pro with Panasonic's frame rate converter plugin.

Interesting, does it have to be 24pn? I had it in 24p and it didnt do it. I didnt try in 24pn yet. Ill have to try that. Thanks. If anyone has tried it in 24p (not n) mode and still seen slo-mo, let me know, because it was weird...thanks a bunch!

Interesting, does it have to be 24pn? I had it in 24p and it didnt do it. I didnt try in 24pn yet. Ill have to try that. Thanks. If anyone has tried it in 24p (not n) mode and still seen slo-mo, let me know, because it was weird...thanks a bunch!

Actually, i just tried it. You were right, it had to be in 24pn mode. Do you know why it wont play back slo-mo in just 24p mode? Is there something im missing?

Hi, i was shooting film mode with 60 frames a second. I went to view it on my p2 card and it plays it back at normal speed that I shot it. Is that normal? Do i have to view it on my hard drive or something to see it slow motion that I filmed it? Any help would be nice. Thanks.

-Will

I'm about to purchase a HVX200 with a 80 gig firestore drive. I was wondering if anyone had any info on it, because i havent heard much about it except for at a demo in LA. If anyone has used it let me know what you think. Thanks.

So many people read it and dont comment. haha. It's ok i guess, i found something out about the firestore. Apparently it records all formats of the camera EXCEPT 24p/24pn. That made me realize just to get the 2 P2 cards (8 gig) and the P2 store. Apparently it only records 1080i mode or i guess 480i. Sucks, it would of been a lot of help with all that space. Oh well. P2 is more reliable than a harddrive anyways.

hi all

am planning to use a helium balloon lighting set up for a night exterior scene. would like to know how far can it be used.....what would be the approx distance at which i could use...and what reading will i get for the soft light ambience. cant i emulate the same effect with two 4k arri par shoot through chimera or bounce of white satin cloth of 12*12ft size from a good height. i would use 5218.anamorphic cineovision or hawk lens.

thanks

rajavel

Depends on what you are shooting on, as for distance, it also matters what type of look you are going for. Ive seen a helium balloon setup, and they are pretty brights. I guess also matters what size balloon you got.

I'm about to purchase a HVX200 with a 80 gig firestore drive. I was wondering if anyone had any info on it, because i havent heard much about it except for at a demo in LA. If anyone has used it let me know what you think. Thanks.

Can you put any type of fluorescent bulb in kino flos? I was shooting something inside a hospital and needed to match the light from the overheads. Unfortunately the tubes these fixtures take are four feet but much skinnier than kino tubes. Can you still use them? They don't clip in nicely but who cares?

Probably not your best bet, but you should of switched out the fluorescents at the hospital with the kino flo. I know that the kino's fit in those fixtures, but as of the other way around....never tried.

Recently, last weekend in fact, I shot side by side 35mm and HVX200 both indoor and outdoor and fuji vs kodak stocks for the 35mm. While the HVX is good, it's just not good enough. By that I mean primarily the wide depth of field. And yes, I understand that a 1/3 inch CCD is much less that a 1.5 inch wide piece of film, but I was hoping for so much more...or at least a little bit. The 4:2:2 color space is very nice, and it's very cool using P2 cards for a quick transfer, but...

 

I had been hoping to do a hybrid shoot, or maybe just use the DVX for pickups here and there to speed things along. From the results, I doubt that is even gonna be viable.

 

Anyone else feel the disappointment?

The truth still stands that the HVX200 isnt the best HD cam out there. But for price, i'd buy it. As for compairing HD to film, the recently shot "slient hill" was shot not only with 35mm but HD as well. I cant tell the difference, not even with DOF. So i guess HD is climbing the ladder faster than most people thought. (they used the cinealta for the HD footage)

Hello

 

My name is Zamir Merali and I am very new to this website and filmmaking in general. For the past while I have been experimenting with making some short movies with my consumer canon zr70 and I have finally decided to get a nice camera. I want this camera for making narrative movies and maybe a bit of documentary later on. I want a camera that emulates the "film look" very well. I understand that 24p doesn't look completely like film and if I actually want a film look then I should shoot in film, but film is currently out of my budget. I have narrowed the cameras I could get into either the xl2 or the dvx100b. They both have very good image control and user customizability. I am having a real hard time deciding which one to get. Price between the two does not matter but features and your opinion do. I have read lots of articles on the Internet addressing this issue but they all seem biased towards one camera. Could you please help me in deciding because this is a pretty important purchase for me and I would like to be completely satisfied with the camera I get. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thank you.

Ive always shot mostly with the DVX, so I would say get that one. If you can afford it even, get the HVX, but yeah. I think you would be satified using either camera, but I like the feel and look of the DVX over the acute angle of the XL2. But that's just my opinion.

Heard a nasty rumor that the HVX miniDV tape footage isn't as good as the 100A. It seems unlikely but thought I'd see if anyone has been using the old fashioned tape drive and what the results were. Also, how much heavier is this camera than the 100B? Thanks!

The quality of the HVX200 for MiniDV is better than anything the dvx can produce simply because of the better 3ccd chip and lens. As for how heavy the camera is, it roughly weighs about 5 pounds.

I havent heard...anything really about this camera, but on a job listing website, they want a DP who knows this camera. Any tips on it would be appreciated. Ive just heard nothing. Thanks.

I guess it all depends on the DP as well on how the outcome will be. As for the sky you are correct, but since he says he is shooting out in a field I doubt there will be any practicals so they arent a problem. Underexposing for day-for-night is tricky especially if shot on film, you have the risk of losing data that otherwise can be dimmed by telecine or editing software. but, once again i agree, use ND grad filter when shooting the sky and avoid the sun in the shot if possible for sake of having too bright of a main source.

In digital you can shoot day for night. There are certain filters for doing so and even final cut has a inexpensive version of a day for night "filter" it can generate. The trick that I have heard is to silk the actor so that no hard shadows show on the ground and to get rid of ALL hot spots however possible. I havent tried this with the XL-1 but im sure that there will be some sucess. Also try white balancing for a more blue tone to help with the effect. Hope the shoot goes well!

You are mistaken.

i doubt so. My friend owns both the 100a and 100b. The 100b was released specifically for the 24p setting, which is why he bought the 100b.

I could be wrong, but im about 90 % sure about that

Besides USC & UCLA, the Art Center College of Design in Pasadena, AFI, Chapman also have cinematography courses.

 

A lot of cinematography can be self-taught, but assuming you do that, what you also need are (1) the opportunity to shoot a lot; (2) the opportunity to meet students who may want to hire you after they graduate. So I'd go where ever you'll get a chance to shoot, and where the graduates have a decent chance of ending up somewhere in the industry. The second tend to suggest a LA-based program just because of the physical closeness to the film industry.

I also go to Brooks, and find it to be one of the more technical schools out there. There are about 3-4 cinematographer teachers at the school, and each very different from the next. I hear that Chapman has a good DOP by the name of Bill Dill, who i see is listed as being in ASC, so he cant be all that bad. As for the "advisors", I think by now, they dont call as much, and from talking to one recently, they dont really want you to go to brooks if you arent 1. serious about being a film maker or 2. If it isnt the place you should go. If you have connections somewhere else, aka out of state, you would probably have a better chance going there and being a student. The Art Institute is another good Cinematography school. Shop around and find out that suites you.