jan von krogh

& how will these mounts eliminate breathing ang focus shifts in a zoom lens?

probably by adjusting FL to compensate.

& be usable on a different camera?

Should be - as long as you give them power.

But i think its wiser to ask Birger himself (once hes returned from holidays) - as we have to speculate and hes the one who knows.

I believe there are more than 2000 Arri cameras around worldwide.

i thought it would be more - however i was speaking of sales now.

I did find your original post a bit ambiguous, hence my response to it. At least we agree that there are visible beneficts to 4K as opposed to 2K.

Yes.

And my comment that we typically don´t get 2k resolution at the end of the distribution chain was indeed made to underline that the Viper (or any 2k camera or process) will not show a dramatic falloff in typical exhibition scenarios.

Might be different if we still would have plenty of 65mm large screens around, might be different if the digital cinema rollout would be mainly 4k.

And, FWIW, 4K is also a considerable advantage, be it film or digital for anamorphic work or, as simple as that, to get out the boom without scaling the image when working with a 2k target.

I think it is wise not to base our judgement on numbers released by the manufacturers, but rather on an idenpendently done comparison test.

Yes.

I am -seriously- considering renting out a red before we get delivery of ours, simply in order to qualify speed, quality and issues of the camera.

I took us over half a year to get the hdcam and 1080p uncompressed workflows up to maximum quality back then in 2002 - and we already had a solid 2k workflow existing.

There will be pitfalls, there will be issues, there will be tons of things to master.

And it will take years of up-hill fighting to get the cinemas into 4k digital or 65mm exhibition.

Hello Mark,

first of all i would recommend to try to learn the "quote" feature of this board.

It helps people who actually are trying to read your post and it isn´t hard to master.

Sonys progressive HDCAM Cameras (750/900/F23), Pananvisions Genesis and the mentioned Thompson GV Viper all record 1920*1080, or approx 2 million pixels per frame.

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They are proven video cameras with a proven track record

Correct. And be it David Fincher, Robert Altman, the Wachowski Bros, Michael Mann, Mel Gibson, Bryan Singer etc they have produced many excellent movies.

Red records up to 4520*2540, approx 10 millions pixel per frame.

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Again it contains pixels drawn out of thin air lucky then your following statement applies to make your first have any credibility

Resolution? Or missing pixels replaced?

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Resolution. Any mid-class photographer should be able to explain you how CMOS Bayer-design works.

Having said that - it is important to remember that the 35mm projection in the cinema won´t be able to resolve the higher resolution. Today 35mm cinema projection resolves slightly below 2k.

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Sorry thats rubbish. You can commission or draw on any tests you want. I know what I see. I watched a 2k transfer the other day on a calibrated projector and big screen and in no way does that match a 35mm film. Perhaps our cinemas are higher quality? Not to mention your tests show a cinema projector brings it down much further than even 2K

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I am not sure to what you refer to with "your cinemas".

Test have been conducted in the USA, EU and Asia.

ITU-R tested several of the best cinemas on different continents combined.

Read this:

http://www.cst.fr/IMG/pdf/35mm_resolution_english.pdf

Independent from country, Arri or Panavision gear - in the typical distribution chain, the 35mm film process doesn´t resolve 2k at the end on the screen.

Exactly the red is still not a filmmakers dream answer by the time you pay out for everything else you could have paid less for a 16mm set up and got a real film look with better contrast and a gorgeous picture.

We left 16mm (and S16mm) years ago. We wanted better images. The remaining 16 and S16mm lenses will be put to new use on the Red.

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As it can record to flashmemory and ssd, many shots which have problematic influences (vibrations etc) influencing tape or film or disc transport are now easier.

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Yeah long upload times difficulty in editing expensive programs and kit

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If you are in a hurry: Attach drive (or SSD). Edit.

If you are more the guy who likes security: backup first, then edit from the disc. directly.

If you prefer to digitize from a hdcam vtr in the field or wnat to have a portable lab at the set, ok.

Furthermore, if you already think that FCP/Apple or PPro/Windows are expensive, then Red is clearly to expensive for you.

While there is no doubt a pplace for the red and in films shown at the cinema or a way to create a look its really never going to replace film or even be an option to film.

Even before delivery, academy award winning directors disagree. You did notice what productions are actually shooting on red already now i suppose?

For us film is becoming a rare exception. To compare, in 1999, i think that > 75% of all the stuff we did was film - and the rest was broadcast or animation.

Give me a red that you can load film into and you might compete in the film arena

In case you didn´t notice:

With over 2000 order in their books, red has become the marketleader in the 35mm camera manufacturer segment.

I thought you could bring it into FCP... but according to a friend (A Red Head)... still trying to find the email.. but he says no you still can't bring Redcode into FCP... that was a beta program shown at NAB....

That is correct. Peter Jackson used the beta for Crossing the line, but redcode isn´t in the Quicktime library yet.

Apple demonstrated the integration on their US-Roadshow.

btw : Assimilate Scratch can conform 4k redcode already now.

So then what equipment are these big guys who are shooting with the camera doing their post... downconverts in Avid... what format are they saving to...

PJ shot in Redcode, edited Redcode with FCP and onlined on Quantel Pablo on cineon/dpx. the redcode to cineon/dpx was done in redcine, according to the FCP EDL.

IIRC, they edited "Crossing" on a Notebook.

We will use different workflows. I am still not decided which additional 4k D.I. System to buy. DVS, Assimilate and Iridias all are interesting, none however fullfills all our needs as of yet.

Maybe we will move the decision to Q1/2008.

Well, sort of. The Viper has 1920 photosites across the chips, and 4320 photosites top to bottom. Most important, those photosites aren't square. They're four times wider than they are high. It doesn't gain any resolution at all from that. Instead, the reason for it is to support both aspect ratios in the neighborhood of 1.78 - 1.85:1 and 2.37 - 2.39:1. It has two modes. It either groups the subpixels in groups of four, creating 1920 x 1080, 1.78:1, with square pixels, or in groups of three, discarding part of the image area and squareness, to get 2.37:1 with the same 1920 x 1080 pixel grid.

There is no way to address the subpixels individually. Even if there were, there would be no advantage to it. Images with a resolution mismatch of up to 2:1 appear to have the lower of the two resolutions. Beyond that, even the untrained observer begins to notice that the tops and bottoms of things are either softer or sharper than the sides.

-- J.S.

yes, that is exactly how it works.

When we asked GV why they didn´t start with a sensor with the full resolution instead (i think it was in 2005), we were told that they were lacking recording & processing power - so even if they the elements would all get a readout, they would have no way to process & store them.

Btw - i wouldn´t be surprised if Thomson GV enters the 4k market space soon. They have excellent technology, clever engineers and do understand the market quite well. Right now the shadow of the infinities delayed introduction is hiding this.

Yes shadows on face from a 12/18k hmi .

if you have crossing the line - as example look at tc 01:54 - tridecker passes behind doubledecker.

there you have all - faces, sky, clouds, landscape. and clearly no hmi on the doubledecker - no shadowcast.

furthermore the helishots, iirc where done without aerial light and the two camera where prototypes with ~2 stops less iirc.

anyhow - i am all in for as many test as possible, and you can shoot excellent films on D20/viper/sony hdcam/s:i.

however having seen the red footage in 4k, i am convinced.

> Modern debayering.... extracts a good 75-90% of the cmos array resolution.

 

...you are suggesting yourself as a future candidate for this treatment. You appeal to authority; you cite unreliable sources. Please stop.

 

Phil

Phil, some more unreliable sources.

Arri.

Hasselblad.

Leica.

They are as wrong as i am, i suppose.

Just to remind you - the Arri D20 uses a 3018 x 2200, 4:3, 6.6 MP Sensor.

And outputs 2880 x 2160 in datamode. And HD.

In your wrong mathematic - the D20 therefore wouldn´t even be a 1920*1080p camera, correct?

You really should call arri, hasselblad, dalsa, red, leica and share your knowledge.

Their expertise regarding digital interpolator quality, in that special case debayering, is according to your findings, simply fraud.

I don't understand how you can go on repeating this nonsensical argument.

Max,

our classic 35mm exhibition doesn´t give us 2k.

Under ideal cirumstances, the test have been run over and over again.

With Arii & Panavision cameras and lenses, with different projectors and screens, all over the world.

Led and realised by highly respected filmmakers from many different nations.

Many of those tests are published. Below you will find the link to ITU-R tests.

http://www.cst.fr/IMG/pdf/35mm_resolution_english.pdf

Although there is a resolution drop during 35mm film projection, suggesting that there won't be any difference between a print made from 2K and one made from a 4K master is just plain wrong and uninformed.

Read carefully, thats not what i said.

I said that the 35mm cinema typically doesn´t resolve 2k.

I didn´t suggest that there are no differences between a 2k and 4k originating master.

I pointed out however, that one of the main advantages of the red vs. the 1080 digital cinematography cameras, its higher resolution, will not be transported in its full effect to the audience in a classic 35mm chain.

It is always better to start with a higher resolution and keep it as long as possible throughout the post-production chain.

That is correct, and i didn´t say anything else.

On the same projector a 4K DI will look much better than a 2K DI.

That is mostly so, but not always the case.

I have seen some of our films in 35mm and was happy with the filmprojection, later on i saw them on a 4k DCI projector and noise that was masked in the grain of the 35mm out was slightly visible.

As for the Red giving a 'better' image than the Viper, there is more to an image than just resolution. Namely highlight latitude, noise floor, color reproduction are other factors that are just as important.

Correct.

noise floor: Viper according to Thomson is at -54db, The One according to red at -66db, both at their ISO rating sweetspot btw.

highlight latitude: Have you seen Peter Jacksons "Crossing the line"? Especially the aerial shot against the sky, with cloud details and shadows on the actor faces?

color reproduction: http://www.reduser.net/forum/uploaded/9_1184475391.jpg. Finetuning color , however, is becoming more and more an creative postproduction process, no matter what media or camera has been used.

The Viper has three separate 2 megapixel CCD sensors, with Red, Green and Blue colour separation achieved by a precision dichroic prism assembly.

So it produces 2 milllion each of actual Red, Green and Blue pixels.

You are wrong.

The Viper has 3 * 9.2 megapixel sensors.

The electronics inside the camera bring that down to 1920*1080.

They have, as remmarked by GV, not enough computing power inside of the Viper to handle more.

The RED uses a single 12 megapixel CMOS sensor with the colour separation achieved by screen printing a microscopic matrix of red, green and blue filters directly onto the individual photocells, which is the same way it is done with most home video cameras and digital still cameras. Because of the alternating pattern of the filter matrix, the raw signal from the RED only contains about 2 million Green samples, and about one million each of Red and Blue.

You are wrong and obviously don´t understand how debayering works.

Modern debayering, named by the way after Mr. Bayer who researched this method for Kodak, easily extracts a good 75-90% of the cmos array resolution.

Contact a local Leica, Canon, Nikon, Arri, Panavision or Hasselblad representative. He will gladly explain you how this works en detail.

And just try basic mathematics. As you write yourself, the camera has a 12 MP. You write 2 MP Green, 1 MP Red and 1 MP Blue. That makes 4 MP.

While there is little argument about the RED's potential performance as a 2K 4:2:2 HD TV camera, there is considerable skepticism about whether the REDCODE output really constitutes a true "4K" signal. Similar claims have been made before, and none have held up to close scrutiny.

Sadly, wrong once more.

Be it Dalsa, the pioneers for moving 4k or bei it Hasselblad - 4k basing on Cmos is reality since years.

NHK already demonstrated (working) 8K digital cameras last year at IBC and at NAB - together with projection in that resolution.

Scanning this and certain other forums, you would be forgiven for getting the impression that direct comparisons have been made between the RED and other electronic cameras; in reality, the amount of RED-derived footage that anybody has actually seen is very small, and none of it has been produced by entirely independent operators. The first deliveries of privately-owned REDs are supposed to take place at the end of this month, although I'll believe that when I see it. Only then will any independent testing take place,

Thousands of people around the world have seen red footage projected in 4k within the last 12 months.

Red is right now, as we speak, in use at multi-million productions. Heres a quote from "wanted" starring Angelina Joline and Morgan Freeman. They shot around the corner in Prague and now moved on to Chicago.

"We are actually inter-cutting the digital images with film. It?s not enough to say it is the best digital image out there. The RED image looks remarkably better than the filmed images. I thought I would never be able to say that?

- Jon Farhat

So for the moment, the answer is, "We don't know". Anybody who claims otherwise either works for RED, or is guessing or hallucinating :rolleyes:

You might want to include Peter Jackson, Timur Bekmambetov, Steven Soderbergh, David Stump, Mark Neveldine, Brian Taylorin, Rodney Charters in your list of people who work for RED, or is guessing or hallucinating.

I'm confused...

Does the RED camera promise "better" image quality than the VIPER?

Yes, it does indeed.

The recorded resolution is more than 4 times higher than on the traditional digital cinematography systems or the common 35mm film 2K D.I. process.

Sonys progressive HDCAM Cameras (750/900/F23), Pananvisions Genesis and the mentioned Thompson GV Viper all record 1920*1080, or approx 2 million pixels per frame.

Red records up to 4520*2540, approx 10 millions pixel per frame.

Having said that - it is important to remember that the 35mm projection in the cinema won´t be able to resolve the higher resolution. Today 35mm cinema projection resolves slightly below 2k.

Another factor is the DOF, which is different between the digital cinematography cameras you can buy (they all offer 2/3, which is ~<16mm) and the 35mm DOF, whereas the Red has a S35 mm sized sensor.

The Depth of Field is another typical attribute of image composition which affects the audience and which is part of the film look.

If not, then is all the hoopla surrounding RED mostly because of it's price point?

The price point is indeed interesting, however, the price of the red can be misleading.

The camera body is traditionally only ~30-60% of the net worth of a camera package.

Lenses, supportsystems, recording, monitoring, transport/cases, mattebox, powersupply, batteries, chargers, tripods etc are the other part of the camera package.

Anyhow, red offers many features which artists and producers alike wanted, which were, until now, not available in one camera.

Overcranking (shooting at higher speeds) was difficult with or impossible with the classic sony/thomson/panavision cameras. red records up to 100fps.

For handheld and steadycam, many cameras where hard to operate - as they were heavy and bulky. red is small and pretty lightweight.

Then, the camera feature a PL-Mount. This allow the use of the huge inventory of cinelenses.

As it can record to flashmemory and ssd, many shots which have problematic influences (vibrations etc) influencing tape or film or disc transport are now easier.

Also, the camera records RAW Data - which allows colorists, DP and VFX folks to extract the best part of the recorded image, whereas Panavision and Sony fallten the Sensor data down to RGB or YUV.

Another aspect is that they have an fast and high-quality workflow model for 4k. The red writes Quicktimefiles which can be easily accessed from almost any NLE.

For Sony and Panaviision, you need to buy/rent an hdcam or hdcam sr vtr, which is easily in the 50-100.000$ pricerange, and find an xpri nle to edit native or you have to upsample to uncompressed.

Thomson GV has no native editing, and you have to be tethered or use the (pretty expensive as well) venom discrecorder.

The dps, director, vfx-experts who used or are using the red so far were pretty excited or at least gave it double thumbs up.

Among them are Steven Soderberg, David Stump, Mark Neveldine, Brian Taylor, Peter Jackson, Rodney Charters, Jon Farhat...

I've thought about using Nikon zooms for cinema. In earlier threads people warned me they breath on focus. As well, they shift focus through the zoom range.

There are emerging solutions to these problems.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=3101

I guess I should have noted that it is CCD and CMOC chip cameras that cannot be adjusted for this, as the sensored are permanently glued directly to the prism block assembly. I should have put the timeline more like 25-30 years to account for the early Betacams and such.

 

I remember the days of pointing the studio cameras at a target and waiting 20 minutes for them to warm up so we could begin to align them. Then we'd do it again. And again.

If you want to use Canon EF, Sigma SA, FourThirds and Nikon F Lenses on a PL-Mount,

you don´t have to wait for Arri or Panavision to re-brand & house them.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=3101

also supports cooke i-transfer.

Hi Jan,

 

Zakaree from the Red team would seem to be confident that the first cameras will ship August 31st.

 

http://www.cinematography.com/forum2004/in...st&p=188997

 

Stephen

... they are professionals, however i have met directors who where 100% confident to have the master by tomorrow .... :)

Hi Nick,

finally found some time to look at your reel.

I did like it - Good images, and the quality is pretty for an webstream.

With that level of jobs, let me underline this, it is really worth to have a look at the red camera if you are thinking about a F23.

However, if you need to buy now, then you could have a problem if you decide for the red camera: they are sold out until early 2008.

Other options in the market you should look at are:

Silicon Imaging 2K.

Thomson Grass Valley Viper.

With cameras scheduled for delivery in under 2 weeks, it's clear that Jim is delivering a real and useful product.

 

Stephen

Hi Stephen,

however i wouldn´t be surprised if they will more time.

their roll-out plan -really- is ambitious, and things -can- go wrong.

anyhow, in my humble opinion, the red seems to me the most single new important camera since i begun working in our industry.

we will be at all presentations at IBC and i suppose we will be easy to spot in our t-shirts - you will know why if you see us.

Speaking of searching.

 

I did a search on Kemps looking for camera rental houses in Berlin Germany?

 

FGV Schmiddle Gmbh

Arri Rental

25p Cine Support GmbH

Berliner Union-Film GmbH & Co Studio KG

Idroscalo Digitale

Fuji Kine Film Vertriebs GmbH

Inflite Dream Catching Productions

Kameraverleih Berlin

Media Total,

 

I only found one HD camera rental house in Germany? only in Hamburg? but I kinda of find that hard to believe?

 

Or is it Mental Images... seems more like a software company that makes a program to help with the rendering of CGI...

 

I'm messing around with you Jan.. or kidding you.. : )

 

But go ahead and post the link...

not bad, but you have missed some of the most important ones.

cinerent

cineservices

cineplus

ludwig

fxfactory

and us :)

in berlin its easily ~20 hdcam-cameras on a normal days, and countless hdv/p2/xdcams etc.

right now its much more, as babelsberg is running an hdcam production (wachowski bros speedracer)

btw - we are mostly -not- unsing our website for rental.

just google for "hdcam mieten".

erento.com is our e-commerce solution.

as we are pretty overbooked anyhow, we don´t rely on the web to generate new business most of the time.

we rent out in >80% to people we know personally.

Hi Jan,

 

You're very welcome to post a link, you might want to add a link by way of a signature.

 

Stephen

Good.

Then i suppose for this forum i will sign with redrental - even when that site isn´t finished.

Here we are, two weeks away from the first delivery deadline, and there's hardly a peep from RED.com about how this is going.

9 days to be precise, and Steven Soderbergh and Timur Bekmambetovs are already shooting on the pre-series reds.

Meanwhile the LART tests have been mysteriously postponed for no adequately explained reason. (Yes they gave a reason, I don't think it's adequate:-)

You might ask Mr. David Mullen about details, as he is part or the LART-tests.

I mean for f*ck's sake; you'd think Jannard would spring for a bit of food after all the slobbering support those pathetic prats have given him!

If you suffer from tourette syndrome, then pardon me asking, but have you ever considered Anger Management?

Meanwhile, discussion of the subject of delivery seems to have mysteriously evaporated on reduser.net.

I am not certain if you have difficulties reading, however, there are 5 threads regarding delivery, payment etc on the first page alone.

With or without respect (I'm not sure)

Carl

I would say that you obviously try to express no respect.

I'd say he's German or Dutch... or he actually works in Orange County, California... if I was just playing around...

This question as been asked several times and it always goes unanswered... where does he work? What company?

As posted in this forum several time before - Berlin, Germany.

I would recommend you to learn how to use the search function in this forum.

Furtermore, i neither work for Sony (which is the core of our business), discreet (which is a good chunk of our D.I. workflow), Angenieux (which is the preferred lens manufacturer for us) nor Red. I have been working as freelance trainer for Sony in 2002-2005 (for cinealta) and before that for discreet logic 1998-2001, always besides the core business in my company. We will certainly offer training for red, btw.

He?s been asked for links to his company. Unless he's sent private messages he?s never responded to any of these questions.

Correct.

If the mods allow, i will post links to our corresponding websites - if that is not advertisement.

Until then, if you are interested in renting or production you will have to send me an email.

We will be at IBC this year with 4 or 5 people.

Is anyone familar with the new RED Digital Cinema camera? It's called the RED ONE, apprently it will takes filming to the next level. Just looking for feedback before I fork out the cash.

Hi Mark,

we have ordered reds. I have seen the footage in 4k, its excellent.

The people who shoot with it so far are all pretty enthousiastic.

If you are in the EU i would recommend to visit ibc (ibc.org).

Red will present the Peter Jackson shortfilm shot with the camera in 4k at the IBC DCinema, which has an excellent quality, so you can judge for yourself.

Also, you can talk with the folks of red and get a first hand impression of the camera and the lenses.

If you have more, maybe more precise questions, don´t hesitate to ask.

A good starting point for the basics is the FAQ by Brook Willard.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=1487

I'm finally to the point where my company is getting ready to leap into high end HD, and will soon have the money to back a purchase of one of the bigger HD cameras. I'm looking at the Sony F23 right now, but can't find any dealers or prices! I'm guessing the cam is in the $200,000 range with the Recording drive attached.

Hi Nick,

i would recommend to have a look at the camera from red before investing $200K in the F23.

I aquired our HDCAM camera four~five years ago, was also priced over 200k with all the extras and it was an excellent decision back then.

We bought from Sony, directly.

However in 2006, we decided against upgrading our 750 to F23 (or viper or an future digital arri who one could buy) and went to red.

The camera has simply to many advantages to ignore, even for an traditional 35mm & cinealta/hdcam house as us.

100P framerate, S35 sensor, 4K resolution, light&compact, ArriPL lensmount, RAW image data, 10/12 bit colordepth, 500ASA in Progressive - the F23 has none of those creative features and technologies.

Furthermore, the red has a price in the ballpark of 20-30k$.

I was at a presentation a while ago where they mentioned they kept the ASA rating the same for the F23 but the redesigned CCD gives it a better signal to noise ratio. I didn't do any real tests with the F23 but I could definately tell that it was less noisey than the f900.

Hi,

same here, when i asked about the rating of the F23 in 2006, i was told approx. the same as 900/750.

F900/750, who share the same optical block were described to us as 600/300 in i/p when we bought the 750.

Our experiences so far indicate that these figures are realistic.

However, with the slowshutter option on the 900R and 750/790 (not on the discontinued classic 900), you can reach >20000 asa without gain or noise.

Its no problem to push 16 stops that way - however, at a very slow framerate then.

Right now, the few existing Red Cameras are used to shoot Steven Soderberghs Guerillia (Franka Potente, Benicio Del Toro) and Timur Bekmambetovs Wanted (James McAvoy, Angelina Jolie, Morgan Freeman, Thomas Kretschmann).

Red aims to deliver the first 50 serial units this month.

For 2007 they plan to deliver ~1200 units, which is approximatly half of their orderbook (pre-ibc, pre-delivery).

According to Mr. Jannard, the camera production schedule:

Serial numbers 1-50 August 30th (50 units)

Serial numbers 51-100 September 15th (50 units)

Serial numbers 101-300 October 10th (200 units)

Serial numbers 301- 700 November 10th (400 units)

Serial numbers 701- 1200 December 10th (500 units)

Serial numbers 1201- 1700 January 10th (500 units)

Serial numbers 1701- 2200 February 10th (500 units)

Serial numbers 2201- 2700 March 10th (500 units)

Serial numbers 2701- 3400 April 10th (700 units)

Serial numbers 3401- 4100 May 10th (700 units)

However, one shouldn´t be surprised if that schedule slips a few weeks or even months.

Mass production can reveal manufacturing issues which could slow down delivery.

In the USA, Gibby has very early reds, i think #8.

In the EU, Ludwig in Munich has the first 5 (out of 10 iirc) coming in the ~90-130 batch (iirc as well).

Be aware that

a - not -all- features will be in the first shipping cameras software and they will be upgraded in field. so, if you plan to shoot overcranked 100p or used the 4 channel audio - ask if they are already available in your shooting schedule.

b - It is fully possible that red rental fees now, will not be as inexpensive as they probably will be in long run. If you want to get pricing and delivery dates, i would go to the user site reduser.net, where most of the reservation holders are reading on a daily/weekly basis.

We have 3 coming - but a little bit to late for your schedule.

Now that is factually incorrect.

A quick look at Jannards profile will show you that he posted here as recently as July15.

ok, then lets settle to "are meanwhile almost ignoring" this forum.

I think Jannard alone posted 3 times today on that other website.

And if you've been around here long enough, you'd remember that he 'quit' the forum several times, only to resurface to address questions or comments made.

He may not be a highly active member of this forum, but I can assure you that he (and probably others of his team) are keeping an eye on this forum. Maybe not as much now that the pre-release pressures are building.. but he definitely had an eye on this place during the development stages. You may not like its overall tone, but you can't deny that as a collection of real-world, practicing industry professionals, it is a very important source of feedback.

That is exactly the reason why i am pondering why many posters here move the tone and bias of this particular subforum, as in this thread, to a somewhat unprofessional level.

btw: are you living on fiji? i would be jealous then - have lived a good amount of time in french polynesia and love the whole pacific region.