Jayden Woodards

You can get really fancy too

 

http://www.robsrainhats.com

Hahaha, that's actually pretty smart. What's the average cost you think?

It's called 'Hog Mesh', here in Australia. You can source through John Barry.

Aye, thanks for this one. I was under the impression it was called something different here. Nonetheless, that is hella expensive and above my budget.

 

I find the above a little alarming that there has been no discussion thus far of ground fault protection in the rain. GFCIs are a must when working in rain in order to avoid someone taking a potentially lethal shock. When using large HMIs you will need to use film style GFCIs (Shock Blocks, Shock Stops, or Bender Lifeguards) that are specifically designed to accommodate the residual currents that HMIs shunt to ground that will cause standard GFCIs to nuisance trip. To prevent nuisance tripping film style GFCIs sense on an "Inverse Time Curve" and incorporate harmonic filters with a frequency response up to 120 hz. 3rd harmonics are attenuated by 50%, and by 500 Hz are down to 20%. Attenuated by the filter, the harmonics that HMI ballasts shunt to ground pose less of a problem.

 

Our Shock Stop GFCI with either our 60, 84, or 100A Transformer/Distro is

the only way to bring Honda EU6500s or EU7000s

into OSHA compliance for use on work sites.

 

For more detailed information on how to use film style GFCIs to provide tiered ground fault protection on wet locations, use this link for a series of articles I wrote for Protocol magazine.

 

Guy Holt, Gaffer, ScreenLight & Grip, Lightng & Grip Rental in Boston

I did have a similar setup to this going. I found it easier to use what I had on hand which was a bunch of milk crates to elevate GFCI's and all connecting points of cords and covered them from the rain with other means. Only things hitting the ground were the cables that were insulated ( not damaged? right terminology for cable rubber not being torn or such?).

In Australia for a handful of reasons we tend to go a bit overboard when wet weather hits.

 

- Heads are covered with either Hogsmesh, or an umbrella.

 

-Ballasts are elevated and ideally placed out of the weather, or covered with an umbrella, or hogsmesh.

 

-Distribution boards are elevated and at least tarped.

 

-Electrical connections are elevated. If not a weather proof type they are also covered/taped.

 

The power on nearly every film set in Australia is RCD (GFCI) protected. Our power distribution equipment has RCDs or ELCBs built in as standard. Our safety code also stipulates the use of plug in type RCDs if in a building without RCD protection (this is getting rarer since safety switches became mandatory in all new builds and electrical upgrades).

 

You can buy Hogsmesh from Barbizon and John Barry Sales in sydney. Most gaffers and rental houses generally will gladly send out some wet weather gear like Hogsmesh with the hire if you ask.

Thank you so much for this one, was pretty in the dark when it comes to the different practices or terminology between US and AU.

Do you practice putting umbrellas above heads? I bought a few but we've been stuck in that terrible rain in Sydney and wasn't completely sure it would do the job if the rain starts going horizontal again.

The ballasts, RCDs and cable connectors were all raised above ground with milk crates. Connecting points were raised, gaffed and had a shotty thrown on them to keep them dry.

Hogsmesh turned out to be hella expensive for what I can only assume isn't a whole lot. Do you have any insight on how much Hogmesh you'd put on a single light and how to place it?

I ran my cables through RCD's placed all on their own circuits, outside with milk crates elevating connection points (taped and shottied on top), with a marquee above lights. Was what we had on hand and I always ensured that there was enough headroom for heat to not become an issue under there. Ballasts and RCD's were raised above ground on another milk crate under the marquee.

In Sydney; I honestly wouldn't know. Here In La we just put it on the rental and or expendables order. Most expendables shops, catering to film, should have it, but I haven't a clue where to look in Sydney for it.

What about a place in LA, just so I can use it as a reference for the places in Aus. May be called something different.

Cello is your best friend in rain. Also, I personally like swamp boxes/wood under most connections. Keep Ballasts dry, and honestly, when it's raining, bring those LEDs inside.

Do you have a link as to where I can buy Cello Wrap? Googling around doesn't really show much apart from some way off topic things.

I used milk crates to keep connectors off the ground and taped them up with gaff with a shotbag on top of them to keep it dry.

I asked from some gaffers about this some years ago and the advice was to keep the lights running, don't switch them off, The heat burns off the water, I don't know if this works in a tropical downpour,but it works in UK rain. You need outdoor connectors as used by the construction industry etc, your local regulations will provide the details.

I did see that posted on THIS POST too.

Wasn't too keen on having rental lights out in the rain and then if something were to happen to have to explain ' yeah, I just put it out in the rain'. I did, however I did decide to test a 1k Fresnel in the rain after letting it run for a couple minutes, and it was hot enough to not change or show any wear.

I saw that water could shatter the glass of a fresnel if its hot enough and water hits it?

Hey there,

Just finished a shoot that was primarily creating a consistent daylight by using HMI's through windows of a building and found that rain is one hell of a pain to deal with.

I'm curious as to how you deal with water and lights outside and any methods of keeping dry outside in these situations.

Personally, I called in some favors and ran Marquees on top them and bunched them up in pairs.

You would have double Full CTOs on the HMIs and at that point, you can just use tungsten, as everyone else here pointed out. What f stop and ISO do you plan on shooting at for the wide shot? Do you only have access to house power or will you have a generator on hand? If its just house power, how many circuits do you have on hand that you can draw from? With 2Ks, you are at one lamp per circuit, so keep that in mind when talking with the locations contact, especially since your store looks way bigger than Bruces house. BTW what I love about his shot is the fact, that you can see fire in the windows downstairs a bit, which interestingly enough doesnt happen in your REAL reference Jayden, but to me makes it a lot more convincing. Would probably be a question of how big the glass front of the store can be and how convincingly it could be lit from inside, otherwise I would just reside to backlighting the smoke on the roof.

 

Also: Im guessing there will be other shots in front of the store, in the parking lot? If so, might I suggest this reference from Jarhead for that:

That movie has tons of great night fire scenes, with lots of great silhouettes.

Hey hey,

Thank you so much for the reply. I definitely left out some information here.

So we do NOT have a location as of yet, but the stores we're looking at thus far are running on a pretty standard setup for power for most stores in Australia. I expect that there will be multiple 20A circuits leaving us with 4800w per circuit.

Generators are a possibility and will most likely be a strong consideration come testing and upon finding a location if we do need the extra power.

My concern in regards to the front of the store is the glass as well. We're pretty limited with budget and gear and the front glass of location is something I don't know as of yet to get a clearer reference.

Backlighting the roof smoke was a consideration but I'm still looking at ways to convincingly spread the light enough to avoid light beams and also create that strong gradient in the orange and yellows.

Have you got any tips for the front glass of a shop front in terms of creating a convincing looking fire?

I wouldn't use a daylight-balanced HMI to create orange firelight. Use tungsten or Skypanels.

You're right. Adrian also mentioned not using HMI's. My impression was that the stronger power drawing less power would make for more room on a circuit(s). I don't have huge amounts of experience with HMI's either so I'm giving a pretty unexperienced suggestion for myself.

This frame has digitally added fire above the house. I think it would help quite a bit.

This seems like the easier option but also depends on the type of post-production budget we have. I haven't spoken to any of our editors about their own skill level with such things.

I wouldn't do HMIs; I'd do a lot of tungsten heads all on flicker boxes-- or quite a lot of skypanels, on fire FX.

HMI's were just an option for some of those higher more brighter parts of the 'flames'. Pretty sure skypanels to rent are a bit above our budget if we need multiple. I have access to quite a few 1K and 2K tungstens. CTO's on a HMI would work for the color, surely...?

Have any practical suggestions for how else I could manage this?

Hey there,

I'm gaffer for a short film coming up and the director has made me aware we don't have an SFX team to direct a large store fire.

They want one wide shot of a countryside store being set up on fire and burning.

Here's my current idea:

Pump several smoke machines inside the building to make visible windows and openings smokey, and then (somehow) find a way to create an upwards smoke stream into the sky, whether we have roof access or not hopefully large fans and smoke will be enough power to push it up.

I would put some large lights (1k and 2ks, HMI is needed) to bounce off reflectors based on the ground to spread the light and avoid light beams in the air. Orange and Yellow gels to sell the color.

I haven't done this thing before and will be commencing tests in a month time. I'm looking for some suggestions to test and even some experience to be shared so I can get a better grasp on what I'm going to need.

Thanks!

Two photo references attached as location and fire references.

I was just a gaffer for a short film where the director is a haze fanatic, and we had a similar thing happening. I would definitely start the camera and set your shot before hazing, as most things, it'll look different and will affect the camera differently to how you see it. Haze a little then add more as you need it. We hazed into things in the background of our set to stop it from spreading everywhere.

I also found that my cine asked for a lot more lighting intensity after hazing so that he could get the focus on the actress, this may also be a factor in your blurry and hard to focus shots.

 

 

I think you are looking at the wrong thing. Menace Arm kit is just a bracket that standard speedrail slides into to make a Boom arm.

 

https://products.msegrip.com/collections/max-family/products/speed-rail-menace-arm-kit

 

 

Should be available at grip houses.

 

 

the Matthews Max Menace is a different beast.

 

https://products.msegrip.com/collections/max-family/products/max-menace-arm

That was the actual menace arm that I was looking for within Sydney. Couldn't find any for daily rent. Unfortunately, the shoot was last weekend, hence my late response.

We resulted to the same setup using C-Stands and worked with production design to install some more stabilization for the arm on top of the flats it was raised over.

What type of 2k are you flying?

 

 

 

We planned to fly an Arri Blonde 2K, but resulted to an Aputure 300d for the lighter weight and color tone. It worked for what we wanted in the end while drawing less power.

 

I would recommend a "menace arm" rig consisting of a heavy duty senior roller with menace arm kit and 20' 1.5" speed rail.

 

Guy Holt, Gaffer, ScreenLight & Grip, Lighting rental and sales in Boston

Looked for these already in my area and surrounding, and nobody seems to rent them daily, and the one person who does has it overseas for a shoot.

Any other solutions?

Hey there,

Currently looking for a solution to rigging a 2K above a large set inside of an industrial coolroom.

We did this the other day in a way that I would like to avoid doing again due to its stability.

Old Solution: C-Stand with cartalini gripping another C-Stand shaft at full length. Light at the end of that arm, Everything was shifted back by roughly 15 degrees and added 75kg of shot bags to the other end for counterbalance. Once raised, it was panned across and then ratchet tied to scaffold that was inside the coolroom.

Rough Floorplan: https://imgur.com/a/zPrlZHq

We were/are limited to a few things right now;

* Stands - C Stands are our best stands as of right now. I have the option to hire out another that is more suited, this is what I'm mainly looking for right now, but the footprint of larger stands don't fit inside the area we have.

* Can't light from the inside of the room - a lot of it is handheld and wide angle that covers the majority of the room.

* Flats can't be moved ( weight of the set pieces inside)

*Flats start at 2.4m at the door and end at 3.2m behind the bed.

* Roof of set is completely defused.

I'm primarily looking for a better stand to help raise and reach that will be more stable than the c-stands with all the weight that was on it.

Thank you!

Jayden