Maintaining Rich Blacks on Fast stock

[Antonio Campos]

We're trying to decide on what film stock to get. We're considering the Vision2 stock, but the problem is that we're going to be shooting some daylight exterior stuff and I'm afraid that it's blow out with such a fast stock.

So my question is should a) is the vision2 500T too fast to achieve really rich blacks? B) would that stock blow out shooting daylight exteriors? c) what if we shot interiors with vision2 500T and shot exterior stuff with the vision2 100T or 200T stock- would that match?

Thanks very much

[David Mullen ASC]

All the Vision-2 stocks match each other very well in terms of blacks, contrast, etc. The problem with using 500 ASA film outdoors is not blacks, it's graininess and having to operate while looking through a lot of ND.

[Ignacio Aguilar]

The problem with using 500 ASA film outdoors is not blacks, it's graininess

 

Yes. Check out Dean Semler's We were soldiers and The Alamo or John Seale's Cold Mountain for example. Very grainy images outdoors.

[John Pytlak RIP]

We're trying to decide on what film stock to get. We're considering the Vision2 stock, but the problem is that we're going to be shooting some daylight exterior stuff and I'm afraid that it's blow out with such a fast stock.

So my question is should a) is the vision2 500T too fast to achieve really rich blacks? B) would that stock blow out shooting daylight exteriors? c) what if we shot interiors with vision2 500T and shot exterior stuff with the vision2 100T or 200T stock- would that match?

Thanks very much

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Getting "rich" blacks is mostly a matter of having a "rich" exposure --- don't underexpose. Up to a stop of overexposure on color negative film will give even "richer" blacks with more shadow detail.

 

The Kodak VISION2 films (5218,5217, 5212) are very well matched to each other for tone scale and color. Your choice depends on how much light you have to achieve the stop you want to use, and whether you want to match the grain of the higher speed film, or want the lowest grain when you have the light for a slower film.

 

For use in daylight, a daylight balance film will usually offer slightly lower granularity than the equivalent tungsten balance film with 85 filtration, as the blue-sensitive emulsion must be faster (larger grains) in a tungsten balance film. So 5245 is a great choice if you have lots of daylight.

[Greg Gross]

500ASA is simply too fast for daylight. With still film it would be acceptable

for shooting with a large telephoto lens,hand held camera. I would use one

of Kodak's high speed,fine grain films. I don't know if you can shoot with the

color zone system using a movie camera as I am just learning movie cameras.

In still photography I can actually use the zone system(color) and calibrate the

camera,lens,enlarger,negative for the richest blacks and achieve them in the

final print.

 

Greg Gross,Professional Photographer

Student Cinematographer

[David Mullen ASC]

It's not too fast if you are shooting in heavy overcast weather, in the woods or in the canyons of tall skyscrapers -- that's more like twilight levels of illumination.

[Jayson Crothers]

It depends entirely on your situation - I photographed a feature this past summer with a substantial number of scenes in a dense forest; even in the middle of the day (in the extremely sunny state of Arizone), I was shooting at around a T2.8 on the Vision 2 500.

 

Dean Semler was shooting a lot of "We Were Soldiers" on 800T in day exteriors because he wanted deep stops for deep focus.

 

Again, it all depends on what you need creatively and practically.

[Greg Gross]

Thank you David,point well taken. I was assuming blue sky,clouds(broken),

bright sun,contrasty situatiion.

 

Greg

[Antonio Campos]

thank you for all the great comments and responses. They've been very helpful.

I had a follow up question: I talked to a color timer today who informed me that in order to get really rich blacks, he just needs to crush during timing. what can we do in the shooting in order to get the full effect of really strong blacks shooting at 500T (this is for interior night)?

thanks again

[Greg Gross]

The only way I know to get rich blacks is through exposure. I am now just

in the process of studying Kodak motion picture films(my own project). I

do not want anybody to think I'm an expert because I'm not. I am an expert

with color darkroom,shooting color, still films,printing. I do not do anymore

color work in my darkroom(too time consuming). I do custom b&w film pro-

cessing for local photographers and b&w custom printing also. If I was shooting

still color and processing it myself I would shoot using the color zone system. I

could get consistant results with same camera,lens,film,negative,enlarger. All of

these must be calibrated to your style of shooting when you use the color zone

system. I'm over simplifing this a little, its not hard or impossible but it requires

accuracy during calibration,detailed. I use a color lab in Philadelphia,have visited

them numerous times and they know how I want my work done. I've studied the

Vision 200T and I'm impressed with it,I would love to take a weekend and shoot

some of it(would have to rent a camera,I'd try a little jerky Private Ryan stuff to).

Have some actors who would be game for it. Expensive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I believe what you want to obtain is done through exposure. Did you see Mystic

River? Mr. Eastwood had some rich blacks there and detail.

 

Greg Gross,Professional Photographer

Student Cinematographer