Edgar Smith

Look Thomas, I don't know you and have nothing personal against you, but I was irritated by your comment that my opinion is based on bias against the JVC. The basic of your argument seems to be that since the JVC is better on paper and in theory, it IS better, therefore the fact that most people think there are other cameras that perform better than the JVC can only be because of bias. Sorry, not buying it, people can be biased, but not to that extent. I've owned many different brands of cameras, and for this last purchase i specifically made a point to look at JVC because I've never owned one before. I choose the DVX over the JVC for the simple reason that the DVX better fit what I had in mind. I don't know, maybe the JVC better fit your needs. Like I said before, I don't care about brand, if Joe Blow builds a camera out of beer cans and silly string that gives a great image and has useful features I'm buying it. It looks like we might be dangerously close dragging this thread off topic, so, if either of us would like to continue this discussion let's resort to PMs and concentrate on getting this guy a camera, OK? I never thought of it either, even though the name might have been a give away, lol. Here's a link to a short film from a group of teenagers from Finland that shows just what a PAL DVX can do: click here As for where to buy one, since I've only bought in the USA I frankly have no clue how or where one would go about purchasing a camera anywhere else, lol. :P

I need you to listen to me VERY carefully, ok? if you get a new 100b you need to buy from an authorized dealer, and ONLY an authorized dealer, alright? There are alot of scam shops out there that will rip you off, they will advertise a much lower price than normal, but when you try to order you'll find out that the price was only for the camera and they'll try to sell you all the accessories for an outrageous price that adds up to be way more than what an authorized dealer would sell it for to begin with. Even if you somehow managed to get a camera delivered from them, when you sent in the paperwork to Panny you would find out that you got a grey market camera and you would be denied your rebate, warranty, and all the extra goodies, like Barry's book and the Magic Bullet software. Here is a thread with a list of authorized dealers and identified scam shops:click here they also have a market place on dvxuser.com and if you think you might be interested in a used DVX you would do well to look there. P.S. I see Abel cine is a sponsor here, you might consider buying from them as they are authorized and I've had great service before with them.

My reference to drug testing was one of sarcasm, I was trying to get the point across that in the greater scheme of things the subject we are discussing is relatively unimportant. I want you to understand something: I don't CARE what camera I use, I am totally brand neutral. I would use a camcorder made out of beer cans and silly string if I thought it would give a great image. The facts are simply this: I looked at clips of the HD1, and didn't like them. My subjective opinion was that the DVX produced better colors. I don't CARE what your japanese engineers say about the chip design, that's my subjective opinion. Of course you are welcome to your own opinion, unfortunately for you it seems more people agree with me, and when you deal with completely subjective value judgments numbers win. You can go on and on about sampling this and filtration that, but at the end of the day the JVC image just isn't as pleasing to the eye for me, and quoting a camcorder's on-paper statistics ain't gonna change that. So what is your deal? I checked up on you, and it seems you are a total JVC groupie, bouncing from site to site hawking your JVC kool-aid. Do you own a metric crapload of stock or are you a paid shill? This site must be lightly moderated if you haven't been banned for trolling by now.

you can find an original dvx for under 2k easy, an A model should be around the 2k range roughly, and B models run about 2300-2500 generally, or at least how the prices seem to usually break down on www.dvxuser.com . Go to the market place at the bottom of that site, you'll quickly get a good idea what they go for. That's a great support site for that camera, BTW, you can get alot of good info there to help you make up your mind.

lol, are you a JVC salesman? :D seriously, here is a review from CNET on the JVC's color performance: "Unfortunately, the color subtlety and latitude--the ability to handle a range of brightness without blowing out highlights or losing shadow detail--aren't nearly as impressive as the resolution. In fact, they're inferior to what's available from similarly priced standard-definition cameras. Why? Any competing SD camera will likely have a three-chip imaging system, which handles the nuances of color and brightness substantially better than the JVC's single chip. Another weakness: The HD1 delivers a fairly marginal performance in low light. It's important to realize that, when it comes to image quality, resolution isn't the whole picture." Apparently I'm not the only one who thinks the color performance is less than stellar. I viewed samples comparing several different camcorders before I bought my DVX, and noticed at that time that the JVC's color didn't look up to par. As for double-blind scientific tests, I mean come on, this isn't a drug testing trial, this is about camcorders and it isn't THAT important. It's not like I hear 'single chip' or 'three chip' and start rooting for one or the other to win, I only care about performance. Here's another part of the review: "In HD mode, the JVC shoots at 30 frames per second, which gives a pleasant, filmic motion quality. However, it's not quite as filmic as the much-hyped 24P, which is the ideal HD variant for transfer to film--and which, unfortunately, this camera does not offer." The DVX scans 24 full progressive frames a second just like a film camera, the fact that it is interlaced for storage on tape doesn't matter and doesn't affect the original image at all. Once you capture into an editing system that removes the pulldown you can edit and output in native 24p, which won't have the cadence problems you claim. And anyway, the DVX has a 30p option also that I could use if I wanted, which I don't. In the end it doesn't really matter; while we're discussing latitude and color response David Lynch is out there shooting Inland Empire with a ragged pd-150. Heck, Spielberg could probably win an Oscar with a camera phone. Content is king. BTW, are you androbot from camcorderinfo, or did you just cut-n-paste from his post? :P

The image is recorded at the sensor at 24p, pulldown is added only for storage on tape. Think of it this way: a 60i camcorder records 60 half frames a second at the sensor and records them straight to MiniDV tape,while a 24p camcorder records 24 progressive scan frames a second at the sensor, but has to somehow fit those 24 full frames into 60 half frames for compatibility reasons. Like David said, if you split each frame you still only get 48 half frames, so the camera just doubles enough half frames (in a 2-3 or 2-3-3-2 pattern) to get 60 total and prints to tape. Most editing programs can recognize the pulldown pattern and remove it, so it is possible to edit in a native 24p timeline and do a proper film out with the original framerate if necessary. That's why with a progressive scan camcorder you have a few seconds delay when you hit the record button on or off, the camera has a slight delay while it performs the calculations and processing.

Well, that's kind of a vague description, lol :P but basically the DVX was designed to come as close to film as possible for a camera in that price range. In addition to 24p, it also has several gamma and color matrixes to choose from, and a couple of those are tweaked to try to come as close to film as possible. It has an extensive menu that allows you a considerable amount of adjustment as to how the image looks , and a switch for up to 6 different scene file settings so you can switch through multiple saved settings quickly. It also has a mechanically coupled zoom ring that has allowed me to do some crash zooms for a different, neat look in some scenes. It also has a great support community in www.dvxuser.com. Overall, it's a great camcorder at a reasonable price, and I'm very satisfied with mine.

MY understanding is that it records true 24p at a 24 hz clock rate, but it does have to add either 2-3-2-3 pulldown or 2-3-3-2 advanced pulldown to print to tape in a 60i format that 's MiniDV compatible. Some camcorders use a fake 24p that basically just cuts out frames, but the DVX has native 24p coming straight off the chips. Pulldown is only added after compression and right before the image is printed to tape.The initial uncompressed image has the same 24fps framerate that a film camera has. No, you are correct.

Yep, a DVX would be a GREAT choice. www.dvxuser.com would be a great place to go to find a used one, plus If you want to buy new they can steer you to an authorized dealer so you don't get screwed over. ETA: the DVX doesn't do a 'faux' 24p, it has progressive chips and records a true 24 fps image. Some other cameras(notably the fx-1) have a fake 24 fps mode (the fx-1 calls it's "cineframe"), but the DVX is pure 24p goodness.

One thing to remember about the JVC GR-HD1 is that it is a 30p 1-chip camera with a proprietary codec that can only be played back from a HD1, It also doesn't have any sort of Gamma adjustment like the DVX does to give it more of a film look. Personally, the HD1 footage I've seen didn't look near as good as the DVX as far as color.

I personally would recommend a dvx100; you can find a used one under 2,000 easy, an A is a little more, and a used B is about 2300-2500, and a new one after the rebate is about 2800. Plus it comes with all sorts of neat goodies; Barry Green's guide in both book and DVD form, Magic Bullet editors software(for adding all sorts of awesome film looks in post) and HD uprezzing software. For me the choice was clear; under 3K you can either get 24p and professional XLR audio or 60i HDV with a consumer miniplug audio system. My 2 choices were a Sony FX-1 with HD (that I couldn't use anyway, my editing system is FCP 4.5 which does not support the HDV format) Or a DVX100B with SD 24 progressive, 1.5 stops more latitude, better low light performance, a gamma and color matrix both shifted to give a more filmlike feel, and a professional XLR audio subsystem. For me, it was a no-brainer. P.S., the company doing the HD upgrades on the DVX is www.reel-stream.com, it gives the DVX a 720p image with uncompressed 4:4:4 color sampling, increases lattitude to approx. 9.5 stops(film is about 11, only about 1.5 more :blink: ) and for students the price is only $2000.

Another thing: you can find ads for the DVX100B online for 1800 or less, but those are unauthorized dealers (scam shops) that will tell you that the price is camera only, then try to sell you the accessories for an outrageously inflated price. Even if you somehow actually managed to get a camera delivered, panasonic would deny your warranty and refuse you the rebate and extra software because the camera is a grey market model from overseas, plus you wouln't be able to read your manual or any documentation due to it being in japanese or something. I wouldn't buy from them unless you want to experience the financial equivalent of an aggravated sexual assault.

You ain't finding a dvx100b for 1800, at least not one without an ungodly amount of hours and abuse on it. You might could get an original dvx100 for that price, and I've seen a few A's go for close to that with several hundred hours on them, but never a B, the cheapest I've seen a B go for was about 2200, and I got mine for 2300, 2300-2500 seems to be the ballpark right now for one of them that's in decent shape. The dvx is a great camera, though, in whatever version.