Gareth Blackstock

Hello,

Thanks for the tip, no harm in emailing them... do you have experience in getting prisms recoated from edmunds optics? I will email and see if its a service they offer. So far with other businesses the result has been at least a few hundred for the job, or the job is too small and not worth the hassle...

I'll check edmunds though.

Thanks, Gareth 

And after a nice clean up..

I figured I would add to this topic my own adventure into repairing a dodgy CP viewfinder.  Mine was pretty bad, unusable.  After trying many methods, including a big stick, I tried the persuasive approach... nail polish remover.  Worked a treat.  After removing the glass I discovered that mine too needed re-silvering.  I will be trying some Rust-oleum mirror effect spray paint in the coming days to see if I can repair my viewfinder.... they are pretty expensive second hand...

If I succeed I will add the results... I also emailed Jay to see how he faired with his attempt..

Here is the link to a User Guide for the Kinor 16 CX.  There are some things in it that are not covered in the previously posted manuals, some info comes from the internet, and some comes from using the camera myself.  Either way I hope it is useful to someone, and I needed something to do while "locked down"

https://www.mediafire.com/file/eugmxtqibcoowl0/Using_the_Kinor_16_CX-2M.pdf/file

As always, if I have missed something, please send a PM and I can get onto it,

Gareth

After stumbling across a very old version of the Kinor 16 CX-1M/2M Russian language user manual, I managed to use an online translation website to translate the manual to English.  Something I imagine has been sorely needed for a long time.  Hopefully the manual will assist in film makers feeling confident purchasing a Kinor 16mm  camera if they can learn about it's various functions.

English translation of the Kinor 16 CX-1M/2M user manual:

 https://www.mediafire.com/file/3sxe9trod2nrrm1/Kinor_16_CX-1M_and_2M_Manual_English_translation.pdf/file

Russian Language version of the Kinor 16 CX-1M/2M user manual:

https://www.mediafire.com/file/sdppuyembuh92x9/Kinor_16_CX-1M_and_2M_Russian_original.pdf/file

In the next week or so I will be adding a modern user manual with more pictures and information that is not covered in the original manual.

Cheers, Gareth

There are quite a few out there it seems, each camera suitability  depends on the buyers needs: some need magazines, some power cables, all will need a service...

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/184827742039

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/254870347721

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/203399555769

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/254767878364

I recently bought a recent Kinor sx-2m for US$300, complete set, just without power lead.

I expect it may a couple of issues, and thankfully Olex has lots of spare parts and advice...

A few years back I tried to start up a project regarding the CP-16 I have. I wanted to program a raspberry computer, then be able to connect it via numerous splices to the CP wiring loom, effectively replacing the faulty boards with a simple and highly effective mini computer.  But the computer programmer I was using backed out. Writing the progtam was too big, taken too long. Having to write code to recognise shutter angles for instance.

Hello, Hans

Seems I have had a positive experience with my Pathe.  I found the camera to be easy to use, well made, and a good design.  Taking one apart, however, I found one has to be very delicate.  As the various posts note, mechanically, everything has to be "just so" If something is installed a wee bit out, everything is out.

On the positive side, if a person is used to working on delicate items, such as carburetors, watches, or computers, then they will be used to being delicate and forcing nothing.  In this case working on a Pathe is not that hard, just needs patience.  If a person habitually uses a hammer when they work.... avoid working on delicate cameras!  Instead work on a Krasnogorsk K3... the only 16mm cine camera that actually improves the more it's dropped! 

In other words, buy one!

Link to a quick "tidy up" and lubricate:

http://canon-s8-repair.yolasite.com/pathe-webo-m-super-16.php

Interesting info:

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caméra_Pathé_Webo_M16

Translated page with more info:

https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.vintagecameras.fr/pathe/pathe-webo-super&prev=search&pto=aue

From this very forum:

And another:

Awesome write up, so much detail and covers almost everything!  Thankfully, thanks to google bots, in a few weeks if anyone searches the internet for Cinema Products camera info they will come up with this post in the first page or so of results, a really valuable resource for future CP shooters.

great work, keep shooting, and keep us posted!

Gareth

Hello,

Thanks for that, I enjoy a challenge.  However, offering to repair for money?  Thats a bit beyond my skill level... my stuff is strictly "clean, lube, re-assemble... and hope for the best"  Thankfully the small mistakes I do make are minor and only on my gear.  With out being trained and having the right tools I would be too nervous of screwing up someone's perfect shot.  Thats why i always run a 100 feet or so through to be sure.

I may later try to sell it, but in Australia the 16mm film market is very small, amatuer filmmaking even smaller...

cheers, Gareth

Hello,

I recently bought an old Pathe super16 Webo and was hardly surprised when it showed up with a few issues.  Seems most non-shop owning ebay sellers these days are "selling on behalf of another person" which seems to mean "I have no idea if it works so don't send it back!"

Anyway, it was cheap and I have been keen on getting one for awhile so I can tinker with it.  It came with an issue, film take-up cog not turning, very noisy operation, and generally grotty.  After a bit of poking around I fixed the issues, detailed my progress below, and now just have to shoot some test footage to make sure the shutter angle is ok.  

http://canon-s8-repair.yolasite.com/pathe-webo-m-super-16.php

If anyone has extra info I can add to my site please let me know.

I am next moving onto getting my Auricon CM72 working.... gonna be a hard one I think....

Cheers, Gareth

If you are lucky to find an old filter paper catalog, from Cokin for example, then in it you can see a sample of pictures, labelled "with filter" and "without filter" Very handy!

A good link is below:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/explora/photography/buying-guide/a-guide-to-filters-for-lenses

If you explore the filter types on this page each one comes with a description of what it does.

A pretty handy site.

Gareth

Seems quite confusing. Potentially a previous owner has indeed tinkered and put things back in a way that is slightly off. Maybe a gear was put back out of step with another gear, as simon suggests.

Start from scratch, is the take up spindle turning freely, is the film jamming causing the take up spool to jam? Try running film through in a continuous loop, splice and cement a loose loop, and see if while running any part of the film pulls or tightens?

You may have inadvertantly bought a "fixer up" with a bit of detective work you might fix it.

Good luck, Gareth 

Maybe shoot the lowest frame rate your camera can do, just get the actor to only move toward you, sideways will ruin the effect, tripod the camera....

Or, when you run out of film, tell the actor to freeze until you can reload the camera and shoot from exactly where you left off... Requires a very patient actor! Learn to load really fast....

Or borrow and Bell & Howell 240, they last for ages! Around 2 minutes I think...

The same happened to me a few times. I solved the issue by hitting the camera body with the heel if my hand, a good sharp knock on the body, not the door area. Also works when thrown at a person....

Chance of damaging camera? Minimal.

Having a camera that doubles as a weapon? Priceless.

Gday,

These people sell all the products you need:

http://www.visualproducts.com/servicesProductDetail02.asp?productID=561&Cat=92&Cat2=93

And they are a wealth of information about CPs

Gday,

Thanks for the info, after chatting to the lab I reckon the best course of action is to expose each 5 foot length in camera, focused on a sample card, like your suggestion, in average light, ie 5.6 irrespective of ASA, or light the sample to get the same exposure, then load the lengths into light proof box and send it in processing. Its going to be quite process but I will get definite answers on my film stock.

Thanks again,

Gareth

Hello,

I am coming up to a decent sized project and I need to test my store of expired stock. I am intending on taking a few feet from each roll, exposing them in a uniform way, sealing them, and send them off to be processed.

My big question is: how do I expose them all uniformly? Do I sit the lengths on a table in a dark room and let off a camera flash? Would that over expose the high ASA stock?

The lab I use is a small one and I think they do not have facilities or space to do such a test. Normally I shoot 100 feet as a test and send it off to discern the condition of the stock I have remaining, but I have around 13 different film stocks and I suspect a few of them.

I also accept there will be quality of image issues, but as the project is not a big budget one, we are happy to work with what we have.

Any thoughts would be helpful...

Cheers, gareth

I have also added a section to my website detailing what I have discovered so far while tidying up my CP16.  It is a work in progress, depending on how I go with the rest of it.

http://canon-s8-repair.yolasite.com/cinema-products-cp-16r.php

It might help when others who get hold of a camera are looking for info.  The folks at Whitehouse Audio Visual are great!  Pity I am not closer, I would be able to get them to service it!

Cheers, Gareth

G'day,

well I finally fixed up and completed my Frankenstein battery bank, it's not pretty but works great.  I have found a local seller who I can buy some nice tidy battery packs from, but seeing as i spent so much on my ones, I figure I better use them!

Awesome, 

Thanks for that, the price is pretty good, I have emailed the seller asking about postage.  I will upload an example picture later in the week of my Frankenstein attempt, it should scare lots of potential d.i.yer's

cheers, Gareth

Would it be possible for you to post a link to their website or similar?  If they are cheap enough I might get some.... depends on postage too I guess.

Cheers

That looks awesome!

How did you connect or solder the batteries so well?  My attempt looks like Frankenstein's nightmare...

here is a pic, it should come out o.k.  I also checked behind the cover, almost always the earth lead will be bolted to the chasis, and hopefully coloured green...

cheers, Gareth

Well I had a look at the camera terminals, I will post the pic tomorrow, but the positive is the top, negative below if you are looking at the camera side on.