Ian Cooper

I pity the poor shutter on the 30D. I understand Canon give a shutter lifetime of 100,000 cycles. 100,000 / 25 = 4,000 seconds 4,000 / 60 = 66 minutes of film before Canon disown the shutter. No doubt the shutter will continue to operate beyond that figure, but you could buy the camera new on a Friday, spend Saturday & Sunday transferring 3 hours of footage and have a dead shutter by Monday with the warranty expired through over-use!!

Yep, single perf will run through fine.

It doesn't sound like one of Clive's systems. The description is more like one of Roger's. Perhaps one of the Workprinter series set up with an digital SLR instead of a video camera??

I'm not sure if this would be better posted in the Arri sub-forum, but here goes: I've been looking at various lens mounts and found the Arri Standard Mount has a flange focal distance of 52mm with a diameter of 41mm. Olex's Post states the K3 FFD is also 52mm, and my own measurement shows the diameter to be 43mm The K3 lens mount has two locking tabs positioned almost 180 degrees from each other (top edge of one tab aligns with bottom edge of the other, so the lens will only fit in one way). The distance across them is about 52mm and each tab is 4mm wide by 2mm thick, with a 3.5mm gap between the tab and the mounting face. The photograph's on Tim Carroll's website show the front of the Arriflex 16S/B. The Arri bayonet mount can be clearly identified with tab slots, but the two standard mounts do not. Looking at the photo I'm guessing the lever on the camera moves a tab out to engage in a notch on the lens to lock it in place??? Would this be why a standard mount lens will go in an Arri bayonet mount, but an Arri bayonet lens won't work in a standard socket? Can anybody help with what the standard Arri mount looks like - photo/drawing? How far behind the mounting flange does the back of the lens project before hitting the mirror on an Arri? - I'm guessing the chamfer on the back of the K3 lens is to avoid the mirror. Why am I interested? Well at the moment it seems all I need is a 1mm sleeve with some locking tabs to be able to put a standard Arri lens in my K3! Whilst I don't have a great problem with the Meteor zoom or Mir 12.5mm I have at the moment, there are certainly more options in the standard Arri mount, wider wide angles, and the Angenieux 12-120mm zoom is only a touch slower but covers a greater range. I'm also guessing the Arri mount lens options will offer better contrast/performance than the K3 options? Arri standards also seem relatively cheap compared to many others. Ian. PS: Tim, if you read this I think you'll find a typo "Arrilfex" in your "A History of the Arrilfex 16S in pictures:" title!

Oh, the other thing I did to the camera was find out where 25fps actually was. I loaded the camera with 100ft of fogged test film and removed the lens, then using a stroboscope set at 25Hz I was able to adjust the speed dial on the camera until the shutter remained 'stationary'. I then scribed the dial to mark the position. In practice the speed varies by around 1fps between fully wound and fully unwound. Nowhere near crystal sync, but at least with the camera operating at an accurate nominal 25fps any movement on film looks normal. It's much better than taking a guess by using the settings on the speed dial - the governor pads have worn over the years so the dial markings aren't very accurate now (...of course that assumes they were accurate when it left the factory!) Ian.

Given the warnings I'd read about light leaking in, I thought it best to give the camera every possible chance of performing well! ;) The cost of film stock and lab charges is more than the time and money of removing loop formers, replacing the foam and giving it a good clean and lube. (and more than the cost of the camera and extra lens come to think of it :lol: ) I had the camera in bits giving it a clean and overhaul anyway. For the almost non-existent extra cost, and small amount of time, it seemed silly not to. When you lift the metal plate out to remove the loop formers you'll find light trap foam around the edge of the film counter window and up nearer the gate end of the compartment. Although this foam hadn't turned to goo on my camera, it had lost some of its 'bounce' and was starting to flake. Replacement light trap foam is readily available off the 'net. I can't remember where I got mine from, but here's a selection currently listed on ebay All I did was use a small amount of solvent to clean off the old foam, then cut the new stuff into strips and fasten it down (it has a self-adhesive backing). . . . ...Oh, and what I think Will was on about regarding hardware was choosing a more expensive, but more reliable and quieter camera than a K3 for professional projects. Of course it depends on budget and intended use; a K3 might be a cheap choice for short inserts not requiring sync sound, but the prospect of shooting anything too long or complicated with it would require quite a lot of determination. The end results might take longer to achieve and not be as good as those obtained by renting much better equipment for a shorter period of time. Ian.

No loop formers - all removed! (sorry, I meant 'loose' as in 'lost', rather than 'loose' as in 'loosen/slacken/adjust') I read too many comments online that they risked scratching the film. Before I removed them I tried passing film through - even with them moved fully back the film still tended to make contact... and it also liked to jam coming off the bottom loop former :angry: . My advice would be to get rid of them!! The information on the k3camera.com website is enough to show how to get it apart and back together again. Threading manually isn't difficult, and the camera doesn't seem too fussy on loop size. I make sure the top loop is large enough for the film to enter the pressure plate square on (ie. not so short it is trying to pull the pressure plate away from the gate, but not so large the film risks making contact with any other surfaces). I follow a similar process for the bottom loop, but tend to edge a little on the generous side. A quick blast at 25fps with the cover off confirms the loops don't get lost and the camera is feeding OK, then seal it all up and run about 10 seconds through to clear any fogged film from the loading process. I unload in a darkroom/changing bag/coat to prevent loosing the last scene to fogging as well.

It seems to make sense to use tungsten balanced indoors; to filter daylight down to tungsten will loose about 2 stops ...which means LOTS of light! The fastest kodak daylight stock is 250D, which would be reduced to about 80asa under tungsten light. Using tungsten outside isn't much of a problem - 2/3 stop isn't a great deal, and there's more speed range in the tungsten stocks. I wasn't aware Kodak had released a vision 3 500D? I thought they only did 500T? Fuji do a 500D, but I'd guess you'd only need that for very low light conditions. On a sunny day without additional ND filters 50D will be around f11-f16. 500D would be an extra 3 stops: f32-f45 in the sun Although in one sense the K3 won't care what film you put inside, don't forget 500T film will be a lot more sensitive to light leaks through ill-fitting doors etc. than a 50 asa stock will be - more care with the sealing tape! ;)

Hello, The sound track of the journey film is a combination of ambient sounds dubbed over the picture, together with sound recorded whilst actually filming. The crossing gates being closed was 'constructed' in the studio from ambient birdsong, and the sound of the crossing latch dropping shut. I didn't have time to set up the sound stuff (or rather I would be in a hurry after stopping the camera to get it all packed up again and rush ahead of the train, so wouldn't have time to pack away sound equipment as well!) The train going past in the landscape and the final shot of the train arriving in the station were recorded whilst filming (the sound from the final shot was also used when the train arrived at the level crossing) On the other "Motive Power" clip there's even more of a mixture. Much of it was shot during a photographic charter where the train will do numerous run pasts. Some was recorded whilst filming, some was recorded on a second run past after I'd stopped filming, and one was 'built' in the studio. The side view of the red locomotive going past with the slate trucks was built from 'chuffs' of the train moving slower than it was whilst I was filming it. All of the closeup views of the steam engines with a hiss in the background is dubbed on sound of a safety valve about to lift. The true sound whilst I was filming was silence, but that doesn't look believable on screen! A gentle hiss of steam in the background seems to 'fit' the picture better than the real audio! The reason why you can't hear the camera is a combination of microphone positioning, and being outside! I position the microphone as far away, and in front of, the camera as possible. It also means the microphone tends to be closer to what I want to record so the whirr of the camera in the background is much quieter than the subject matter. If I wear headphones and turn the volume up I can hear the camera in the background (especially the clunk as it stops), but I've yet to hear it on the TV at sensible audio levels. If I had a spare person to help me I'd send them off with the microphone to get it further away still. The focal length of the lens means the subject matter is usually quite a distance from the camera when it fills the frame - my limitation is the length of wire from the mic. back to the recorder positioned near the tripod! I've done quite a bit of work on those two short films since posting them on YouTube to improve the audio and editting. Trying to get a sound track which matches the pictures and transitions smoothly from shot to shot is as interesting as filming the moving pictures themselves. Most of the people I've shown the films to have been shocked to learn how much is dubbed on effects! The only modification to the camera was to remove the automatic loop-formers, and give it all a good clean & oil. The journey film was done entirely with the standard Meteor zoom. The Motive Power film was all done with the zoom, apart from the shot of Loco number 3 moving backwards towards the evening sun - that was done using the 12.5mm lens you can get for the bayonet mount K3. I'm afraid I don't exactly have much film maker experience - My only edited together films are the three I've dumped on YouTube! That's it, hopefully I can only get better! ;) None the less, I agree with Will that the camera won't care about film type. The journey film was all 7201 50D. The motive power film used a number of short-ends. The black locomotive (No 1) was shot with 200T, the Red Locomotive (No 2) was 100T and the green locomotive (No 4) was 50D. The two tungsten stocks were shot through a correction filter which lost me 2/3 stop. The 200T does have a slight 'texture' when viewed on the TV screen (not objectionable though, and most 'normal' people haven't noticed it). The 100T and 50D both look the same... although by the time you've filtered it for colour the 100T is exposed at 64asa anyway!

Hi Mathew, I think you'll find that the Todd-AO £50 (+VAT = £58.75) is for the complete package. It includes the cost of one cart of Vision2 stock (200 or 500), processing, prep and telecine to BetaSP or DigiBeta. If you ask they'll also provide a dub to DVD or MiniDV as well. I haven't got the exact figures to hand here at home, but I was quoted about £25 for them to telecine 50ft of S8, and their price for the film on its own is only a tad higher than some other UK sellers, and cheaper than others. If we reckon on that being about £12 then their processing is also about £12. Looked at in those terms its not too bad. Their advantage is they are prepared to handle one cart. at a time. Other places may work out cheaper per ft, but the minimum lengths they'll handle can be a limitation for 'hobby' projects as there'll be a large bill in one go. The other thing you'll find from Todd-AO is that their telecine is a 'best light', most other places will offer 'one light'. If you compare with the price from Andec: x4 carts of V2 stock = 4x19.25 =77 Euro x4 carts. processed at Andec is 4x20Euro = 80 Euro Prep. for telecine is 0.40 / meter = 24.40 Euro 10 minutes of negative telecined to BetaSP from Andec is 250 Euro, and in the absence of further details I'd guess it's one light. Foreign treatment charge = 3.50 Euro Total = 434.90 + VAT = 517.53 Euro So approx. £402.76 plus whatever UK customs may wish to add on top. This works out at £2.01 / ft The same thing from Todd is 4x50 = £200 + VAT = £235 So £1.18 / ft In fairness, Andec will Tk to MiniDV only, for half the price of their BetaSP Tk (thus bringing their overall price to £259.22), but then it's no longer a direct comparison with Todd. If you do the maths you may be surprised to find out just how quickly 16mm becomes cheaper: List price for 100ft of stock in the UK is about £25 (+VAT, direct from Kodak with free postage). The best I've found for process/prep/Tk is 21p/ft with 400ft minimum (about 10 minutes), best light to BetaSP/DigiBeta. 4x£25 = £100 400x0.21 = £84 £184+VAT = £216.20 or £0.54/ft (but don't forget 16mm uses twice the length of S8 for the same screen time). 16mm also has the advantage you can get short ends/recans/unused stock at cheaper prices. I've got a couple of 400ft cores of 7201 in the fridge which cost me £30 each. I have to respool it onto 100ft spools myself, but for my own projects I'm prepared to take the risk of the problems using non-fresh stock can give. For ME it's worth the risk, if I was on a paid job or filming a once in a lifetime occasion then I'd use fresh stock. Of course if one is eligible for a student discount then all those prices can fall further. Unfortunately I'm not :(

Yeah, my first fiddle with 16mm and my first proper project. These clips are just a little diversion playing with the rushes. I've also got footage on this first roll up at the end of the line around the old slate mine the railway was built to serve. Currently waiting in the fridge is a roll of 7218 and one of 7219 to take underground into the disused workings. Will be interesting, but think I'll be up against it regarding light power. Some of my underground stills at other mines can be seen on my website. Once you reach late morning the sun moves across the hillside behind the railway and casts the lot into shadow until late afternoon. When the sun reappears you'll be shooting towards it. The shot of loco No. 3. heading off into the afternoon sun with the glint from the loco is one of my favs and was later afternoon. The footage of No. 1 & 2 was actually taken during a photographic charter where neighboring landowners have their palms crossed with alcohol so their fields can be used, the trains will do numerous run pasts etc. ...oh, and the train will depart first thing in the morning to catch the early sun before it disappears over the hill! I'm afraid it's all just my own playing. The plus side is I can point the camera at whatever I want, the down side is I'm paying for the film & lab myself! I much prefer the look of film.

I've just uploaded a bit more film to YouTube. Still shot with a K3 and standard zoom lens. This time it's a mixture of Kodak film stocks. Talyllyn Railway Motive Power Kodak 7217 : Locomotive No. 1 on an overcast day Kodak 7212 : Locomotive No. 2 on a nice sunny day Kodak 7201 : Locomotives No. 3 & 4 on nice sunny days. The two tungsten stocks were shot through the correct correction filter at the time of exposure. Processing and telecine was carried out by Todd-AO in London. When viewed on a TV there might be a touch more grain evident in the 200T footage, but I doubt the average viewer would notice if they weren't already looking out for it. BTW: I know the commentary could be improved in a couple of places, and it's largely the YouTube compression that makes it sound as if it was recorded in a biscuit tin! <_< Oh, and the still at the beginning was shot on Fuji 64T with a Bronny SQA and an 80mm lens - f5.6 for 12 seconds!

I'm afraid I have compressed them to save space etc., but they haven't been resized and the amount of .jpg compression I've added hasn't really altered the way things look all that much. I have to say that when the images/footage is viewed on the TV they appear much crisper and sharper than when seen on the computer monitor. The grain adds a nice fine texture and is lovely and sharp, it certainly doesn't detract from the images. The pictures themselves when seen on a TV are sharp and there's no obvious difference between the Canon and the Beaulieu. I did find focusing 'issues' with the Canon. I think it was me struggling with the focusing aid rather than a problem with the camera, but it can be seen on some of these frames. On the first still you can see the corrugated shed in the background is much sharper than the safety valves and whistle in the foreground. This can be seen time and again on the footage shot with that camera. These first frames were shot with the Canon. Frame 1 - 69kB Frame 2 - 65kB Frame 3 - 46kB And these last two with the Beaulieu Frame 4 - 71kB Frame 5 - 75kB Unfortunately I don't think the presence of constantly moving grain across the whole picture really does the YouTube compression any favours! The water hose at the end just appears as a mushy blob, on the original you can clearly see the weave of the canvas! Not to worry. I also don't know what happened to the last few seconds of the clip, it was certainly there on the file I uploaded to YouTube, but has got chopped off now! - must be another compression technique, lol!

I've been a lurker just reading the forum for the last couple of years, I finally signed up since starting to explore the delights of 16mm. I've just posted a short sequence of Super-8 Plus-X on YouTube for those that might be interested. Rolling Home It was filmed a couple of years ago as a series of unrelated shots to test the film and a couple of cameras. This is what resulted when I sat down to see if anything could be edited together afterwards. Everything up to and including the first shot of the steam roller on the road was shot on a "Canon Autozoom 518SV", the rest was shot with a "Beaulieu 1018 SX8". Film stock was Kodak 7265 processed by Andec and telecined by Todd-AO. The version on youtube looks an awful lot better if you click the button in the bottom right-hand corner to display the video clip in it's native 320x240 resolution, rather than let the player try and make it bigger.

Thank you. This is only the second time I've done something seriously with moving pictures, even then these shots have been done as part of a larger project, I just put these bits together to show a friend. The minimum order for the lab is 400ft, so these scenes are just a small sample of the footage shot. The first 'film' I made was some B&W super-8 of a steam roller. That also turned out quite nicely - but I don't have full clearance for the music it's set to for it to be put on the internet, and I didn't record sound at the time for that exercise either. For that, it was all with the standard Meteor zoom. I decided to get the bayonet mount version of the camera, not only does it make swapping the lens a bit quicker, it also gave the option of the 12.5mm "wide angle" (£30). Coming from a medium format stills background I must admit the field of view from 16mm 'standard' and 'wide angle' lenses isn't what I'm used to calling 'wide-angle', but it's just a different (more restricted) way of looking at the world. The clips I've seen online from the 8mm Pelang showed a fair bit of distortion, which I wouldn't be happy with, so the bayonet 12.5mm was the only other (affordable) option. I don't have much use for long focal length lenses, my subject matter usually calls for standard or wide. I'd be interested to see it. Still no breakthrough. I'll try taping up the counter winder and door latch next time and see if it solves the problem. As the fog is so predicable, it won't be a huge problem to roll the camera 1 second earlier than planned, and add an extra second at the end. It's just not ideal. As I can't claim 'student' status, and it's just a hobby, I'm paying full price for everything. As a result I wasn't letting the camera roll any longer than necessary. The problem has arisen where 5 seconds is more than long enough for a nameplate or some other fairly stationary scene, but by the time you've chopped the beginning and end off, 3 seconds doesn't leave must room for 'creative choice' whilst editing!! I've tried just removing the fogged frames, which has worked in some cases, but a lot of the time you can see the jump. It's all a learning curve! Ian.

Ok, I know it reduces the quality of everything to that of a small cell phone with a thumb print on the lens, but if you fancy seeing another snipette of something shot with a K3, then I've posted a short sequence. Shot at the Talyllyn - the world's first preserved steam railway. << Talyllyn Railway Journey >> Ian.

Mmm, good thinking... : : ...I've just tried running it through a couple of times on single frame, also with the governor turned to its slowest setting - I can't see anything out of the ordinary. Even at 25fps the motion appears smooth enough, the loops both stay the same size and the clatter from the camera stays consistent. I did initially wonder if something could be happening around the gate about a second after starting, but I couldn't then explain how the fog would affect the film which had already been exposed at the end of the previous shot. The fact that the fog appears exactly the same distance either side of the gate seemed a bit more than coincidence. I've since had another peer around the viewfinder. It's clear light entering through the eyepiece will work back to the shutter, and thus the film sitting in the gate, but I honesty can't see a path from the finder optics through to the film chamber. Unless I can track something definitive down before hand, the next time I shoot I'm considering taping over the door latch and also across the counter window. It can't do any harm and will at least eliminate those two as possibilities. I'm guessing that as the fog is red coloured rather than white, the amount of light hitting the film must be very small indeed. Ian.

Ok, here's a bit more information. A SHORT CLIP (245kb). Before the end of the scene you can spot one frame with a slight red colour cast. You see the flash frame where the film was stationary, then a moment later a strong red fog across three frames. Sometimes it's a strong fog before and after the flash-frame, other occasions it's like this one. With one side stronger. The three frames at the start of the new scene are: 1) 2) 3)

I did wonder about the viewfinder, but can't see a path between the finder and the film compartment. I think there's a slot where the meter needle pokes between the finder and the mechanism behind the film chamber, but with the dividing plate screwed in place I can't see/imagine a path through. My other thought concerned the footage (meterage I suppose?!) counter. I've put new light foam around that and it appears a good seal, also the 19th frames aren't really very close to the counter, they're more in the centre between the two spools when the mechanism is stationary. What I can't fathom is that I'd guess a light leak positioned away from the film itself would give a general fog on an area of the film, rather than the tightly defined frame or three I'm seeing. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll have another peer inside tonight with more attention to the viewfinder. I'll also see if I can post a couple of frame grabs or short clip showing what it looks like etc. Ian.

Hi, I've been a 'lurker' for a couple of years, reading and absorbing information. I previously used Super-8 a bit, but around Christmas bought myself a K3 to experiment with 16mm. My first task was to strip it down, loose the loop formers, clean & lubricate, free off a couple of seized rollers and fit new light trap foam. I've been pleased (and pleasantly surprised) with the quality of the images I've obtained from the camera, but I seem to be experiencing a strange fogging issue. I routinely tape up the film chamber door to prevent it falling off and reduce light leaks. I get the obvious flash-frame where the film sits stationary in the gate when it is not running, but I also seem to get a red fog 19 frames either side of the flash frame. It doesn't always appear, but does more often than not. It can range from one frame gaining a slight colour shift, through to two or three frames affected building up to one very red frame at the centre. The film has been Kodak 7201, so pretty low speed. I've taken a scrap length of film, marked the 'flash' frame, then marked the 19th frame in either direction. With the 'flash' frame located in the gate I've been able to see where the 19th is sitting. Unfortunately it appears to be on the film spools! Certainly on the take-up side at the beginning of the film the 19th frame will be deep within the walls of the spool, and possibly even wrapped around the centre. I'm at a bit of a loss. The fact that this problem is situated either side of the flash frame seemed to suggest to me that it occurs when the film is stationary with the camera stopped, but I can't see any obvious (or not so obvious) way light could reach film on both 'exposed' and 'unexposed' sides of the gate at the same time. It's not a huge problem, I can make sure the camera is running for at least 1 second before the scene I want to capture, and run an extra second at the end as well. I'd just like to solve the problem if I can, does anyone have any ideas?