Altman's "3 Women"

Jody Lipes · May 19, 2004

can anyone tell me, or at least give there best guess about how "3 women" was shot. it's seems to my young eyes that the film is desaturated a fair amount, and also low con. I guess these are common visual traits in his films during that period.

are pre or post flashing definitly techniques used in this film? what are the difference between these two methods in terms of the affect on the image?

and lastly, what are all of the ways that desaturation can be achieved when finishing on film? excluding bleach bypass, so far i have underexposure, stock choice, pre or post flashing, cool filtration for a monocromatic wash, and art direction as possible tools. what else can i do for dramatic desaturation if i have very little control over the colors in frame?

Kevin Zanit · May 19, 2004

You could shoot an indoor stock outside un-corrected. Then in printing, time out the blue. This takes a lot of reds out of the skin tones, and adds to a more monochromatic feel.

Kevin Zanit

David Mullen ASC · May 19, 2004

I've listed all the ways one can desaturate an image before in older posts. Check the archives. Remember, many times you will combine multiple techniques.

I don't know about "3 Women". I know that "McCabe and Mrs. Miller" and "The Long Goodbye" used flashing combined with filters (low cons, double fogs, etc.)

Mitch Gross · May 19, 2004

I think you may be reacting more to the video transfer than the actual film. I've seen it projected and it's not that exceedingly low contrast. The look can also be attributed partially to Altman's predilection for the wandering camera. He often would shoot with multiple cameras, always on the zoom and usually on a small jib mounted on a dolly so that he could keep fluid motion throughout the shooting and point at whatever he pleased whenever he pleased. This would necessitate softer lighting so actor's could be free to move instead of precisely hitting their marks and the longer range zooms of the time were a bit weaker in contrast. All of this plus the production design of the particular movie (blanched out pastels in sun-drentched light) could make for a lower contrast look.

Hampus Bystrom · November 17, 2009

Sorry for digging up an old thread, but I just love Altman, and in my new film I'd like to mimic his zooms. So I thought it'd be better posting here rather than creating a new thread. Anyways, I will be shooting on the Red One, and I was wondering how long zoom one should get to achieve those Altmanesque zooms? My budget is practically non-existant so I can't afford the really long ones, like the Optimo 24-250 or what the hell it is. Is the Elite Zoom 24-82 enough?

David Mullen ASC · November 17, 2009

Sorry for digging up an old thread, but I just love Altman, and in my new film I'd like to mimic his zooms. So I thought it'd be better posting here rather than creating a new thread. Anyways, I will be shooting on the Red One, and I was wondering how long zoom one should get to achieve those Altmanesque zooms? My budget is practically non-existant so I can't afford the really long ones, like the Optimo 24-250 or what the hell it is. Is the Elite Zoom 24-82 enough?

How long is a piece of string? Only you can decide if 82mm is long enough, but Altman generally was using lenses like the 25-250mm Angenieux (or the anamorphized version on his scope movies). So 82mm is going to come up a bit short in terms of that long-lensed look in many of Altman's exterior shots. At the minimum, I'd look into something like the 20-100mm Cooke zoom.

Hampus Bystrom · November 17, 2009

How long is a piece of string? Only you can decide if 82mm is long enough, but Altman generally was using lenses like the 25-250mm Angenieux (or the anamorphized version on his scope movies). So 82mm is going to come up a bit short in terms of that long-lensed look in many of Altman's exterior shots. At the minimum, I'd look into something like the 20-100mm Cooke zoom.

Alright, that what's I needed to know. What kind of length on the zoom to have without it being ridiculous, to zip from a master shot to a close up. Thanks David, the Cooke 20-100 isn't too expensive.