B&W filmstock neg/rev

Jan Weis · March 25, 2006

In my soon to be shot short film entitled ''Coffee Revolution'' I want to provide a specific look. Since I've decided to shoot in B&W mostly because of the budget but also because I have been fascinated with black and white films for some time now.

I have ''studied'' films such as ''touch of Evil'' & ''Dr Strangelove'' and I have decided to go with a 1950's-1960's b&w look. I love the contrast of these films, especially Touch of Evil but I dont want to go that far with the darkness, so I guess the look I'm looking for is something between film noir and classic b&w (think Good Night and Good Luck).

This will be the first time i attempt to shoot in b&w and I know the lighting is crucial and thereore I'm considering to shoot negative PLUS-X 7231 for more latitude, but I'm also afraid that it will provide a black and gray look rather than a black and white look. I am also considering shooting reversal because many people have said that its the way to go because of the look it provides, but I'm afraid that I'll screw up the exposure.

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that I intend to get my film telecine and edit on the computer.

So with what film should I got with

PLUS-X 7231?

or with

TRI-X 7266?

Mikael Lemercier · April 5, 2006

hi Ozzball,

7231(very good latitude) is a good deal for your project, use a pan glass(contrast viewing glass for B&W) for a best result(making a great light).

If your light meter doesn't say anything and you can see something through your pan glass, don't worry shoot.

regards.

Mikael.

Jan Weis · April 8, 2006

hi Ozzball,
7231(very good latitude) is a good deal for your project, use a pan glass(contrast viewing glass for B&W) for a best result(making a great light).

If your light meter doesn't say anything and you can see something through your pan glass, don't worry shoot.

regards.

Mikael.

Thanks for the advice Mikael!

I got an aditional question though..Would you also recommend me to use diffrerent kinds of colour filters such as orange or yellow, as I understand it, they're usually used to increase contrast on the sky's but is it suitable for a project which will be shot indoors with bright lights?

David Mullen ASC · April 8, 2006

Color filters just cancel some wavelengths of the opposite color, which is why oranges, reds, etc. increase contrast outdoors, making blue skies darker and blue-ish shadows darker, but redder faces brighter. Indoors, all it would do it affect the tonal response of objects, so if you wanted people to look paler, a redder filter would do that, but you could do that with exposure, make-up, etc. Januz Kaminski found on "Schindler's List" that he had to overexpose faces slightly to make them pop out in b&w.

Sam Wells · April 8, 2006

I love B&W reversal film stocks, but the subtler scale of Plus X neg vs reversal will probably work to your benefit; TriX rev is beautiful but you will see the grain. Plus X reversal can look fantastic on a telecine transfer but it's sloooow if you're lighting it. And you seem to want a bit less contrast.

You avoid the "black and grey" look by exposing properly and having a balance beween highlights and shadow in your shots.

I don't use a pan glass, I just "think in Black & White" !!

-Sam

Jack Honeycutt · April 8, 2006

hi Ozzball,
7231(very good latitude) is a good deal for your project, use a pan glass(contrast viewing glass for B&W) for a best result(making a great light).

If your light meter doesn't say anything and you can see something through your pan glass, don't worry shoot.

regards.

Mikael.

Hello Mikael...

I would also like to shoot some B&W. I like the B&W look better than the black and gray that I usually get. What is a "Pan Glass" and where can I buy one?

Thanks in advance.

jack

April 8, 2006

Dear friends of B&W Cinematography... The Kodak negative B&W stock hasn´t change since the 1970s -it´s quiet old fashioned. Let me recommend you a much more modern filmstock:

It´s ORWO UN 54 (100 ASA) and ORWO UN 74 (400ASA) Both films are B&W negative - produced by the german company "Filmotec". The grain is much finer than that of the Kodak B&W Negative-series -and it´s fresh, modern emulsion (first "published" in the late nineties). JUst visit the site of the company Filmotec -www.filmotec.de. It´s a german company but they offer an english site. You can order filmstock directly from the company. One more advantage over Kodak: It´s cheaper! I´m shooting mostly B&W and I love this stuff -and the reason is not patriotism!

Ole Dost

Jan Weis · April 8, 2006

Dear friends of B&W Cinematography... The Kodak negative B&W stock hasn´t change since the 1970s -it´s quiet old fashioned. Let me recommend you a much more modern filmstock:
It´s ORWO UN 54 (100 ASA) and ORWO UN 74 (400ASA) Both films are B&W negative - produced by the german company "Filmotec". The grain is much finer than that of the Kodak B&W Negative-series -and it´s fresh, modern emulsion (first "published" in the late nineties). JUst visit the site of the company Filmotec -www.filmotec.de. It´s a german company but they offer an english site. You can order filmstock directly from the company. One more advantage over Kodak: It´s cheaper! I´m shooting mostly B&W and I love this stuff -and the reason is not patriotism!

Ole Dost

I checked out their site and it seems that ORWO B&W negative films are only avalable in 400 ft, my camera only takes 100 ft.

This is a problem, but thanks for sharing!

I love B&W reversal film stocks, but the subtler scale of Plus X neg vs reversal will probably work to your benefit; TriX rev is beautiful but you will see the grain. Plus X reversal can look fantastic on a telecine transfer but it's sloooow if you're lighting it. And you seem to want a bit less contrast.

You avoid the "black and grey" look by exposing properly and having a balance beween highlights and shadow in your shots.

I don't use a pan glass, I just "think in Black & White" !!

-Sam

Thats some good advise you got there, ''think in black & white''

I'm starting to think a red filter will be very useful in situations when its hard to create true b&w.

andres victorero · April 8, 2006

Dear friends of B&W Cinematography... The Kodak negative B&W stock hasn´t change since the 1970s -it´s quiet old fashioned. Let me recommend you a much more modern filmstock:
It´s ORWO UN 54 (100 ASA) and ORWO UN 74 (400ASA) Both films are B&W negative - produced by the german company "Filmotec". The grain is much finer than that of the Kodak B&W Negative-series -and it´s fresh, modern emulsion (first "published" in the late nineties). JUst visit the site of the company Filmotec -www.filmotec.de. It´s a german company but they offer an english site. You can order filmstock directly from the company. One more advantage over Kodak: It´s cheaper! I´m shooting mostly B&W and I love this stuff -and the reason is not patriotism!

Ole Dost

Hi i saw this stock few days ago and I saw like a strange stock, but if you say that it´s a great stock... then it is. Can you post some pic of your shoots?

what image can give this stock, like a Tri X reversal? better in grain, sharpness and contrast?

thanks

Robert Hughes · April 9, 2006

Let me recommend you a much more modern filmstock:
It´s ORWO UN 54 (100 ASA) and ORWO UN 74 (400ASA) Both films are B&W negative - produced by the german company "Filmotec".

I checked with Filmotec last year; the sale price seemed reasonable, but shipping costs from Germany to USA were prohibitive. Has anyone in USA set up a distributorship, yet? That would help ORWO sales significantly.

Mikael Lemercier · April 13, 2006

Hello Mikael...

I would also like to shoot some B&W. I like the B&W look better than the black and gray that I usually get. What is a "Pan Glass" and where can I buy one?

Thanks in advance.

jack

Hi Jack,

http://www.tiffen.com/displayproduct.html?...rs&itemnum=BWVF

a pan glass is a B&W viewing fiter, it can be helpfull to have a good b&w idea.

regards.

Mikael.