New York Student film makers

[Guest Dtm115300]

I live in New York and i want to learn Cinematography. I know all the big schools NYU, USC, UCLA

But if i had to go with either School of Visual arts, SUNY Purchase, or The New School which school would give me the best training?

 

 

Thank you

 

-Dan

[Kenneth Kotowski]

I live in New York and i want to learn Cinematography. I know all the big schools NYU, USC, UCLA

But if i had to go with either School of Visual arts, SUNY Purchase, or The New School which school would give me the best training?

Thank you

 

-Dan

 

SVA has a good program, but you should also look into City College, and Hunter in addition to Purchace.

[Jamie Metzger]

www.academyart.edu

 

I know it's on the other coast, but I moved from NY to Cali, and the school here is amazing.

[Rik Andino]

I live in New York and i want to learn Cinematography...

if i had to go with either School of Visual arts, SUNY Purchase, or The New School

which school would give me the best training?

 

Obviously SVA.

 

The New School claims to have a filmmaking program...

but most people consider it inadequate.

 

SUNY Purchase has a decent film program--but it doesn't concetrate heavily on cinematography

It's also a rigoursly selective program and most people don't make it in...

The school also doesn't have the greatest environment and many students dropout or transfer...

 

So it leaves SVA which a compent program that isn't very selective...

And does concentrate on cinematography unlike other schools with Film Programs.

 

As someone mention also check out some other schools particularly the CUNY's

Hunter has a really good program and it's not too selective

City College has a very competent graduate program

 

And there's my alma Mater

Brooklyn College has one of the best undergraduate film course in the East Coast.

http://depthome.brooklyn.cuny.edu/film/

 

Remember college is tough and many college students go into school studying one thing

And graduate studying another...so don't be so quick as to decide your college path right away.

 

Research the best places to go that give you several options...and remember affordability.

(Especially now when a large majority of college kids continue to a graduate education--

it's important to save some money for the graduate education

which can be more crucial than the undergraduate.)

 

Good Luck

[Jordan Roettele]

Obviously SVA.

 

The New School claims to have a filmmaking program...

but most people consider it inadequate.

 

SUNY Purchase has a decent film program--but it doesn't concetrate heavily on cinematography

It's also a rigoursly selective program and most people don't make it in...

The school also doesn't have the greatest environment and many students dropout or transfer...

 

So it leaves SVA which a compent program that isn't very selective...

And does concentrate on cinematography unlike other schools with Film Programs.

 

As someone mention also check out some other schools particularly the CUNY's

Hunter has a really good program and it's not too selective

City College has a very competent graduate program

 

And there's my alma Mater

Brooklyn College has one of the best undergraduate film course in the East Coast.

http://depthome.brooklyn.cuny.edu/film/

 

Remember college is tough and many college students go into school studying one thing

And graduate studying another...so don't be so quick as to decide your college path right away.

 

Research the best places to go that give you several options...and remember affordability.

(Especially now when a large majority of college kids continue to a graduate education--

it's important to save some money for the graduate education

which can be more crucial than the undergraduate.)

 

Good Luck

 

 

Hey,

 

I'm at Brooklyn now and I'm in Adv. Cinematography. Its great! Small school with limited budget for lights and cameras but makes you more harder and you get more out of the classes.

 

Rik, did you have hornsby? I know he has been there forever.

 

Jordan

[Guest Dtm115300]

Thanks for all the info guys!

[Cole Webley]

I was just out in NY shooting a doc on Milton Glaser and we went to SVA to interview Steven Heller -- the head of the graphic design department. It seems SVA is a pretty great school, at least from what I could tell. Best of luck when you decide.

 

I went to Brigham Young University -- low tuition/high value of education -- In fact, it was voted best education for the costs of tuition.

 

I managed the equipment checkout facility which housed these items:

 

These are the film cameras we have:

6 Bolex

5 Arri S

1 Eclair NPR 16

1 CP-16

1 Arri SRII S16

1 Aaton 54 S16

1 Mitchell Mark II 35mm

 

Digital:

2 XL-1s

2 DVX-100s

2 HVX-200s w/ P2 cards, etc.

 

and tons of grip/electric equipment including Kinos (4ft, 2ft, and 12'' kits) 1200w HMIs, 5600k 400w Joker kit, Mole-Richardson 2ks, etc--we had lots of fun with this stuff.

 

Also, the LDS church has its own studio (in Provo where BYU is located) w/ transfer suite, effects house, two full size sound stages, etc. that we were able to tap into from time to time (my last project I shot on their sound stage and we used the Aero crane for a shot).

 

BYU is also one of the 12 schools that Coca Cola invites to submit in the Refreshing Filmmakers Competition -- if that means anything.

 

Those schools are:

 

University of Southern California

University of California at Los Angeles

New York University

Columbia University

Northwestern University

Florida State University

North Carolina School of the Arts

California State at Long Beach

University of Colorado at Denver

University of Texas at Austin

Chapman University

Brigham Young University

 

Best of luck in your decision. Film school is what we make of it, right?

[Rik Andino]

Rik, did you have hornsby? I know he has been there forever.

 

Bill Hornsby has been teaching at BC for over 20 years.

I took his Advance Cine course 6 years ago.

He's a very good cinematography teacher.

 

The thing about him is he teaches the traditional methods

And teaches people how to shoot film which is rare these days in film school.

 

Most places these day that claim to teach filmmaking teach people how to shoot video.

It's good there still people out there teaching the old-school techniques...

So you won't be on forums saying things like: "I want to shoot film but I'm scared..."

 

 

Anyways

Good Luck (it's a tough class)

[Owen Donovan]

Bill Hornsby has been teaching at BC for over 20 years.

I took his Advance Cine course 6 years ago.

He's a very good cinematography teacher.

 

The thing about him is he teaches the traditional methods

And teaches people how to shoot film which is rare these days in film school.

 

Most places these day that claim to teach filmmaking teach people how to shoot video.

It's good there still people out there teaching the old-school techniques...

So you won't be on forums saying things like: "I want to shoot film but I'm scared..."

Anyways

Good Luck (it's a tough class)

 

 

WE LOVE Brooklyn College. I am a student there now, haven't made it to advanced cinematography yet it's a shame they only teach it once a year, However my experience there has been great so far. CUNY prices, Some really great professors and alot of diversity in taste among the students. Brooklyn really has a lot going for it. My perspective on film school, learning production and cinematography is this: alot of the eductation you recieve at the school you're attending is UP TO YOU. You can spend 20k plus a year to go to SVA or NYU but you are really paying for the name. A school like Brooklyn allows you access to everything those schools do minus 35mm but no one is stopping you from going out and renting a 35 to shoot. Remember film is a creative medium! you can leave college with a B.A. in film from SVA and NYU and your reel might stink! If you have talent and ambition it doesn't matter where you go you will learn alot and excel in whatever aspect of film you wish to pursue. Anyways I wouldn't want to attend film school w/ a bunch of rich boys and girls because from my experience any artform isn't survived by the priviledged as art or the "life of an artist" is not to be romaticized. It is a necessity.

[Jon Rosenbloom]

I've shot a bunch of films for NYU and Columbia students, and - frankly - the best stuff on my reel is from NYU undergrad films. Columbia is more about script and NYU is more about visuals. Everything I've done at Columbia has been on video, whereas at NYU everything has been on film. So if the interest is strictly in cinematography I would lean toward NYU. Also, NYU's facilities are tops out of all the schools you mentioned. NYU has a real studio, whereas Columbia's is jusr a big dirty room in an abandoned laboratory building. Don't know who's tops in tuition.

[Nathan Milford]

Brooklyn is my Alma Mater as well...

 

Rik and I took Advanced Cinematography II - Digital Formats together.

 

Bill Hornsby is fantastic teacher. He is reason enough to pay the measly tuition (compared to NYU, Columbia, etc..) to go there. There are some other stellar professors there as well.

 

- nathan

[Guest jfm341]

NYU Tisch, no contest.

[Owen Donovan]

I've shot a bunch of films for NYU and Columbia students, and - frankly - the best stuff on my reel is from NYU undergrad films. Columbia is more about script and NYU is more about visuals. Everything I've done at Columbia has been on video, whereas at NYU everything has been on film. So if the interest is strictly in cinematography I would lean toward NYU. Also, NYU's facilities are tops out of all the schools you mentioned. NYU has a real studio, whereas Columbia's is jusr a big dirty room in an abandoned laboratory building. Don't know who's tops in tuition.

 

J-Ro i'm confused :blink: The thread is about learning cinematography in NYC. Did you attend either of these schools or just DP for student projects? I understand your best work was for students at NYU but if you didn't attend this school then they hired out...Just wondering if you could clear this up. ;)

 

For tuition, I have a roommate who attends NYU for screenwriting and pays close to 40k a year. A film student would have to pay a few grand more with lab/equipment fees etc. and this is baseline before you start producing a film. Columbia I don't know but I would assume it's close to the tuition at NYU. I go to Brooklyn College which costs me 4k a year 1/10 of NYU yes the facilities themselves aren't quite as cozy i'm sure but we have plenty of power mac g5's that run final cut, bolex's, K3's then for upper classmen there are cp-16's, as well as arri MOS, sync-sound, and crystal runs available. Not to mention a great Cinematography teacher. The point I'm getting at is this: sure if you are ok with going about 200k in the hole for an undergrad in film go right ahead, but for most people living life that isn't an option. Brooklyn gives you all the means necessary to leave with a solid reel ready to compete with students from both NYU and Columbia for jobs. It's not what you got so much as it is what you make of it. Hell the money I will have saved going to BC could produce two (very modest) full length indie films on 35. And with cinematography only so much can be taught, alot of it comes from the gut/ intuition/ artistic sense/ luck whatever you want to call it. And yes I'm only a little bitter I can't afford to shoot a 10:1 ratio on 35 for my thesis but great creativity often comes out of understanding one's limitations.

 

And just for record several profs over at Brooklyn taught at NYU before coming over here, They prefer teaching at BC and say you recieve MUCH more individual attention compared to NYU. Though I haven't been attending too long I would definately say the BC film department is like an extended family; every prof knows your name and I have met with each several times a semester if not more regarding my work. I would venture a guess that whoever teaches Cinematography at NYU, Columbia, or SVA would not be willing to stay until 11 o'clock at night talking with students about their work. If i'm wrong i'm wrong B) . And YES they are not gonna bad mouth BC but these are honest people.

[Jon Rosenbloom]

I was just extrapolating from my experience as a non-student DP on several NYU and Columbia jobs. My point was that NYU seems more oriented towards the visual aspects of film-making. (It was one of my dear NYU student-directors who told me the film had to look great to cover up the bad story.) Of course, both schools are ridiculously expensive. Having not gone to film school, I kind of view the 40k/year thing as a bit of a rip-off. Sure, they give you insurance, but you'd think they could come up w/ something better than the Angenieux 10-120! Why not work as a PA for a couple of years and see how the pros do it?

[Hal Smith]

J-Ro i'm confused :blink: The thread is about learning cinematography in NYC.

My two cents worth is that any school in NYC has the advantage of being in the greatest location city on the planet. I've never shot motion film or video in NYC but I always take a still camera or two with me on business and theatre trips to the City. Hands down the most interesting photos I've shot in recent years are from those trips. There's something magic about taking photos in the City with such an incredible collection of visual icons.

[Owen Donovan]

My two cents worth is that any school in NYC has the advantage of being in the greatest location city on the planet..... There's something magic about taking photos in the City with such an incredible collection of visual icons.

 

I absoloutely agree, NYC has so much to offer, whatever mood you want to set you can find it here. And often times it's only a few blocks walk "ritz" to "raff" especially in my part of Brooklyn. I've had fellow film students complain how hard it is to shoot in New York without making it look "Cliche". PSHHH what a load of crap. Maybe they think their cameras only work in Manhattan.

 

and J-ro....Thanks for clearing that up. I've heard mixed things about the film program over there but my roommate in screenwriting says they push hard to sell their students on current writing trends in the media. Of course film is a visual medium and any film program (IMHO) should stress the visuals as much as if not more than the story. So what your saying makes alot of sense.

 

Also just to let you know over here it's 150 beans a year for insurance coverage! :lol: Group plans!!!! Anyway do you know if it's common practice to hire out for DP's over at NYU and Columbia? or is it just cause you knew the directors well? If it is common practice maybe I should get down there after I've shot more 16 and peddle my wares. Would be nice someday to strictly shoot something and not have to put in a hand at various other jobs.

 

I see where you're coming from with the whole PA thing....a buddy of mine is doing that now....But doing that you SEE how they are doing it, but you don't have the technical skills and full knowledge and confidence you get when you leave a film program...he's a great guy but I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him with a camera or light meter....I mean sure you may have mastered the ability to assertively tell a stranger to stop walking cause "We're shooting a film" But who's really gonna take the chance, even on a small student/post-student production of you taking 5 hours to light a scene with the appropriate ratio?

 

Maybe I'm naive But I believe with a strong thesis and reel you can bypass the whole P.A. phase out of school....not to say a good reel starts you off DP'ing/directing indie films lord knows that's a LONG shot. But you won't have to guard a camera or bring folks coffee on a music video/commercial shoot. but hell, who knows. If anyone has thoughts on this I'd love to hear it. :)

[Jon Rosenbloom]

Yes, it's very common practice for Columbia and NYU students to hire outside DP's. My only "in" at those schools was answering ad's on Mandy.com, and then doing good work and being referred to other students. That said, I'm able to do professional work on student productions because I've worked on professional productions for a long time. Being a PA is a rough racket (I haven't been a pa for 10 years), but if one is astute, one can just kind of absorb what the whole shooting thing is about (parking, moving equipment, blowing fuses, etc.). Also, you might talk to a gaffer or AC or even a DP once in while ... and then you can take some photography classes ...

Edited May 28, 2006 by J-Ro

[Rik Andino]

I was just extrapolating from my experience as a non-student DP on several NYU and Columbia jobs.

My point was that NYU seems more oriented towards the visual aspects of film-making.

 

This is what's strange about NYU...

If someone wants to study cinematography...

Why are they going to go to a school where most of the students hire outside pros to DP there films

How is a cinematography student going to learn if he never gets to shoot...?

 

Sure the directors have a great student film...

But if you're paying 40K a year to learn to be a cinematographer...

I figure you'd want to shoot some shorts.

 

That's what I've always found funny about schools like NYU and Columbia.

 

Although for the record I must acknowledge...

That NYU's GRADUATE film course is perhaps the best in the East Coast

Doesn't matter if you're interested in being a screenwriter, director, or cinematographer...

But at 40K a years it might not be worth getting in total debt to learn filmmaking from the best.

 

Just my two&half cents :)

[Chris Keth]

Have you considered RIT? I'm going to be a senior there this year and I'm very satisfied with what I've learned in 3 years. So far, I have shot 21 short films in my time at RIT, with several more upcoming. The opportunity to do that is one of the best things I've found about it, not to mention one of the best stocked equipment cages I've seen at a college.

[dr_gonzo]

I was in the cinematography program over at SVA and found it to be overall pretty good. Their two cinematography teachers were very helpful, but like most things at film school you really learn everything by just going out and shooting-shooting-shooting.

 

The equipment they have at SVA is decent as well, I shot my thesis on the SRII and was able to take out a ton of lighting and grip from the equipment office.

 

I also went to SUNY Purchase for a couple of years and although the film program is alright the campus does not do much to foster creativity...Id stay away.

 

Dont hesitate to send me a message if you have any specific questions about the program.

[Bill DiPietra]

(It was one of my dear NYU student-directors who told me the film had to look great to cover up the bad story.)

 

That kind of thinking ALONE, is a problem.

 

Bear in mind that you can always attend the Continuing Education cinematography classes at NYU, rather than pay for all of their undergrad classes. In my opinion, it is an overpriced school. You will get a lot out of it, but have the check book ready...

[ryan_bennett]

SVA, Check out the price. I choose Emerson College (boston ma) and once in awhile I really regret not checking out SVA moreso, as I made it into SVA with good deal of grant money and got into the film program, whereas Emerson gave me a lot of money, it costs more than SVA and I didn't make it in the film concentration. Not like you can't shoot film on your own anyways. I choose based on location. Keep all of these things in your mind AND the fact that you will have to spend good deal of your money to make films, so I say the cheapest school the better. Waste all your money on the school then how you going to make your movies?