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The Causes of Grain


Guest Daniel J. Ashley-Smith

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Guest Daniel J. Ashley-Smith

Hi,

 

We all know that the faster the film, the more grain.

 

What other aspects affect the film grain??

 

I've seen people mention the way it's developed e.t.c.

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Underexposure, push-processing will increase grain. Overexposure, pull-processing will reduce grain. Low contrast images with lots of midtones will make the grain more visible. Therefore scenes shot with smoke, diffusion, flashing, etc. will tend to bring out the grain structure.

 

Film stock aging (causing loss of speed and increased base fog levels) will increase graininess.

 

Duplication of film through multiple generations will increase graininess.

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Guest Daniel J. Ashley-Smith

Ok cool, thanks David.

 

May I just ask, what's the difference between a push and pull process?

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If you have film in your fridge, how long until there will be a noticable aging to the stock/grain/look/etc.? weeks/months/years? (particularly 5218 and 5217)

 

Refrigeration greatly slows the chemical changes in the film structure as it ages. But ambient radiation like cosmic rays does cause a slow buildup of fog and grain, especially for the faster films. For an EI 500 film, refrigerated film has a shelf life of about two years with negligible change. Beyond that, you should do a clip test with your lab.

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Pushing means you overdevelop the film, which increases contrast and makes the colors warmer.

Pulling means underdeveloping the film, which reduces contrast and makes the colors shift colder.

 

In terms of color, I've heard that pushing increases saturation while pulling lowers saturation, however, I've never heard anyone talk about a cool/warm shift as being an effect of push/pull processing. I know you're working with some excellent DP's, Max, is this wisdom passed down from one of them? Anyone else familiar with this?

 

I do recall reading an interview on the Fuji website with Emmanuel Lubeszki, ASC talking about how one stop push processing on F-500T yielded a "subtle visual color effect" for some scenes in "Ali" (http://www.fujifilm.com/JSP/fuji/epartners/MPBehindTheScenesDetail.jsp?dbid=MP_BEHIND_SCENES_508122), sounds like he's describing a shift in the color palette...

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One thing I would always advise is to be on guard for old expired film.

If you're going to store film you also need to refrigerate it to preserve it.

You can take it out of refrigeration and give it enough time to warm up be-

fore you use it. Of course immediate use of film purchased does not apply

although you might want to keep it in a cooler if its a terribly hot day. Rep-

utable people will not sell you expired film.

 

Greg Gross,Professional Photographer

Student Cinematographer

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Just to clarify pushing and pulling,for anyone who is confused. Keep in

mind also that what I'm going to say does not include sophiscated auto-

mated equipment used to process movie film. Follow me:

1-roll of Kodak b&w film to be developed in darkroom. I place it in the develop

tank and start the darkroom timer(I'm pushing so I have increased the time on

the timer). The period of time for development will be longer. 1-roll of b&w Kodak

film to be developed. I place it in the develop tank and start the darkroom timer

(I'm pulling or underdeveloping the film so I set less time on the timer). The per-

iod of time for development will be less. Here's where it gets sticky guys, what is

the normal development time for the film to develop? Kodak may say on their spec

sheet that you should develop the film normally for 7 minutes, they are not wrong.

But what is normal for you? What kind of negative do you want to print? I may have found that for me my desired negative is achieved with 6 minutes and 30 sec.

of development time. So pushing and pulling for me will deviate from 6 minutes

30 sec. development time. It is very important to communicate to your lab people

what you want. You may not get the look you want. What is standard development

time for your lab? If you know your stuff you may not want that time. Development

is a continuing process until developer is removed from film and development is

chemically stopped. This may be reason if you have varied results.

Greg Gross,Professional Photographer/Student Cinematographer

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In terms of color, I've heard that pushing increases saturation while pulling lowers saturation, however, I've never heard anyone talk about a cool/warm shift as being an effect of push/pull processing.  I know you're working with some excellent DP's, Max, is this wisdom passed down from one of them?  Anyone else familiar with this?

 

I got that info from a Kodak lecture, where they screend prints and also showed the graphs of push/pull.

 

I have never really worked with a Dop who pushed or pulled the filmstock regularly. The only times when I've seen it done is to gain an extra stop.

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