Cross Processing S16mm 50D

Rob Webster · February 27, 2009

Hey Guys,

I am a second year film student at the Arts' Institute at Bournemouth, specialising in cinematography. We have a production coming up where i have been considering cross processing colour reversal in ECN-2, but we don't really have the budget or time to do extensive tests. I'm assuming the process will wield varying results with different stocks but as i say we are probably restricted to testing old vision 2 7218, 7205 or 7217 if at all.

These tests will be largely pointless because i really want to shoot exteriors on 50D, so my question is has anyone tried this (or the equivalent 35mm), or tested anything similar, or have any tips for exposure, examples etc?

Thanks,

Robin

K Borowski · February 27, 2009

Couldn't find ECN-2 in E-6 chemistry, as I assume you want. But, with a popular internet search-engine querying "C-41 in E-6", I was able to find this:

http://www.squarefrog.co.uk/holga-techniques-xpro.html

From what I've seen, you'll get a weird bluish-purplish color tint on the negative (I think this is an inverted orange mask), correspondingly wacky colors, and reversal-like high-contrast.

You are going to need to test no matter what, due to potential changes in speed, so if you can't scrape enough money to do at least some sort of test (maybe even ECN-2 in a stills camera processed at a cooperative slide lab), why bother gambling?

This is just speculation, but I'd hazard a bet that you'll get reversal-like decreases in latitude with this process too, so proper exposure becomes even more important, and testing becomes even more vital.

K Borowski · February 27, 2009

Sorry, chalk that up to dislexia please. You want to do it the other way around.

Again, couldn't' find ECN-2, but C-41 will give you a rough idea. . .

http://www.betterphoto.com/forms/QnAdetail...?threadID=16688

Sorry, no photo examples with this one.

You'll get pretty much the opposite of everything I said in my prior post: low contrast, increased latitude, possible speed change (probably slower; still need to test), and from what I gleam from a quick search fog.

What stock are you using, Fuji?

Rob Webster · February 27, 2009

Couldn't find ECN-2 in E-6 chemistry, as I assume you want. But, with a popular internet search-engine querying "C-41 in E-6", I was able to find this:

http://www.squarefrog.co.uk/holga-techniques-xpro.html

From what I've seen, you'll get a weird bluish-purplish color tint on the negative (I think this is an inverted orange mask), correspondingly wacky colors, and reversal-like high-contrast.

You are going to need to test no matter what, due to potential changes in speed, so if you can't scrape enough money to do at least some sort of test (maybe even ECN-2 in a stills camera processed at a cooperative slide lab), why bother gambling?

This is just speculation, but I'd hazard a bet that you'll get reversal-like decreases in latitude with this process too, so proper exposure becomes even more important, and testing becomes even more vital.

Thanks Karl, i'm pretty sure Newton Thomas Sigel processed kodak reversal in ECN-2 for Three Kings but i could be mistaken. The kodak reversal 7285 isn't too temperamental with exposure as far as i know, but i'm gonna try and get my hands on a S/E and test a bit now anyway if i can.

David Rakoczy · February 27, 2009

I really like 7285. It is a GREAT Stock. Maybe a touch more temperamental with regard to exposure latitude... just evaluate your readings carefully and nail your exposure. 85 looks very very sharp normal and crossed processed... very sharp.

Karl, you should be working in a Lab! ;)

K Borowski · February 27, 2009

Thanks Karl, i'm pretty sure Newton Thomas Sigel processed kodak reversal in ECN-2 for Three Kings but i could be mistaken. The kodak reversal 7285 isn't too temperamental with exposure as far as i know, but i'm gonna try and get my hands on a S/E and test a bit now anyway if i can.

Well, if you are shooting 7285, all you need to do is find a movie lab that'll process short lengths of E-6 and you can just shoot "5085"/E100VS slide film in an SLR.

The stocks are essentially the same. That's a 100-speed stock though.. Fuji is/was making, I think, a film called Velvia 50D in 16mm or some third party was cutting it down for them, so I just assumed that is the film you were referring to.

So, figure $20 for a test. Your production ought be able to afford that easily.

K Borowski · February 27, 2009

Karl, you should be working in a Lab! ;)

David, I've been trying recently, and on and off since way back when I was 15 or 16 to find work at a lab. I have the distinct feeling, unfortunately, that I come across as "over-qualified" for the job.

Seems like a lot of lab-owners want a supplicant that will just shut up and stir chemicals for minimum wage. A lot of labs I've gone to probably would rather that *I* drink a 40-L kit of chemicals than mix one.

Maybe Dominic could give me a job, but I don't know if I'm ready to travel 9,980 3/8 mi away from NY when prosumer-HD movies are getting "best cinematography" nods B)

Dominic Case · March 2, 2009

Maybe Dominic could give me a job

Hah! Not any more, as I'm no longer working at a lab.

just shut up and stir chemicals for minimum wage

To be blunt, that is about the strength of it. The per-foot prices that labs charge for processing won't really allow anything more than the minimum wage - and chemical mixing and processing jobs are, frankly, boring repetitive jobs that I suspect wouldn't suit you for very long, Karl.

And unless it's a one or two man business, the person processing the film won't know much about the results of cross-processing. Larger labs will have a client contact person who is well-informed and able to advise on all of this (though not all of them can). They don't necessarily have much hands-on experience (if any) at mixing chemicals in the lab, though a lot of the very best have messed about extensively in a darkroom at home.

That might be a better bet for you - but these days, it's not only "best cinematography" awards that go to prosumer HD camera shows, it's also most of the rest. So jobs for film specialists in labs probably won't coma around too often any more.