Matt Wells Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 The above is a super8 frame of 7217 vision2 200T negative. Had a call from my Telecine guy yesterday "The 16mm you gave me [the 7212 100T] that looks great, but the Super8 - there seems to be a serious problem - blue marks for pretty much the duration of the 400ft." I go down and we examined the footage - Basically there are all these blue marks, a wide one continiously weaves in and out every other second (about) on the right, and the second are continious blue "scratches" that are on the left half of the frame. In examining the negative with a magnifing glass the marks can be seen clearly too. The camera was my recently overhauled (by Bjorn Andersson in Sweden) 4008ZM which has previously performed fine with K40 as well as Vision negative. All of this 400ft is either Vision2 200T or V2 500T, all processed and prepped for telecine at the same time by Andec in Berlin. Have a look at the frame I have posted. The blue mark on the right is the one that weaves around on and off the frame, and on the left are some more continious lines, again blue. I would be most grateful for some input. My personal feeling is that this is a processing problem. When I look at the negative the marks look "liquid" The whole situation is made worse because the footage is of a friends wedding I had agreed to film - and other than the marks I am really pleased with the results, especially some stuff in very low light with the 500. Cheers, Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy Sparaco Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 (edited) Looks like processing. A light leak would be orange. I have been skeptical of Super 8 negative processing since negative MP processing machines are set-up for 35/16mm. Did you have it processed here? European Facility: Pro8mm Ltd., Grafton House, 2/3 Golden Square, 2nd Flr. London W1F 9HR, UK tel. 020-7439-7008 fax. 020-7734-5193 europe@pro8mm.com If not you might ask them for their opinion. My professional advice is to never do weddings. You loose friends and every possible problem or mistake will gather around even the most experienced shooter like vultures above a corpse. Edited December 20, 2004 by Andy Sparaco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Wells Posted December 20, 2004 Author Share Posted December 20, 2004 My professional advice is to never do weddings. You loose friends and every possible problem or mistake will gather around even the most experienced shooter like vultures above a corpse. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks for the advice - I will certainly follow it. Cheers Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidSloan Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 This is a question for Mr. Case. I would suggest PMing him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominic Case Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 This is a question for Mr. Case. I would suggest PMing him. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Already replied . . . to the same thread in Film Stocks and Processing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Greg Gross Posted December 21, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 21, 2004 Matt, You are correct it is a classic processing problem of the film. Do you know what caused it? If you can shoot a wedding partner,you can shoot anything. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Greg Gross Posted December 21, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 21, 2004 Matt, I think the film was processed via the "roller transport" method, this involves little hadling of the film. If the processor is not cleaned at decent intervals and well maintained,you can experience all sorts of problems. Such as color shifts and scratches. Lets see what Mr. Case says. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Greg Gross Posted December 21, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 21, 2004 Matt, I'm presently 56 yrs. old now. Once when I was a young wedding photog- rapher I sent some film to be processed from a wedding shoot. PP&L, Penn- sylvania Power and Light Company had a scheduled power off time for the day and the processing lab was not aware of it. My film started on its way in the processor and low in behold the power shut off. Well the lab was act- ually afraid to call me and tell me and they stalled around for quite some time. You would never believe how many free rolls of film I got from that mess up. You can imagine what the negatives looked like after the machine started up and shut down several times in a row. Out of about 350 shots I managed to salvage about 60 some shots. I just fessed up to my client and simply told them the truth and gave them 60 great shots free of charge. The only way to shoot weddings is to plan your shots,have a contract with the spec- ified shots,services defined. Add a clause for circumstances beyond your con- trol defining the course of action to be taken. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Wells Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 Matt,I'm presently 56 yrs. old now. Once when I was a young wedding photog- rapher I sent some film to be processed from a wedding shoot. PP&L, Penn- sylvania Power and Light Company had a scheduled power off time for the day and the processing lab was not aware of it. My film started on its way in the processor and low in behold the power shut off. Well the lab was act- ually afraid to call me and tell me and they stalled around for quite some time. You would never believe how many free rolls of film I got from that mess up. You can imagine what the negatives looked like after the machine started up and shut down several times in a row. Out of about 350 shots I managed to salvage about 60 some shots. I just fessed up to my client and simply told them the truth and gave them 60 great shots free of charge. The only way to shoot weddings is to plan your shots,have a contract with the spec- ified shots,services defined. Add a clause for circumstances beyond your con- trol defining the course of action to be taken. Greg <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks for that - I don't think I would ever want to shoot weddings professionally - just a total nightmare responsibility - the stuff above was for free for a friend so they can't really complain. Matt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Wells Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 (edited) Just received a response from the lab - they tell me it is a processing fault. There were a couple of days when something was not right with the machine. For a bit more detail: A reel before developer has partially blocked and causes pressure exposure (blue strikes on the film). It was only to seen in Video, not clearly on the negatives. So we dont know, how many films are with that problems. is an excerpt from an e-mail from the Lab. The is good news, because at least I now know the camera is OK, and I'm planning to use it over Christmas. Matt Edited December 21, 2004 by Matt Wells Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Greg Gross Posted December 21, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 21, 2004 Matt, Just tell them to clean the god**** processor! MERRY XMAS, Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riku Naskali Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 By the way, is the Vision2 200T really that grainy in super8 :blink: ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member John Pytlak RIP Posted December 21, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted December 21, 2004 The image strikes me as a bit underexposed, which would accentuate the graininess. What was the exposure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominic Case Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 It was only to seen in Video, not clearly on the negatives. Nah! They might have trouble seeing the marks on an exposed negative (such as yours) but I'm sure they would show up easily on a proper scratch test (clear film that should be run through the machine before each day's work). I hope you get fair recompense, though it's normally (and fairly) limited to replaced stock and no charge for the processing. The is good news, That's a really positive attitude to the situation you are in. I hope your newly-married friends are as understanding. Merry Christmas! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Wells Posted December 22, 2004 Author Share Posted December 22, 2004 (edited) By the way, is the Vision2 200T really that grainy in super8 :blink: ? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Not it is not that grainy - but the still is heavily compressed. The grain is not as bad as some make out - although I think that the 7218 is where the real improvement has come in terms of grain - it is not all that grainer than the 7217, which makes the 18 a really versative stock. Of course there is grain, but then this is Super8 :D John - I can't remember the exposue - I would have taken a quick incident reading, but I made no notes. Shortly after this point I locked my keys in the car, and had to break in - everything was rather manic. Cheers, Matt Edited December 22, 2004 by Matt Wells Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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