Brian Drysdale

Just bought an Arri BL 16. I'm an Editor who just wants to get a closer understanding of film, so I don't plan on doing any serious projects. However, I would't want a crappy tripod that I would want to throw in the river everytime I used it. Anyone have a recommendation for a good tripod reasonably priced (used,new, whatever)? I would prefer to spend around $500 dollars, but could probably talked into something around $750.

 

Thanks for any help.

Christian

Any tripod that can handle a Betacam will be suitable for the Arri 16BL. At the money you've got available a good used one would be the best option. One of the older tripods that are "too heavy" would be a good buy, they're usually well engineered and can last a life time if well maintained.

It requires Vigilance as the former Attorney General liked to say.

 

Well I've done DTS in 16mm, that worked :) (not mass distributable......)

 

16mm projection seems like a sidetrack from the issues here..

 

-Sam

Interesting about the DTS.

Agree about the 16mm projection being a side track in this thread.

I've seen 16mm projected on ~ 32' screen which looked quite good. Depends on the projector, optics etc.

 

The largest I've seen my prints was about 25' - I was quite happy. The *sharpest* projection of one of my prints I've seen was with an Eastman 25 and a hand picked ISCO lens. This was 20' wide or so but I had the feeling there was room to expand :)

 

The *big* advantage of 35mm projection in comparison and this would include 16/S16 blowups is even illumination across the screen and edge to edge sharpness.

 

-Sam

The projector is the key, but how often do you get high quality 16mm projection with a great lens? I've been at a number of film festivals where you can see the drop in quality straight away (even on a smaller picture) compared to the blow ups.

However, the biggest problem with projecting 16mm is the quality of the optical sound.

Well, as somebody who's watched movies for 46-years and still has good far sightedness, I can only say that I've seen great stuff on a 30' screen shot on 16mm, especially super16.

 

.

A 16mm print projected onto a 30ft screen doesn't look good.

A Super 16 print blown up to 35mm looks good when projected 30 ft wide. Assuming equal quality at the lab a standard 16mm blow up won't be quite so good. However, a film shot on 35mm will look much better.

Just a quick question - who among the posters in this thread has actually shot 35mm film and | or been in a telecine transfer with one of the big 10 post houses.

 

Just a yes | no answer please

 

One of the problems | advantages of the internet is the level playing field :)

 

thanks

 

Rolfe

I've shot 35mm, with transfers in London and Dublin.

Hi all,

 

Thanks for all your replies!!

 

It seems that there's a multitude of people's preferences (as usual!! ;) ), I'm going to be doing some tests in the new year, having briefly looked at scrims, just to add further confusion for me ;) there seems to be loads of different types.

 

Is there a bog standard type of scrim that I can pick up when I get the lights, that will enable me to try out various ideas and suggestions, or will I need a selection of different types.

 

Thanks again everyone!!

 

Matt

A new Redhead kit usually comes with two densities of full scrims, plus the same in half scrims (covers half the lamp face). This is really only a set of scrims for one light head, check with the people who are supplying the lights what they have available and take all the different types and test them.

Look at the online Matthews catalogue, they have a full range of scrims (lots of other stuff as well) and you can see the different types. Interesting how terms vary, because what is described by most people as scrims (and the people here) is described as wire diffusion by Matthews. They call nets scrims.

If you dont have a Genny or access to more than one circut I would recomend getting an assortment of bulb wattages. 2000w is basicly your max so you cant have every light on one circut. If you put a 200w bulb in the redheads, you save power, so all lights can go at the same time, you cut light without using either ND or scrim and you reduce heat in the working environment (something everyone will thank you for) I hate using ND or scrims unless nessicary. I can look at a light and tell what bulb needs to go in it to bring it into value. then I use a half scrim or move the light back to fine tune it.

The Redhead is designed to run 800 watt 240V and if I recall 1000w 120v lamps (I believe there used to be a 30V bulb). If you want to change wattages get a range of different wattage lights, not bulbs. A good lighting kit will have a range of different wattage and types of lighting units. I suspect you'll run into difficulty sourcing smaller wattage bulbs that'll fit the Redheads and changing hot bulbs as you want to set your lighting levels doesn't bear thinking about. Changing bulbs when they blow is bad enough, it always slows things down.

The power is more of an issue in the US, in the UK you can run 3 Redheads of a standard 13 Amp mains socket no bother, I've had 4 on occasions.

You can move your lights back, but it's not always possible and moving the light out of a closer position will change your lighting effect.

A common method is to put a larger light than you need then scrim or ND it down, then you won't need to change lights if it's not powerful enough. That's the American method. In Europe we just put the right lamp up in the first place (of course). ;-)

I generally just use scrims. I'd make sure you have a good ample scrim pack with each head.

Both methods work, although not too many lighting kits here have scrims, you'd have to ask for them. Interesting to know if they're used more in the USA than in Europe.

Gels have the advantage that they can be used on any light, although once you start getting a filter pack of diffusion and various gels they tend to overheat.

Well, that's an iffy title!

 

Basically I would like to know, what the best way is to reduce the light coming from a plamp without using a dimmer.

 

E.G.

 

If I'm working with a kit consiting of 4 x 800w redheads and I want to get different levels of light from them, is it best that I use ND gels or scrims?

 

I understand how ND's work, haven't come into contact with scrims yet, although I've read a bit about them.

 

Cheers :)

 

Matt

Usually I just use the ND gels. You can change them much quicker than the scrims, which I'd use as a first base then add the NDs. The problem with the ND is that they tend to fade and discolour. The Redhead kits usually has scrims, so best way is to have a play.

You are absolutely right. Unfortunately in my country there are no such workshops. I am asking people in our film industry to show me and they are doing it when they have the time. I also go to the hiring equipment place and do lots of tests with the camera and a monitor. I still wish to read the theory to understand it better. I don't really have a choice... Thanks for your help

Yaron

Look at the Paul Wheeler book "Digital Cinematography" it goes through the 790.

This is exactly why I want to learn the theory of the color matrix and the impact it has on the picture. I saw other people work with it and getting beutiful resolts! So, again, if some one knows of good web pages to learn about it I will apritiate it a lot. Thanks

It sounds like you should go on a workshop where you can experiment with an instructor. You also need to understand waveform monitors and vectorscopes, it's more than a few web pages.

Wow, thanks for the replys fellas. Yeah, I know i need a lens with a reflex side finder, i was just wondering what these "TVZOOMS" were about, thanks alot Brian. Do you have any recomendations on where to find a c-mount lens w/reflex finder (older preferably) I have been searching, but i can't find one online, well, not with a pic to show what it looks like anyway.

These lenses are going to be old. I expect you'll find the odd one coming up on e-bay, however you really want to see the lens before buying it. You could check second hand camera shops in places like New York and LA and let them know you're interested in one of these lenses. Some of these specialize in older 16mm cameras. You could put an ad in some web sites.

The current HD cameras basically seem to come down to either capturing data for grading in post or creating the "look" inside the production camera. Whichever method is used this thread reinforces the need to go through the entire workflow including a final 35mm print. There are variables at each stage, even running a graded internegative for projection prints through a telecine can involve a near complete re-grade for video. It's not always a single setting and letting it run.

You can always add grain in post production, if you wish.

At the moment it doesn't look as good as the real thing.

These formats are tools to tell stories, you pick the one that gives you the best way to tell the story that your budget allows. It might be DV or it might 65mm film, this is part of the creative process.

To me, as a person who spends more than half of the time doing post production, "cleaner" is always a good thing. "Flat" and "neutral" is also a good thing.

 

Why?? Simply because you can always degrade the techical quality, by adding grain/noise, increasing contrast, blurring etc. Removing grain, de-blurring, or trying to rescue details from crushed blacks is much harder...

 

Simply put, neutral, grainless, low contrast image can be manipulated to look like pretty much anything - but it's an one way street. Think of the law of entropia ;-)

If you're going a gritty drama you may not want clean. The BBC person's concern was that they'd lose that sense of a rough world. HD can look extremely clean; it's how to develop a new look for these dramas using the new format that he was concerned about. BBC drama has always had a different look to the 35mm American dramas. Also, grain is good for some subjects.

i am looking for a c-mount to go with my 16mm auricon. On ebay i have found several "TV zoom" lenses. What is the difference with these lenses? Will they work on my camera? I ask because when i read the words TV zoom, i imeditialy assume that they are for a studio video camera,

 

please help...

I suspect most of these are for use on old B & W non broadcast standard TV cameras or CCTV. With the Auricon you need a zoom lens with a built in viewfinder. The Auricon is a non reflex camera like the early CP16s. A commonly used lens is the 12mm to 120mm Angenieux, but there are other makes with a built viewfinder.

The TV zoom lenses were intended to be used on B & W TV cameras, so wouldn't have the same standard of correction as the film camera lenses, which were used to shoot colour.

Economics are going to drive the conversion of the cinemas to digital projection. There are committees discussing the standards and these won't be as cheap as running 35mm film projectors (with the odd sound upgrade). If people are paying they'll want a standard a lot higher that they can experience in their own homes. Good enough is the wow factor at any given time. The saving comes in not having to transport the film prints.

The issue is what the image looks like on a 30ft or 40ft screen. 16mm looks good projected onto a 10ft screen, not so hot on a 30ft wide screen.

There is an aesthetic to this. Why do musicians still use valves in their guitar amps? Answer is gives a warmer sound. Film looks different to HD or video formats, so you use can use the different "looks" as required. I had a conversation with a manager in BBC drama who said they were concerned about the cleaner look that HD gives compared to Super16.

In PAL you can tell the difference between 4.1.1 and 4.2.2, the colours tend to be more blocky with the former and not as smooth. When you shoot the master material, you use the best quality format that you can afford (it'll degrade as you go down the distribution chain) and gives the overall aesthetic look you want. I know people who sometimes shoot on Super 8; they also have cut it into 35mm because that's the way they want to tell their story.

As regards the funding homeless etc., there are debates to be had on the question if governments should be spending so much on arms etc. Shooting film on 35mm as against HD is petty cash at these levels and doesn't raise the same moral issues. On a large Hollywod studio feature film the film stock is one of the cheaper items. Perhaps you ask why the stars get paid so much.

The only way to see how HDV performs projected on 35mm is to shoot a test. You'll soon see where is works and where is falls apart. I suspect it may be like Super 16 in some aspects, better at closer shots and not so good at landscapes. The smaller number of CCD pixels in the HDV cameras are always going to limit their resolution compared to the high end HD cameras with better optics.

I was wondering if anybody knows of a website that you can read or download instructional manuals for digital cameras like the Sony MPEG IMX cameras, or digibeta cameras(SONY, JVC, Panasonic)

Sony camera manuals at http://www.sonybiz.net/ They're often found in the support sections for each camera. These are the PAL versions but you can find manuals at the US sites as well. Also at

http://panasonic-broadcast.com/index.cfm? also at http://www.panasonic.com/business/provideo..._camcorders.asp

Hi

I have just started to work with the beta 970 and 790. I would like to know of web sites to look for information about the manuals - aspatialy the meaning of the deferent parameters and aspatialy working with the color matrix.

thanks a lot

Yaron

I haven't managed to find the DVW 970 manual yet, but you can get other Sony camera manuals at http://www.sonybiz.net/ They're often found in the support sections for each camera. These are the PAL versions but you can find manuals at the US sites as well.

Does anyone know much about the repair of Betacam SP cameras?

The camera records fine and plays back with a good image quality. Though increasingly the warning light at the back flashes, and "humid" comes up on the LCD screen. The camera has been stored perfectly - when the warning light starts up, the camera wont let you record, it locks you out.

Anyone with any informed guess as to whats up with it?

Could be a faulty sensor. I've only had that warning come on in extremely wet conditions with condensation.

Recently I've been reading the Goodmans Guide and learned that if you use the filmlike gamma settings you will achieve more tonal graduations. Therefore, I used this gamma curve and got muddy, soft looking video. It seems as though the image is out of focus and the movement is blured. It also appears that color saturation and hue reproduction is poor. (The shot settings, factory defaults - except gamma curve was set to Filmlike 1 - 60i, v. res: interlace, 4:3, DV50). Any tips? Has anyone else observed this problem? What is the trick to get good looking video with a wide range of tonal graduations?

 

Thank You,

adubbs

I've used the filmlike setting shooting at 25p and it was fine. Are you sure the menu wasn't accidently left on a progressive frame setting with the shutter off? I've noticed you have to check and recheck these things and sometimes you discover they're not as you believe they should be. I know one of my menu settings changed from the original on one shoot.

The colours weren't that bright - more Agfa than Kodak or Fuji.

Wouldn't the resulting footage be 60 frames over the course of 1/2 a second, somewhat distorting time? Maybe not the best practice for scientific condition, but fine for narratives? Or am I missing something. Keep in mind I haven't shot with the cinealta

The 60 frames playback at normal speed (24, 25, 30 etc), so you get slow motion. You have less vertical resolution, but most people don't seem to notice this. It's been used in narrative films. However, you need to becareful with regards the subject's angle to the camera. It seems to work best if it's either moving across the frame or towards the camera.

I have tried flicking both the red run/stop button on the back as well as the button on the pistol grip and neither seems to have any affect on the cameras movements.

 

Is it possible that this is a result of a battery issue? Or is the camera likely screwed?

 

Ed

You have to check faults by removing the possible causes one at a time. At the moment you need to know if the camera runs correctly when it's supplied with power from a battery that's known to be in a good charged condition.

Another option is to take it to a good electronics workshop and let them check it with a 20V power supply. However, check that they connect it correctly, since I don't think the batteries are marked + & - on their cases (at least I can't remember if they are).

It's possible the camera may have a couple of faults, but the red light remaining on is caused by a low battery.

Another point is that to run quietly the CP16 needs regular servicing; they get noisy unless correctly lubricated.

Hello Everyone,

 

I want to know that there is any option in HD cameras for High Speed shooting??

If not did it manage well in post :ph34r: ??

 

Thanks

 

Ahsan

You can shoot up 60 fps with the Varicam or for even faster frame rates there's the Cine Speedcam at up to 1000 fps HD. http://www.cine-speedcam.com/

You can get 60fps from the F900 by shooting 60i and then converting the fields into progressive frames in post.

I charged the batteries overnight and one of them appears to be virtually dead (contrary to the auction). When I place the good battery battery inside the camera, it starts to run at any speed EXCEPT 24 whether or not the red button is set to run or stop. And 24 will still NOT run when the red button is set to run.

 

Has anyone heard of it doing this? While I am new to 16mm cameras I'm sure this isn't right. Could it be a power issue?

 

The battery test indicator shows that one of the batteries has about a 75% charge (it displays this whether I push the battery test button or not) and the other reads as having no charge (though the camera starts to spin at ANY speed briefly when I put the battery in).

 

Does any one know where I can find a manual online? I tried goolgling without success.

Any help would be appreciated.

 

Ed

Sounds like your batteries need re-celled. It's only to be expected if they've not been used for some time. There are companies that replace the cells inside camera batteries. Check out Whitehouse A.V.

I've never seen a manual for a CP16R, learning these older cameras was always a word of mouth thing. The most you got was the threading diagram. The "Professional Cameraman's Handbook" has info on the CP16.