Lightmeter recommendations

[Antoine Pret]

Hi all,

I want to upgrade my trusty Minolta IIIF to a meter with both incident & spot meter all in one.
The use is for Super 16mm film work and stay with it for a while !

I have narrowed it down to :

The Sekonic L-508 ( not the cine version)

• The spot meter is 1 to 4 degree but it has no viewfinder reading.
• The incident hemisphere can be retracted to get a flat reading.
• It's around 350 to 400€ used

The Minolta Flash Meter VI (also under the Kenko 2100 name)

• The spot meter is a 1 degree, with viewfinder reading.
• It's around 270 - 300€ used.
• The hemisphere can't be retracted.

Will I be missing some features with one of those meters for cinematography work ?
What seems to be the best buy in the long run ?

And also do they need to be sent for calibration or it can be done by the user ?

Thank you 

[Eric Eader]

Antoine,

You have asked a question no one really wants to answer.

A light meter falls under the category of personal use/work method preference.

But I have to ask this:  If this meter is to be dedicated to 16mm motion picture making, why metaphorically shoot yourself in the foot by using a still photography meter?  A cine meter makes calculations in moving picture terms as opposed to still terms.  And that is quicker, with less room for error.

Now, as to types:  If you are set on 2 in 1 method of operation, then I would recommend the Sekonic L-758cine, rather than later touch screen models. (Touch screens are more prone to accidental change). But that is a preference thing.  Also, I recommend buying it new---- problems are covered by warranty.

Old Spectra meters can be gotten for very little outlay,  but will most emphatically need re-calibration.  You won't work with a camera that runs @ 24fps for 3minutes, then 26fps for 1minute, and settles on 22fps for the rest of the take...  will you?  Remember a meter must read accurately over the full range of lighting:  from dark to bright.

 Choosing Spectra meters with slides means getting as many slides as they make calibrated to your meter then keeping the most used together and seldom-used close by.  (Push processing--slow motion, etc.). (Direct readout easily viewed).  Don't have to worry about non-standard batteries like with their  excellent later models.

Pentax and Minolta made excellent spot meters and may be faster in use than newer combo models as there is no readjustment from Incident to Spot reading.   That is a personal choice you have to make.      When you need a "spot"  reading, narrower is better. (IMHO).  (Although, 2 meters do take up more room).

In the excellent movie "Nijinsky,"  Serge Diaghilev asks a friend "Who is the most expensive mistress?"  His friend named the most fashionable lady of the city to which Diaghilev responded, "No, ART is the most expensive mistress."  

There is no getting around it, film costs money.

If you make the move to Canada you will be that much closer to Hollywood (Spectra), or New York City thereby saving on shipping costs.  Maybe Toronto has a meter repair shop somewhere.

Hope this helps, and Good Luck.

 

[Antoine Pret]

Thank you Eric for the detailed answer !

The reason I chose those two is mainly because it is in my budget and I wanted to know what will I miss by using them instead of a cine version. 

I came across a post on this forum stating that the Minolta VI was good for cinematography, but this was back in 2007 even though I don't think a lot changed since in this regard.

The manual of both meters states that you can choose FPS, shutter angle, make film speed adjustments, combining spot & incident metering, averaging measures... What more is needed ?

Now, If getting a used late 90s/00s lightmeter for this price means a recalibration is needed then yes, maybe I should wait until I can affrod the L-758C !

Edited September 18, 2023 by Antoine Pret

[Adrian Sierkowski]

I have a 508 zoom spot and it is fine; though I have found that you need to hold the read button in for a few moments to get the actual reading. it reads true compared to my Minolta IVf and 758. As long as you're not getting whacky with shutter angle or high fps, the non-cine will be fine. Personally I do a lot of those type of calculations in my head. I would recommend the 758 overall, but starting on a 508 and keeping it around as a back up isn't a bad idea. I would send any used meter to be calibrated though.

I much dislike the 858 touch screen. EVERYTHING took longer to do on it vs the old scroll wheel.

[Antoine Pret]

1 hour ago, Adrian Sierkowski said:

I have a 508 zoom spot and it is fine; though I have found that you need to hold the read button in for a few moments to get the actual reading. it reads true compared to my Minolta IVf and 758. As long as you're not getting whacky with shutter angle or high fps, the non-cine will be fine. Personally I do a lot of those type of calculations in my head. I would recommend the 758 overall, but starting on a 508 and keeping it around as a back up isn't a bad idea. I would send any used meter to be calibrated though.

I much dislike the 858 touch screen. EVERYTHING took longer to do on it vs the old scroll wheel.

That's what I was thinking. I mean, besides metering with footcandles they seem fine. Shutter speed to angle is no problem.
I saw that you can approximately calibrate a meter yourself with greycard or with the sunny16 rule and the user compensation button. It might not be the best but I can't seem to find anyone calibrating meters in Europe ??

Also, is the flat diffuser something essential to have in a light meter ? Again thanks for the answers...

Edited September 18, 2023 by Antoine Pret

[Eric Eader]

Antoine,

Sorry, I didn't realize your meter had that much cine capability.  Many don't.  I used to have a Minolta IVf which had flash reading capability for stills, and I do not remember whether it had Cine or not.  

A footcandle reading is fundamental building block.  It tells you the actual intensity of light incident on your subject (in a standardized/recognized unit).  Kodak says how many footcandles are necessary (they recommend), for exposure at any given fstop for any particular film.   In a way, it's more of a gaffer thing.

Your cine meter will take that unit and indicate the appropriate fstop for the measured footcandles relative to ISO, shutter angle/shutter speed, i.e.  an exposure reading.

By way of comparison,  a spot meter takes a footlambert reading (the intensity of reflected light, a standardized unit), and integrates ISO, angle/speed for exposure recommendation.     (Some meters only read footlamberts but aren't usually seen on a film set).

Online there are plenty of footcandle related items to read/view,  but old geezer that I am, I will go out on a limb and recommend Joseph Mascelli's  "Cine Workbook"  Be sure it contains both books: Text and Tools.  He edited the first ASC manual way back when --1960's, not to mention, wrote the classic: "5 C's of Cinematography."

Once again, hope this helps.

Oh, yeah,  have somebody standing by with oxygen and heart defibrillator when you read the price for the Sekonic C800U Spectrometer.  ??

 

 

[Adrian Sierkowski]

The flat diffuser helps but isn't really all that necessary I find. Generally I'll cup my hand behind the lumisphere to shield ambient light and get a more directional reading. 

 

The IVF has cine, you just have to cycle through all the shutter speeds to get to them. I think it's 8fps though something like 175fps, though may be 360 fps, I haven't changed mine from 24 in a long long while since most of my work is on digital these days.