Genesis Questions

February 12, 2006

Okay, I'll bite. You're a skeptical old scumbag curmudgeon, with a history of despising all things Panavision (I added the last part). The fact that the studio doesn't want to release images from Superman Returns has nothing to do with what it was shot on and everything to do with protecting their potential franchise restarter. "Any" publicity is not necessarily good if it reveals more than they want to reveal. From everything I've heard (I know some of the VFX people) they are quite proud of the imagery and very happy with the results they got.

"(I added the last part)."

Exactly correct; YOU added the last part.

I don't despise "all things Panavision", far from it; just their present (and recently departed) management's continual obsession with this Digital Cinematography rubbish.

I suppose I'm badly hampered by having a proper technical background and 25 years' experience with broadcast video, and hence possibly know what I'm talking about, and so aren't likely to fit in here but those are just my issues. I've always thought Panavision's film cameras and lenses were first class, and that they should stick to what they know. As for the Digital Cinematography thing, I've been hearing much the same crap for over 20 years.

"The fact that the studio doesn't want to release images from Superman Returns has nothing to do with what it was shot on and everything to do with protecting their potential franchise restarter. "

Yeah, yeah; I've heard that line so many times I begin to wonder if some of you guys haven't got a hotkey on your computer that inserts it automatically. It's one of those "explains everything and explains nothing" standbys, like "Proprietary Technology" . It's so wet you should consider patenting it as a firefighting material.

Just for interest's sake, what "potential franchise restarter" do you think applies to Flyboys or Apocalypto?

Maybe some big toy companies will be interested.

David Mullen ASC · February 12, 2006

I'm not sure what you're even asking Panavision to do, since they don't own any footage from "Flyboys" or "Apocalypto" (which is in the middle of their shoot.) And even if they did get some footage, the most they could do is screen it at their facilities (like they do with the low-rez DVD trailer for "Flyboys") -- it's not like they are going to run TV commercials to sell the Genesis.

I'm sure there will be theatrical trailers showing plenty of footage of all these Genesis movies as the time gets closer to the release date.

In the meanwhile, considering that all the Genesis cameras are being rented out continuously, I don't see why Panavision needs to spend much money on promotion for the Genesis.

It doesn't ultimately matter whether any camera company hides footage from their cameras or doesn't -- because ultimately the people using these cameras will find out soon enough. We've all seen enough Sony F900 photography to sink a boat and we'll see plenty of Genesis footage to form an opinion soon enough, so I don't understand why you keep implying that Panavision is trying to hide something when you'll soon have some major features shot with the Genesis being seen by MILLIONS of people. It's strengths and flaws will be pretty obvious on a 50' screen. So is Panavision "hiding" behind possibly the biggest release of 2006???

Also, Panavision is still primarily a film camera company; I think they would like nothing more than if nobody noticed that "Superman Returns" was shot digitally. They might consider it some sort of accomplishment if the first major use of the Genesis went by unnoticed by most people.

February 12, 2006

The trailer downloaded just fine. Its interesting to watch even at 480p size. Some fire / bright daylight etc.

-k

February 14, 2006

I'm not sure what you're even asking Panavision to do, since they don't own any footage from "Flyboys" or "Apocalypto" (which is in the middle of their shoot.)

I'm not asking them to do anything. I'm wondering why nearly two years after the Genesis was announced I still haven't seen any meaningful footage. It might all make sense to you, but I'm not you.

And before you accuse me of Pana-Bashing, I've said exactly the same things about the D-20 and the Dalsa.

They might consider it some sort of accomplishment if the first major use of the Genesis went by unnoticed by most people.

I don't think they have too much to worry about there!

The trailer downloaded just fine. Its interesting to watch even at 480p size. Some fire / bright daylight etc.

-k

Yes I got to work eventually, but what I saw didn't tell me a lot except that it still looks like video.

What do you mean by "interesting"? You can always get video cameras to WORK, it's how much trouble you have to go to to do it.

Michael Most · February 14, 2006

I'm not asking them to do anything. I'm wondering why nearly two years after the Genesis was announced I still haven't seen any meaningful footage. It might all make sense to you, but I'm not you.

Jim what is your problem? Projects shot with these cameras haven't been released yet, so what the hell are you wondering about? David just reiterated that it's not up to the camera suppliers to show you footage that they don't own. I'm sure the studios are not sitting around saying "boy, we'd better release these pictures right away or Jim Murdoch will think there's a conspiracy to protect these unreleasable images and save our collective butts." Geez.

I've always thought Panavision's film cameras and lenses were first class, and that they should stick to what they know.

Yup, there's a great business plan. Stick with traditional technology that is likely, at the very least, to find reduced use in the future, and ignore technology which will likely supplant it as time goes on, simply because you have less experience with it. That's a great way to sustain a business and build for the future. I guess post houses shouldn't bother with data based workflows or DI installations for the same reasons. And auto manufacturers shouldn't put any money into alternative fuels or powerplants because they have so much more experience with gas guzzling internal combustion engines.

There's a future beyond film capture out there. Panavision and other companies see this. It's a pity you don't.

February 16, 2006

Yes I got to work eventually, but what I saw didn't tell me a lot except that it still looks like video.
What do you mean by "interesting"? You can always get video cameras to WORK, it's how much trouble you have to go to to do it.

Well "interesting" in that it was not some 90% greenscreen / FX movie and that you had some "realworld" footage in it. I agree that I also noticed a video feeling with the images but I could not really get what it was (well, some of the fire looked a bit unnatural). Of course it does not tell us how much (if any) trouble they had getting there, but unless you are used to trailers with audio commentary of the DOP, I wonder what you expected...

-k

Elhanan Matos · February 17, 2006

I heard Click was also shot on the Genesis. You can download the 1080P trailer of Click on apple.com.

Robert Sanders · February 17, 2006

Makes me wonder what specifically makes it "feel" like video? Because there's nothing there that tips it off to me. I often wonder if it simply isn't preconceived prejudices going into it before hand -- "I *know* this is video so I'm going to look real hard for the signs!"