Noisy Dub

[barryagilbert]

I just telecined some 35mm to D5 and got a mini DV dub to import into FCP4 to do an offline. Upon reviewing the mini dv footage, it's very noisey noisy -

 

Before I complain to the facility I'm trying to identify the source of this - is it most likely the dub to mini DV, or should I be concerned about the d5 footage? Didn't notice anything in the bay but to be honest I was sitting too far away from the monitor to have noticed it.

 

Any ideas? Also, what factors tend to increase/decrease noise in transfers/dubs?

 

Your wisdom is appreciated! B)

 

bg

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

> Didn't notice anything in the bay but to be honest I was sitting too far away from the

> monitor to have noticed it.

 

Why?

 

Go look at the D5, for a start. If it's OK, then have them redo the dub until you're satisfied with it; check how they're handling it, and how they're dubbing it across. A lot of places don't take DV formats very seriously and you may be getting a nasty composite dub.

 

If it's noisy on the D5, have a look at the camera neg. If it's very thin or very dense, the problem may lie in the amount of correction that's being done post-scan.

 

Phil

[Guest Kai.w]

I just telecined some 35mm to D5 and got a mini DV dub to import into FCP4 to do an offline.  Upon reviewing the mini dv footage, it's very noisey noisy -

 

Before I complain to the facility I'm trying to identify the source of this - is it most likely the dub to mini DV, or should I be concerned about the d5 footage? Didn't notice anything in the bay but to be honest I was sitting too far away from the monitor to have noticed it.

 

bg

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well dubbing straight from d5 to dv should not increase noise. Of course image quality is much worse with dv but not really noticably more noisy.

So I'd recheck the d5 master.

 

-k

[Guest Sean McVeigh]

I just telecined some 35mm to D5 and got a mini DV dub to import into FCP4 to do an offline.  Upon reviewing the mini dv footage, it's very noisey noisy -

 

Before I complain to the facility I'm trying to identify the source of this - is it most likely the dub to mini DV, or should I be concerned about the d5 footage? Didn't notice anything in the bay but to be honest I was sitting too far away from the monitor to have noticed it.

 

Any ideas?  Also, what factors tend to increase/decrease noise in transfers/dubs?

 

Your wisdom is appreciated!  B)

 

bg

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I just had a similar problem with some footage transferred to DV. (when compared side-by-side with an MPEG2 transfer, it was like night and day quality-wise).

What sort of footage is it? If it's pretty contrasty colour stuff, then you've just been introduced to the limitations of the DV codec :) shake hands and promptly run away covering your eyes!! :)

The colour resolution of NTSC 720x480 DV is actually only 180x480!

You can imagine my horror after getting transfers for a scene lit with a red key!

 

Apple's DV display codec doesn't actually smooth the colour space out to 4:2:2 like some others do. Try applying the 4:1:1 colour smoothing effect under the keying video effects menu.

 

If of course, it's something entirely different (noisy, not blocky), then please disregard this advice :)

 

-Sean

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

I'm not sure I'd ever call DVSD blocky. Very occasionally, if you look very, very, VERY closely and compare it with an uncompressed frame, the edges of a macroblock may swim teasingly into view, usually an artifact of a point in the image where things suddenly appear sharper as you go over a quantise-table boundary. Mainly it's just soft-looking. If it's blocky you may be doing something wrong (particularly if you are manipulating interlaced material.)

 

Phil

[Guest Sean McVeigh]

Hi,

 

I'm not sure I'd ever call DVSD blocky. Very occasionally, if you look very, very, VERY closely and compare it with an uncompressed frame, the edges of a macroblock may swim teasingly into view, usually an artifact of a point in the image where things suddenly appear sharper as you go over a quantise-table boundary. Mainly it's just soft-looking. If it's blocky you may be doing something wrong (particularly if you are manipulating interlaced material.)

 

Phil

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

not so much macroblocking as a compresison artifact, but.. well. here's an example of what I'm talking about:

 

 

I would only expect to see stuff like this in fairly monochromatic coloured lighting.

 

-Sean

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

That's neither macroblocks nor a compression artifact, that's the coarse horizontal chroma subsampling inherent to NTSC DV.

 

Phil

[Guest Sean McVeigh]

That's neither macroblocks nor a compression artifact, that's the coarse horizontal chroma subsampling inherent to NTSC DV.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

right... I mentioned this a few posts up. (180x480).

I think my grammar may have been misleading. I didn't mean to imply that it was either macroblocking or a compression artifact.

 

But.. holy bejeesus.. I was pretty ticked off that the lab would even let this tape leave their facility.