Film Fade : Old Movies that turn red

[K Borowski]

Do you know the projected lifespan for estar, Rob? I remember reading one of the Wilhelm studies that said it was practically permanent in proper storage. All the figures I've been able to find were for color stock long discontinued. I'd imagine the base is far more stable than the emulsion. Is the silver image toned too?

 

Of course, I don't think it is even worth our time to explain estar vs. acetate or nitrate.

 

Film is film. It is old technology. Black and white, that's like, even older stuff. Who would want to use B&W anyway. Everything now is color, and it's digital, no grain! :rolleyes:

Edited November 5, 2009 by Karl Borowski

[John Sprung]

On the other hand.. I would find it very interesting to see common life from -say- the year 1500.

 

These links are from another thread:

 

http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/empire/

 

http://www.gridenko.com/pg/index.htm

 

Freddy, I think you might find them interesting. They're color stills from Russia about 100 years ago. The process was sequential B&W separations on glass plate negatives.

 

 

 

 

-- J.S.

[K Borowski]

Of course, silver images are far from permanent either. Without proper fixing/washing at the end of the process, they can last even less time than a color image. Color is much less sensitive to washes at the end, as long as the dyes are stable.

 

Then there is the base material upon which the emulsion is coated. IDK about glass plates, as in your example John, or the relative types of glass and their effects on emulsion, but the film industry has dealt with its fair share of disasters in plastics chosen for base material.

 

I really wonder if the current estar base for release prints was motivated more due to cost And ease of reclamation than image permanence.

 

 

Then there is the emulsion itself, which is basically several layers of JELLO.

 

 

 

I find it hard to believe that there doesn't exist an affordable process to produce dye stability of at least the same level of permanence as some of the classic paintings of the Renaissance.

 

It seems the big problem is even bothering, with the B&W sep. process and the short shelf-life of most actual movie prints.

[Robert Houllahan]

Freddy, I think you might find them interesting. They're color stills from Russia about 100 years ago. The process was sequential B&W separations on glass plate negatives.

 

-- J.S.

 

 

I saw those a while ago someone posted on the TIG about them quite amazing, I worked on a job last year from the state of Massachusetts archive which included allot of kodachrome 16mm from the 1930's (must have been the very beginning of 16mm Kodachrome) it had maybe been projected a few times back then (it was mostly of the building of the reservoir and aqueducts into Boston) the film was in as new condition and the color was stunning.

 

B+W Estar based film properly processed and fixed is on the archivists lists of "permanent" records if stored properly and the list is pretty short.

 

-Rob-