A realistic contract

February 20, 2005

I am busy planning a short for July the 24th and I am currently planning what we need equipment wise from the DP and how to much to pay him.

At the moment I have the following:

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Director of Photography ? Contract

Work from 09:00 through till 20:00 on the 24th of July 2005.

The DOP will supply a camera package by himself with the following minimum specifications:

PAL Video System

Full gain control

Frame rate of 50p

Progressive Scan

Wide-angle lens or extensions

A resolution no lower than 380,000 pixels per image sensor

Tripod

Jib

150 Pound Sterling will be paid for your services, travel expenses not covered.

Wages will be paid via cheque or cash directly after shoot has finished. Full name and position will be placed in the credits.

Signed ________________________________________ (Director of Photography)

Signed ________________________________________ (Producer and Director)

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Is 150 a realistic wage?

Trouble is we can't afford to rent all the equipment, so that's why we need the DOP to have it all or at least to be able to get hold of it.

One thing I was thinking of was to go to a film school, ask to borrow their equipment and in exchange I'll let their students come along to the shoot to see how these films are made.

Oh and by the way if anyone here is interested, and can get access to the London area just let me know. (As long as you can get all of the listed equipment)

Rich Steel · February 20, 2005

Hi Daniel,

I think £150 (GBP) is un-realistic. It would cost that just to hire a basic DVX kit from Axis Films, never mind someones time. Do you have a separate budget for lighting/grip/sound etc? You might be better off convincing a film student who's in their last year to consider DP'ing for you, that way they might bring some college/uni kit to the production at no cost to you.

Good Luck though and as they say...."if you don't ask....you don't get."

Rich Steel

Steadicam Owner/Operator

February 20, 2005

I mean I would shoot it myself, but the disadvantages to that is that ONE I don't have the equipment or any contacts that do, secondly producing, directing, AND DP'ing just doesn't look good on the credits. (They'l last about 5 seconds)

Thing is I really wanted the project to be travel expenses paid only, since as you can still get good results. But I'm hoping with a 150 DP, he should be able to dig up some equipment.

Being a student I can't exactly afford a great deal. Although I do know of one producer who I was talking to and he created a 15 minute short, shot on HD, some good locations that would be very hard to get, a few expensive scenes i.e. when an actor throws a brick through a car window, and a good lighting set-up.

If I can remember correctly he borrowed all the equipment from a school and in exchange took some of their students along to see how films are made.

So really I'm not paying for someone?s time, I'm paying for the privilege to use his equipment. Really he doesn't even have to be that good, I'll be planning pretty much all of the shots myself anyway.

Considering the amount of money I have, I don't want to go over 400/500. And also considering that I'll most likely never see a penny of that again, it's not as though I can sell the film.

Anyway thanks for you help. I'll probably just keep any eye out for film colleges and perhaps give them the offer one day.

Kevin Zanit · February 21, 2005

One point is that (at least in the US) you are the age of a minor, thus you can?t enter into a legally binding contract without your parents signature as well.

I don?t know if the magic number where you are is the same as in the US (18 years old).

Kevin Zanit

Eric Steelberg ASC · February 21, 2005

It's very unrealistic and is not a very comrehensive contract. Any DP would further want details on overtime, copy, and credit as well. In order to get someone who is willing to agree to your terms, you are going to be getting a DP who is so desperate they are willing to do the job. Then you have to wonder why they are so desparate.

In the US, I am constantly hearing from Producers that the worst thing they ever did to save money was hire a DP who has their own gear. In my experience most DPs buy gear because they have trouble getting work without it. I know I'll probably get burned from people by saying that but it tends to be true. Of course there are exceptions. There are many fine DPs who own their gear, but only have done so after they've acheived a level of success.

You will get what you pay (or don't pay) for.

David Mullen ASC · February 21, 2005

The flip side to these arguments is that if the shoot is small enough, is a written contract always necessary? I mean, how many of us have done handshake deals? How many of us have worked for a flat rate? I've even shown up to work on something for a professional acquaintence and not asked what they were paying until the day was over because I was there more or less as a favor.

Not that this is the case since he's (1) dealing with a stranger and (2) there is equipment rental thrown in as well. I'm not an owner-operator, but my main concern would be that the equipment would be fixed or replaced by the production company if broken or stolen during the production. So all of this argues for a contract that spells these things out.

February 21, 2005

The contract is mainly a job description really; the whole point in signing it is for pay reasons. (i.e. they might get scared that I'll do a runner)

Hiring out the equipment from a rental house such as Optex is completely out of the question. Theres no way possible I can afford to do it, but if the DP can get hold of it, it will work out much better.

I realise that if they have the equipment e.t.c. and they are just taking the job because they do have the equipment and they are desperate, that they might not even be a good DP. But it doesn't matter, because I'll be setting up most of the shots myself. (I have it all planned in my head, just got to draw up some storyboards) Aslong as they can point and shoot the damn thing I don't care.

I mean this is only going to be a short, but it's going to be a real good one, I mean 100% skill and effort to make up for the lack of money. I'm hoping to use it for my reel and enter it to all the festivals.

Biggest problem, and I have NO idea how much this is going to cost but there are 2 expensive scenes.

(1) is where a youth walks by a BMW and puts a large scratch across it. I'm hoping to just get a sheet of metal, colour it the same as the car and then do a close up of the sheet of metal being scratched, NOT the car. But then there lies the trouble of finding a BMW or some other expensive car, and then afterwards managing to fit in a time to paint a bit of metal the same colour e.t.c. So I am going to have to think that one through.

(2) is where the youth wraps a rope around his neck, attaches it to a bridge and then jumps of it, and then the rope snaps and he falls into the river. I'm going to have to do some looking into this, stunt doubles and coordinators e.t.c. Now THAT could cost me. (I'm not taking any chances, it HAS to be done the proper and safe way and under supervision of pro's) Unless of course I can change the scene for something else, then again I can't think of anything else that looks quite so dramatic.

Either way, now that I think about it the whole project is going to cost a lot more money.

Anyway you can actually SELL these shorts?

February 21, 2005

but my main concern would be that the equipment would be fixed or replaced by the production company if broken or stolen during the production

I won't include anything in the contract, but if they do want to know I might say that we can't be held responsible for it, or I could take the risk. If it's difference between getting and not getting the equipment, I'll take the risk.

I know things could go horribly wrong, but on the other hand, look at the HUGE chance that says things won't. I mean we will obviously take 120% care of the equipment. I mean, it can't be that bad. People stand just behind the yellow line at a train station, all it would take is for someone to push them and they would be killed. But, people still stand relatively close to the track. It's a risk, but people will still take it.

Rik Andino · February 21, 2005

I won't include anything in the contract, but if they do want to know I might say that we can't be held responsible for it, or I could take the risk. If it's difference between getting and not getting the equipment, I'll take the risk.

I know things could go horribly wrong, but on the other hand, look at the HUGE chance that says things won't. I mean we will obviously take 120% care of the equipment. I mean, it can't be that bad. People stand just behind the yellow line at a train station, all it would take is for someone to push them and they would be killed. But, people still stand relatively close to the track. It's a risk, but people will still take it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The problem comes when you take the risk and then something goes wrong...

That's why planning for the worse is always very useful...

Usually nothing happens but what about when the 5% chance occurs... :unsure:

Rik Andino · February 21, 2005

In the US, I am constantly hearing from Producers that the worst thing they ever did to save money was hire a DP who has their own gear. In my experience most DPs buy gear because they have trouble getting work without it. I know I'll probably get burned from people by saying that but it tends to be true. Of course there are exceptions. There are many fine DPs who own their gear, but only have done so after they've acheived a level of success.

You will get what you pay (or don't pay) for.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well from someone who owns his own gear I quess I'm forced to rebuttal

You're right many of the DP's who own their own gear aren't the greatest

I'm certaintly not {but I don't bill myself as a DP, just cameraman, gaffer, grip...}

But most of them have some knowledge of shooting...

Now let's look at those who hire DP's with their own gear...

Usually these producers are:

Students without alot of money or experience (like Daniel)

Independent producers looking to save cash any whichway...

And folks who can't afford to hire a really good DP

(I'm sure you wouldn't work for many of these productions)

And we have to note that the Producers are just as desperate as the DPs...

So they go to the only people who can service them

A not-so-great DP with his/her own gear who's willing to negoiate...

What else are they gonna do...?

Nobody starts at the top, so don't knock those who are at the bottom right now...

Because somehow it all works out in the end

Because the not-go-great DP gets experience and becomes better

And the desperate producer gets experience and becomes better as well

And in a few years we have:

an experience producer who can afford to hire a Good DP

He's had a long working relationship...

I sometimes use the same argument in dating

Desperate people find desperate people and become happy people

Cause in the end---all you need love! :)

Keith Mottram · February 21, 2005

one thing you do need to consider is wether your going to get insurance. You'll need this if you are borrowing from a college or a rental house. This will be difficult for you to get as your under 18. If your in London I'd try looking at working with a film co-op like four corners (if they still exist) or panico (but you have to do a basic course first) that way you'll find advice, equipment, cheap crew, help with contracts as well as insurance. remember that a contract works both ways and if something goes wrong the contract will possibly make you more not less liable.

Keith

p.s your equipment list includes grip items that a owner/ operator wont have. and minimum sensor? this is far too specific.

Edited February 21, 2005 by keith mottram