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Jay Kelley

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Everything posted by Jay Kelley

  1. For the record Phil, I have NEVER disagreed with your postiion on the numbers concerning RED's chip and output, I'm simply not affected by it the same way you are. Jay
  2. I like the look of film more as well... But I cannot afford it. I also wonder what the simulation factor of RED footage will be for someone that wants to attempt to make it resemble film... We'll see. I grew up watching film, and I doubt I will dismiss it anytime soon. Just cause I cannot afford it does not mean I don't think it's beautiful. Hey Gary, the weekend was ok, but today was pretty wild. Very stressful with work offers, new productions and stuff. Sometimes helps to blow off creative steam. Better now... :) Jay
  3. I would lay you odds, that if Battlestar Galactica were not being shut down after this year, they would be seriously looking at RED. The DP on that show LOVES to push the digital format. He'd have a blast with RED.. But I'd be willing to bet he'd go with 2k scaled in order to get the higher frame rates promised (or heavily suggested) in the future. I believe space will be an issue to some. I could be wrong though.. Jay
  4. RED is not finished, in fact there are a number of accessories and features in the camera that are not yet available. They won't have a major impact on the image (The subject of this thread), but they will affect workflow. A piece of equipment that is not yet out is the viewfinder. I am personally very interested in what this will do. My reservation number is 324 and I am due to have my camera in November. I have to say I am glad to be able to get the camera just late enough for these various issues to be worked out. As for picture quality, it looks wonderful so far, but I have yet to see a seasoned color correction artist get a hold of some perfectly (or near perfect) lit shots to make magic with. There are still so many unanswered questions. The answers are coming, but it's taking some time. Jay
  5. I agree Brad... Those idiots! Jay
  6. Well, seeing as how I am married, and not gay, therefore not trying to get laid.. I think it's safe to say I'm not TOO worried about missing out on the "more critical things" (Or did you mean something else?) :) Seriously, don't you think you are taking this all a little too seriously? You seem to be hung up on the fact that RED is quoting their numbers from a point of view that works for them. I am trying to think of a company that doesn't. The phrase "buyer beware" comes to mind. I believe the reason there are so few worried about the items you are, is cause as many have pointed out, all the sales statements in the world fly out the window once the customer "sees the picture". RED is getting out there, and I dare say in the near future more people will be sold on the camera (Or not sold) based seeing it working before they even get a chance to read the "hype". Continue to complain about this if you wish, I think most of us will just have to see for ourselves. If anything it did start an interesting debate. As for the insulting statements (Which you call "being straight) to Jim and Graeme, I have no respect for that. But then this is the internet and bad posters, like bad comments, are easy to ignore. Or at least make fun of! :) Jay
  7. I just want to say I really have enjoyed this thread so far. I loved the technical aspect of it, and the debate of technical knowlege vs. artistic use. Even the "fighting" has had an air of fun to it (Except for Phil of course, who reminds me of a guy watching a 1000 people in a lake, swimming towards a large pot of gold, as he screams over and over: "Hey, that water's dirty!). I have found all the posts very educational. This forum is really improving. People are finally listening (Except for Phil of course, please see above). :) Good job Stephen you've turned things around (Except for Phil... See above, then look above that again) :) Jay I'm sitting here laughing my butt off cause I know the FLAME that is to come my way. This is very entertaining if you don't take it too seriously. If I tell people I'm 39 and I am really 40, does that make me as bad as Phil says RED is? Gee... I hope not! :)
  8. 90% of this thread has been very interesting and educational. I'd like to thank those participating in the debate about the bayer pattern. I feel I understand it now better than I ever have (That first post on it was excellent). At one point one of you suggested we get to an 8k sensor for true 4k output. Even at this current resolution, we are getting complaints of a "too sharp" or "CGI-like" footage. At the end of the day, when the math is completed, don't you think RED's sharp enough? Current post production limitations, and the sharpness of the image as it stands brings me to the conclusion "For right now, whatever RED is resolution wise, is enough!" As a RED customer and soon-to-be user.. I do understand RED's true OUTPUT resolution now and I would not complain if next to the 4K text on the camera there was a "*" and next to that it says: - Native 4K sensor - Of course, this is true.. no one is debating that the sensor is 4K, they are debating what the camera is outputting. Jay
  9. I hear ya.. And waiting until it's finished is an intelligent approach. Jim himself has told the reservation holders that if they wish, they can hold on getting their camera until all features are made available, and they will not lose their place in line. Also their serial number will be held for them. As for me, well I got a $2,500 credit for buying early so I am not complaining. Jim's a passionate guy.. He can blow his top.. So can I (And I have!). I guess nobody's perfect. Because of this, I am wondering if perhaps it's best bad things are forgotten, and people try to move to a more productive conversation.. I'm kind of beating a dead horse at this point.. You know where I am coming from, and you gave me a good listen. That's all I can ask for. I'll respect whatever you decide to do. have a great weekend Gary! in case I don't get on here before then! Jay
  10. You're very cool to me Gary. I was grateful for the post. But you kind of slammed Jim in your earlier post. If you feel that I way I respect it, but Jim TRIED to move past all this stuff (And even apologized for the marketing, if I recall). I was hoping people would allow the past to remain that way and start talking about cinematography in regards to the RED camera. I was disappointed that you choose to make another dig instead. "Maybe this is what he should have written... Guys sorry for being a moron somethimes... I'm sorry for some of the comments I've made... lets start again and now lets talk... That would be the way to approach it..." Perhaps you were making an honest suggestion. But Jim already make his attempt to settle things and move on, and your post makes it sound like his attempt was not good enough. I think the attempt itself is what matters. IMHO. Your post to me was cool and meant in fun. I was grateful for it, and I still am. I'll respect your other post, I just wish you would have chosen a different track. Thanks Jay
  11. Wow... Well Stephen, you gotta admit, I certainly tried. Looks like some things are not going to change. Apparently you guys seem to think there is some value in keeping an advasarial approach to things. Fair enough. Others seem to think that being right is more important than being heard. Jay
  12. Ok.. David writes it much better than I do. Max, I read Phil's post. I also read Jim's. And now I have read David's. I tend to read what's in front of me. I'm funny that way. My origional comment stands. Good people move past disagreements if they have the character to do so. This is not about a camera, or a belief. It's about character. Jim has demonstrated his by taking a fair amount of abuse on here and still coming back and offering a dialouge on RED. The ball, so to speak, is now in the court of each poster on C.com. I guess now we will just sit back and see what kind of posts Jim gets in return. That will speak volumes. Jay
  13. Phil, Jim just wrote an open post to EVERYONE on this board (Of which you are a part) asking for useful feedback and discussion. The "ball" as it were, is now in your court. Take a POSTIVE attitude here and assume people WANT to hear what you think and give some USEFUL and MEANINGFUL feedback and/or questions. Try real hard to lose the negative comments and/or attitude when you do cause it's hard to take advice from someone you feel is slamming you in some way or another. Come on man.. Here's a chance to get involved. I for one would like to know what you think. Just be nice about it. Ask questions: The engineers at RED are watching this and IF THEY CAN answer your question they will. I know it. Always remember though, it's not Sony or Panasonic.. It's 20 or so guys in a building running their asses off to keep up with everyone's demands. A lot of times the answer is "Uh, we're not sure yet.. We have an idea, but want to get it more developed before we say so we don't change our answer 200 times and look like idiots". Jay
  14. Mr. McClurg, Does it matter if people change their minds or not? I remember something David said a long time ago (in internet terms anyway) Something like: "The technical stuff is nice, but in the end, what does the image LOOK LIKE!?" I would think, seeing as how the camera is out there, and there is no doubt we are seeing more footage than we did a few weeks ago, that we should all be able to decide if the images captured by RED are nice enough to tell a story with. Perhaps that's what you were speaking of, those that don't like RED will hate the images regardless of what they look like, and those that do like RED will love them. I have to say though, as one from "fanboy" crowd. We are looking at the images, and we are not simply "loving them" for the sake of it. In fact we have seen some things that concern us a bit, and we have voiced those concerns to the engineers at RED. Believe it or not, as Jim will tell you, we are, in fact, a very paticular crowd.. We just make our suggestions from a positive approach rather than chooseing a more "insulting route". We find things get done faster that way.. But that's just us. Regardless of all this, I believe I see your point. Jay
  15. Speaking of 3-D: "A quantum leap in 3D production and stereographic post-production from a tapeless workflow, resulted in a successful 3D test shoot and screening on Saturday, September 1st . Producers Steve Gibby and Kenneth Corben of GibCor, teamed up with their 3D production partners Max Penner and Tim Thomas at Paradise FX to produce one of the first stereo 3D shoots originated with RED 4K cameras. GibCor provided RED camera #8 and their associate, Billy Summers, provided RED camera #13. Both were literally ?out of the box? from the first 25 RED cameras released on August 31st. The team shot a 4K 3D dual camera test, and captured REDCODE RAW to two RED 8 GB compact flash cards. The production alliance between GibCor and PFX has been in development on their RED 4K 3D projects since February in anticipation of the cameras? release this year. ?The results of this first RED 4K 3D shoot will enable us to bring great stories, shot in stereo 3D, to audiences like never before,? said producer Steve Gibby. The RED 4K cameras were fitted with a pair of RED compact zooms (18-50mm) and mounted to the Paracam. The Paracam is a 3D camera system that employs a beam splitter and has digital control of the inter-axial and convergent positioning of each of the RED ONE cameras. By Noon the team was viewing 3D content, originated from a tapeless 4K workflow. The 4K 3D post workflow was seamless thanks to the SCRATCH system and Lucas Wilson from Assimilate. The 4K REDCODE RAW .r3d files were imported from CF cards into a beta version of REDCINE running on an Intel based Mac system. The left and right eye files were de-bayered from 4K RAW to 2K files then imported to SCRATCH as .dpx files. SCRATCH allowed for ?plug and play? into Paradise?s dual projection system for quick stereo 3D playback. After the screening, veteran 3D stereographer Max Penner said, ?To take 2 cameras that have never been tested out of the box, then shoot and project 3D all in one day, is almost unheard of. All done with no umbilical cables, tape decks or digitizing. This changes everything!? Paradise FX and GibCor are in negotiations with several major studios regarding this technology and it?s implementation in the motion picture industry. This is the first of a succession of stereo 3D tests with the RED ONE camera. Ongoing tests will help to define a workflow to apply to future 3D productions in both Large Format Film and Digital Theatrical Releases. The RED ONE camera has a small 3D form factor with a high resolution at a decent price, making it highly promising for future 3D films."
  16. For the record, I am a RED "Fanboy" as some of you have called it.. And I must say, it's an honor. I've been following RED since they started talking about it in Dec '05 and I had a reservation not long after. The camera sounded amazing, and the deposit was refundable, so it was no big risk on my part. During my time with RED I have been allowed to have an active hand in the design of the camera, I have seen suggestions I have made actually put into the system.. To me, that's very cool. I've made a lot of friends since we all have a passion for shooting in some form or another, and we all saw RED as a way to up our current respective games. It has not always been smooth sailing, but it's been eventful. Now 25 of the cameras are "into the wild" and friends I have gotten to know the last two years or so (Including Jim Jannard, our fearless leader) have taken flight to shoot anything and everything they can. Jim himself took off to Indy to shoot his beloved drag races. I suspect, it was there years ago, where this idea, and Jim's personal frustration with his other camera (whichever one that was) is what gave birth to the concept that now sits before us. Personally I think it's really cool that the first thing the owner of a camera company does after reaching a major milestone, is take HIS camera back to his favorite subject matter, and spend the day shooting. It was also neat to see that his first insticnt after shooting was to run to a computer and upload some screen caps to his fellow RED Geeks on REDUSER and talk about shutter speeds, monitors, capture settings, etc. Jim shot some nice stuff and it was cool to see. Let me tell you, we all had a blast. It's what we're all about... We're shooters, most of us anyway. We love to put a good image together, or tell a story, or even shoot the family pet! As long as we have a camera, and there's a subject out there, we want to shoot! There are a lot of opinions about this and that.. That's fine, I'm just happy the camera is done and now we can all get moving (25 of us have already, those lucky bastards). My time will come in November, and believe you me, I will be ready. RED's journey as a camera, and a company is just beginning. Jim and the boys are getting feedback 25 times over now. Most of the testing up to now has been PROJECT specific. In other words, the people doing the shooting were doing so in order to shoot something specific. Now that the REDBOYS have it' we will be CAMERA specific for a while.. In other words, we wanna push it until it breaks in order to see what we can do.. We want to play with all the extras just to see what they can do. Some of it will be ugly, some of it will be pretty.. We don't care anymore cause we HAVE the camera. We'll make it what we want. As for picture quality, 35mm, 4k or 3k , Bayer pattern or aspirin... Don't care. Is the picture good looking when lit correctly? Does it offer me more than other cameras in this price range? Can I up my game with it? Will there be a sequel to the Transformers movie? Those are the questions that matter to me. So far I like all the answers. Everyone must do what they enjoy.. You guys talk on this site about what interests you, I have read a lot of it and sometimes it gets upsetting. It's no fun to be insulted indirectly. But in the end, what matters, what REALLY matters is the camera, and that it works. It does.. It REALLY works, and it's just starting. I'm a REDHEAD, a FANBOY, and I am honored to be one. I have made good friends, and I am part of something special. It's what I believe. Have a good weekend all. Jay
  17. Oh God... Not another one... Here we go again... What is it with people? Jay
  18. YOU SCUM!! HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT!! SHOOT FILM!??!! I'D RATHER POUND MY TESTICLES FLAT WITH A WOODEN MALLET!!! Hehhehe... Just kidding.. Richard, I'm in the same boat as Ken, from a cost perspective, I do a little better with digital cinema than I do with film.. In Short I simply cannot afford it.. Bummer I know. If it means anything, all my favorite movies were shot on film!! (Ok maybe a couple were shot on video) I'm pretty sure that my RED will last a few years. Jim Jannard has promised that he desined the camera so parts that are improved can be changed out without buying an entire new thing.. I hope that stays true. Jay
  19. Hey Ken, I am in the same boat, I tend to use a SDX900 for most creative work, but that will change when my RED is ready to ship. With the announcement of the 4k projectors, and the 4k monitors, it's clear that Jannard is in this industry to make some serious bucks. Truth is sir, I'm tired. The constant shift and flow of technology can be exhausting for those of us who just want to tell stories. I'm glad RED made it out of the gate in one piece.. Should be a fun ride. I was VERY excited about Apple's support and the introduction of COLOR Jay
  20. Well Ken, While one of your older posts got me a little angry, this one gets respect. I cannot say how dissappointed I am that I am not at NAB to see the short film Peter Jackson made.. More cause I think it's very cool a high end director is making a short film.. I was bummed that the music Universal donated will keep it off the web until they remix it.. But a lot of friends called me and said the movie looked amazing.. That's a good thing. As for the film vs. video debate. Truth is I do not feel qualified to enter into it. I have used much less film than video so I cannot compare the differences very well. My feeling is simple, I live video. Do you like film? The go for it and I'll help you! Neither is right or wrong... Just different. Pick what works. Jay
  21. Jay Kelley

    Quiet...

    Just for fun, I went back and read all of your posts you have left on this Forum.. Almost every one of them were involved in some sort of debate/fight, or an opinion in which you were reminding everyone why you were right and others were wrong.. Even offering to have a fight with some guy at NAB or telling him to shut the f*ck up. Very impressive.. Not. Quite a history of combative, and somewhat usless posts. Jim's moved on Ken.. The camera is about to enter the world, and something tells me the hot-head, in-your-face, always right, critisism from certain people (like you) on this board will not make the smallest dent into RED's success one way or the other. Besides, I look at losing customers such as yourself as a step in the right direction. Guys like you are the ones always bitching to customer service anyway. The camera will do well.. It's almost ready to go, and in spite of your bitching and moaning about everything, they will most likely be pretty successful.. Which means everything you had to say was for the most part... Worthless.... Big surprise.. :) Sorry David, but the only thing worse than not getting long terms relationships, are having having them with the wrong people. Sometimes it's about knowing who to work with and who to avoid. I think Ken is one of those people you were speaking of.. A review of his writings will show this. Jay Don't worry Ken, I won't be calling you... :)
  22. Jay Kelley

    Quiet...

    I think he will. And to be honest, I think he already has.. We'll know how much he has at NAB. I think the real trick with this camera, are three words: NO MOVING PARTS. I think this has a major impact on maintence, warrenty, etc. For me the trick has always been about what RED does with itself AFTER the camera comes out. I am not at the level you are, but I work with a lot of the same people. When my Lectrosconics mic goes I expect to make a phone call and get things shipping overnight at that moment. It's why I went with that company even though there are cheaper ones around. I have never understood how Jannard will keep his back end customer service flowing well with such low pricing. However, he's got the camera, viewfinder, drives, rails, etc. Perhaps he's more volume oriented than we give him credit for.. Honestly it's out of my league to understand the details of HIS company. What I do know, is that so far I am really impressed with his sense of design and the level of the team he has working with him. Because the camera is 90% software, and that damn sensor, most any improvements can be upgraded later. I am told even the sensor block can me swaped out by RED. We'll see...I am hopeful and excited. As for the film vs. video deal, I don't care.. Never have never will. As a shooter I have always evnied you film guys with your large format lenses and smal DOF. Not to mention your ability to do some beautiful color correction that in my video world, at least up to now, has been difficult or impossible. If I had the money for film, I'd use it. I don't so I pray RED will give me some of the visual possibilities that you guys take for granted. Jay
  23. Jay Kelley

    Quiet...

    "Ignore them"? You're asking a lot David, but it's a good piece of advice nonetheless. I am a fanboy of RED. As for having nothing critical to say about the camera? There are hundreds and hundreds of posts by me saying things I don' t like and offering ideas. But I did it on a site Jim was more active in, that's only smart. I never complained for the sake of it, I wanted the damn thing changed!! And at times, when it made sense, it was.. That's cool. The big difference here (and you already know this) is that my critisism was done with the goal of assisting RED build a better camera for ME to use. And that was evident in every post. I said what I liked, and what I did not like. It's not the post most of the time.. It's the tone. Fanboys of RED were the most critical of all, since we felt we were assistant designers.. The camera is being built FOR US after all. I have no doubt, feedback and suggestions from the likes of you are read carefully. I also have no doubt that RED has already consulted a number of people in your field. I am not employeed by them, nor do I have special information, just using a little commone sense. If you go to REDUSER you will see even today we are making requests and asking for changes. We are the hardest group to please. We are "FANS" because we like the concept of the camera, and 80% of what we asked for is in it. I fully realize that not everyone on here is the same, and other forums on this site are EXTREMELY helpful. You have helped me a few times and I thank you for that. Jay
  24. Jay Kelley

    Quiet...

    I have followed RED. I was in the "early" group of reservation holders, and have watched CML from day one. While I don't know Jim personally, he and I have written, and he has always been kind. That said, I also agree with David, but understand Jim completely. This board was amazing in it's cruelty and malice for a long time. NO one that liked RED was safe, not even me. David is correct about what "should" be done, but I also know that extremely successful people can be competitive to a fault, and even a little vengeful. And of course, they take things VERY PERSONALLY. It's what drives them, its THEIR concept, THEIR idea, and when you diss it, you diss them. David, I think Jim will wipe all the arguements aside, but I would not doubt he take a moment here and there to remind those people who took a lot of time being degrading and insulting, that they are in fact #1: Idiots, and #2 wrong.. Here's the proof (insert camera here).. In all of their complaints, and chest thumping, they backed the wrong horse and it looks like in one week they will look like idiots. If I were them, I'd steer clear of the RED booth this time around. Is it good business? Not really. Will it make a difference to RED's bottom line?: If the camera works? Hell no! I always find it humorous when we give Billionares business advice.. If I was a betting man, I'd bet Jim knows a lot more about business than most if not all of us put together. That was the mistake so many made, they judged the potential of the camera on it's technical points. And they judged Jim using little or no research as to the various businesses he's involved in. I kept hearing "the sunglass guy". A little research turns up a lot more than that. I learned long ago that good equipment is never about the equipment, it's about the track record of the people who build it. I'm glad Jim's earned the right to get his pound of flesh because it's in his personality to do so.. And that same personality is what drove him to build the damn camera in spite of harsh insults. And I need that damn camera. Now I assume we will see people quietly shift the arguements from complaints and doubts about the camera to complaints about RED as a company. Bottom line, this is not over. As for me, the more the complainers write, the happier I get! Jay This board has taught me something... I have taken some time and gone back and printed off a buttload of posts that insulted, complained, and attacked Jim and his dream in a disrespectful manner, not to mention those of us "fanboys" who backed him. When you chase a dream, you must prepare for people like this to stand in your way. When I tell my son this when he is old enough, he will ask "what people Daddy?". I can pull out these posts, and say "people like this". Never listen Joshua, anyone who tries to look smart or knowlegeable at the expense of someone else's dreams and/or emotions is not to be respected. Just ignore them and keep moving forward.
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